#arpnetworks 2012-08-08,Wed

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Who	What	When
up_the_irons	:)	[00:00]
mercutio	do you still have to specify ip unnumbered these days?	[00:00]
up_the_irons	now, if i assign the .0 to another router (but same vlan), for redundancy let's say, then have the host configured to have .0 as a lower priority default route, this could present some level of gateway redundancy on /30 links, something that is somewhat difficult (VRRP and HSRP don't support /30's "out of the box", need tricks) mercutio: as of IOS 12.0, it is the default	[00:02]
mercutio	up_the_irons: i have a diff idea :)	[00:02]
up_the_irons	mercutio: do tell :)	[00:02]
mercutio	can you get kvm to restrict ip's? and then just use /24s and vrrp?	[00:03]
up_the_irons	mercutio: so a shared vlan type setup (which I think you're getting at) is not feasable (counter to my ideals of customer segregation and network design)	[00:04]
arenlor	Who the hell needs a 16 TB file, or a 1EB file system? btrfs is even more insane, 16 EB for both.	[00:05]
mercutio	up_the_irons: ok.. so it's partially about being shared on one network/	[00:05]
up_the_irons	arenlor: insane	[00:05]
mercutio	segment	[00:05]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Do you even have 16 TB total?	[00:05]
mercutio	well the other way to go is you take over the ip completely with a different router if the router goes down	[00:06]
up_the_irons	mercutio: well, two things: 1) majority of customers have only 1 IP (/30), 2) VRRP or HSRP aren't exactly noted for their success stories. It is better for the client / host to make the proper routing desicision then to move some "magic" IP between separate switches	[00:06]
mercutio	because i think it's a different story using 4 ip addresses on a /30 then using a /31 with 2 addresses.	[00:06]
up_the_irons	arenlor: 16TB total of what?:)	[00:07]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Disk space.	[00:07]
mercutio	well what i hate most about vrrp is when things half work	[00:07]
up_the_irons	arenlor: on all my hosts?	[00:07]
mercutio	because it's going out one router and coming back through the other.	[00:07]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Yeah, just wondering if ext4 could create a file larger than all your hosts could hold.	[00:08]
mercutio	but vrrp does work reasonably often.. it's just when it doesn't it's more complicated.	[00:08]
up_the_irons	mercutio: that's actually not too big a problem; the bigger problem is the IP moving around	[00:08]
mercutio	oh? i've never found that to be a problem?	[00:08]
up_the_irons	mercutio: routing is asynchronous anyway, so it doesn't matter if traffic comes in one way and leaves another	[00:08]
mercutio	up_the_irons: i just mean when things break it makes it harder to debug but all redundant solutions are harder to debug	[00:08]
up_the_irons	arenlor: in total, across all hosts, i have about 104TB of space; but that couldn't be used for a single file obviously... mercutio: yeah	[00:09]
mercutio	up_the_irons: you're using local storage?	[00:09]
up_the_irons	mercutio: yep	[00:10]
mercutio	mm	[00:10]
arenlor	up_the_irons: True, at least makes me a little more sane to know that you have more space than ext4 can take up in one file. Btrfs would still think that's a tiny file.	[00:10]
mercutio	how often do you have router failures? arenlor: just because things "can" scale doesn't mean they will	[00:10]
up_the_irons	arenlor: lol	[00:11]
arenlor	mercutio: I've only ever seen one I think, and it was for only a short bit.	[00:11]
mercutio	i would be very hestitant about having a 100tb file system with btrfs hell i'm hesistant about having a 1tb file system with btrfs	[00:11]
arenlor	mercutio: Try 16 EB	[00:11]
mercutio	cos i think in some ways automatic failover isn't really necssary but having backups of router config being able to get something up and going quickly etc is handy	[00:11]
up_the_irons	mercutio: i've never had a router failure, but i know one day it is inevitable. i am preparing for that possibility. i hate single points of failure	[00:12]
mercutio	up_the_irons: well so do i :) .. but i think host failure is more likely and while you're using local storage...	[00:12]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Have you looked at netflix's monkey to see if it's usable for you?	[00:13]
up_the_irons	mercutio: well, yes, and so i've already prepared for that :)	[00:13]
mercutio	there's a higher chance of a protracted outage from that then router. ok :)	[00:13]
up_the_irons	arenlor: i only just heard of it haven't really looked further	[00:13]
mercutio	not trying to tell you what to do. just giving my input :)	[00:14]
up_the_irons	chaos monkey or something?	[00:14]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Yep	[00:14]
up_the_irons	mercutio: we have failures in local storage frequently, but it is a RAID 10, so the drive gets replaced. No big deal, that problem is already solved.	[00:14]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Why 10?	[00:15]
up_the_irons	i watched a talk by a guy from Edgecast; they have 6000 servers. he says they have a HD failure every 12 hours :)	[00:15]
mercutio	well as long as you don't have two disks die at once :)	[00:15]
up_the_irons	arenlor: speed and more drives can fail mercutio: sure, of course	[00:15]
mercutio	up_the_irons: i wonder how many memory stick failures they get	[00:15]
up_the_irons	yeah i've only had 1	[00:15]
mercutio	memory stick failures can be confusing though	[00:16]
up_the_irons	spinning things die a lot faster... ;)	[00:16]
mercutio	yeh are you using sata disks?	[00:16]
arenlor	Heh, this is how efficient RAID 2 is: 1 − 1/n ⋅ log2(n-1)	[00:17]
mercutio	huh? what's raid 2? and those don't show oh hamming codes :)	[00:17]
arenlor	mercutio: You don't know what RAID 2 is?	[00:19]
mercutio	well it's not exactly common but i found wikipedia entry ;)	[00:19]
arenlor	mercutio: True. I have to go lookup what exactly RAID 1+0 does, but I know RAID 2. I think something is wrong with me.	[00:19]
mercutio	arenlor: heh heard of raidz-2?	[00:20]
arenlor	mercutio: Nope.	[00:20]
mercutio	basically 4 disks plus 2 partiy or such but any two disks can die	[00:20]
up_the_irons	mercutio: yeah, sata	[00:21]
mercutio	up_the_irons: re4s?	[00:21]
arenlor	mercutio: Nice.	[00:21]
up_the_irons	mercutio: nah, too expensive and i've had just as many failures with so-called "enterprise" drives than regular drives, so i stay with the regular ones	[00:22]
mercutio	up_the_irons: ahh.. i've been using diff disks and i've noticed that some disks are a lot faster with raid 10 type configs than others err or some are slower but it's not the same as desktop benchmarks	[00:23]
up_the_irons	yeah mercutio: which are you finding are the fastest?	[00:24]
mercutio	umm slowest is ST32000641AS WD2002FAEX-0 is faster i'm not sure what fastest are :) zfs is kind of special in that it'll push more load to faster disks though err i mean "idle" disks like it's not strictly balanced	[00:24]
up_the_irons	ah	[00:27]
mercutio	but yeh the seagates seem wlower that's an older seagate though older wd too i haven't tried in raid yet but in desktop usage the new seagates are fast the new ones are 1tb/platter think is it's about seek time and stuff more when you do lots of small tranfers that happens with raid those seagates are from when the flooding happened and limited availability of hard-disks	[00:27]
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up_the_irons	yeah time for a break up_the_irons wanders off	[00:33]
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ryk	up_the_irons: around? got your message from last night the VPS was indeed booted, and vnc never responded when it is shut down, i get a 'connection refused' which is a slightly different scenario rebooting did solve the problem, vnc is now back up, but I was hoping to not have to resort to that, as I lost my console session.	[09:22]
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mikeputnam	anyone know roughly how much disk it would take to apt-mirror the ubuntu 12.04 updates locally?	[11:51]
arenlor	mikeputnam: No idea, but I think that up_the_irons has/was working on a local mirror.	[11:56]
mikeputnam	found it https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Mirrors/ ~600GB	[11:56]
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up_the_irons	mikeputnam: yeah, 600GB is about the size of our Ubuntu mirror ryk: see the "Some things to note" section here: http://support.arpnetworks.com/kb/vps/out-of-band-management ryk: you might have had another session (stale) open somewhere else	[12:44]
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ryk	interesting. what if it was on my computer? as in, the original session was on my computer, and i rebooted; shouldn't that have reset it?	[13:22]
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toddf	ryk: oob connects to a tcp socket the kvm instance that is the equivalent of 'qemu' running on his system. ryk: the only time you get disconnected is if you poweroff your kvm instance egg on face sorry up_the_irons I forgot you have the older libvirt that can't do the 'system_reset' equivalent just yet so if you reboot your guest os, your oob will survive if you hard poweroff your vps, your oob should die and force you to reconnect	[14:16]
arenlor	.clear heh oops	[14:19]
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redsteal	hum, My server ping time out 4 time tonight is there any reason	[19:54]
milki	i havent had any problems	[19:54]
mhoran	Seems like some network issues, but I'm not having any troubles anymore. Possibly routing, I only lost connection from home.	[19:54]
redsteal	it's ok now but 13h30 to 14h35 (GMT -5) got 4 connectivity drop	[19:55]
fink	i lost connection too must be sunflares or thor is sucking up our bandwidth	[20:00]
mercutio	heh i was wondering where you were connecting from redsteal but you're connecting frmo your vps i see :)	[20:11]
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up_the_irons	redsteal: what is your vnc host? (so i know what host you are on) think I found it, kvr25 No issues on that host tonight	[20:35]
jlgaddis	< redsteal> hum, My server ping time out 4 time tonight is there any reason <-- yeah, up_the_irons got bored this evening, went into the datacenter, and was randomly unplugging cables and plugging them back in to see if anyone would notice seriously, though, the issues could have been at any hop in between you and your vps	[20:50]
mercutio	jlg: mhoran had issue too? but they both may be using hte same isp or path according to nanog bell canada had a big issue recently and peering between glbx and level 3 broke mzima seems to send a lot of traffic through glbx... and level 3 are huge.. so if your isp is using level 3 that could explain it (and mzima don't directly peer with level 3.. but peer through glbx) i thought level3 owned glbx though and i do mean gblx not glbx mm reading furhter http://www.bgpmon.net/bell-leak.txt bell canada did a route leak.. which included arp networks http://seclists.org/nanog/2012/Aug/231	[20:55]
jlgaddis	my monitoring systems didn't report any issues reaching my vps'	[21:10]
mercutio	jlg: i didn't notice any issues too	[21:11]
jlgaddis	(my own instance of opsview -- through level3 in chicago -- and pingdom -- through multiple carriers throughout the world) arp has several different prefixes, though, so maybe they only hijacked a portion of them (and not the ones my vps' are on)	[21:11]
mercutio	it was all of them it seems to be because arp have transit with tata oh hangon arp doens't have transit with tata do they? i thought it was trit they had transit with but basically the gist is bell canada was advertising when they shouldn't have been and some people may have got a preferred route through them	[21:12]
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jlgaddis	jlgaddis goes to catch up on nanog real quick	[21:13]
mercutio	which is what route filters are foor limited by bell canada and yo'll find the thread	[21:13]
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jlgaddis	nod flipped over to my nanog folder and that thread is right on top	[21:18]
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arenlor	Other than massive ping times, can anyone tell me what could be causing this traceroute: http://pastebin.com/ip8ata5y because I'm wondering if my Internet is about to disappear on me.	[21:35]
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jlgaddis	latency/congestion in the ATM network between your CPE and your ISP's BRAS ? or solar flares	[21:42]
mercutio	you could be uploading a file arenlor	[21:44]
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mercutio	it's normal for adsl connections to ping upwards of 1 second when uploading due to "bufferbloat"	[21:44]
arenlor	mercutio: Nope, that's just what my Internet does to me.	[21:44]
mercutio	well there's extreme congestion is there any open wifi? bittorrent?	[21:44]
arenlor	mercutio: Nope and nope.	[21:45]
mercutio	is your sync rate ok?	[21:45]
arenlor	mercutio: Yep. It just is really shitty service. I've seen it drop to ~80kbps	[21:45]
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mercutio	what's your sync rate? are there errors on the adsl statistics?	[21:46]
jlgaddis	did you watch the video of the nanog presentation i linked to a few days ago?	[21:46]
arenlor	jlgaddis: I downloaded, but have not had time to watch it yet.	[21:47]
mercutio	jlg: what's the presentation on?	[21:47]
jlgaddis	i've made all my colleagues watch it a while back and suggest it to others all the time	[21:47]
mercutio	jlg: is it worse during the evening?	[21:47]
jlgaddis	mercutio: traceroute	[21:47]
mercutio	i think the biggest problem with traceroute is you need to do it frmo both sides and with udp and tcp and icmp now days :) well sometimes	[21:48]
arenlor	Heh, seems there are tons of errors with my dsl.	[21:48]
mercutio	arenlor: what's your atteunation? attenuation? downstream and upstream if it's like > 60db you are likely to have shit connectivity	[21:48]
arenlor	mercutio: Not sure where to find it.	[21:49]
mercutio	what kind of modem is it?	[21:49]
arenlor	Shitty?	[21:49]
mercutio	what moedl? model a whole lot of them have mock interfaces on the net	[21:49]
jlgaddis	lol	[21:49]
mercutio	or docuemntaiton so i can tell you where to go :)	[21:49]
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mercutio	you could also try telnet lots of broadcom chipsets have telnet open admin/admin	[21:50]
arenlor	mercutio: It says Sagecom SE567 on it, but no model number.[21:50] <mercutio> adsl info	[21:50]
mercutio	that's a model number	[21:50]
arenlor	It's one of the ISP provided things.	[21:50]
mercutio	are you with bell canada?	[21:50]
arenlor	mercutio: Frontier.	[21:51]
mercutio	no idea who that is but i serached that modem and it came up with bell canada who had massive issues today :)	[21:51]
arenlor	mercutio: 4th largest telecom in the US	[21:51]
mercutio	oh ok :) i'm in new zealand...	[21:51]
arenlor	mercutio: I know	[21:52]
mercutio	ok just saying i'm not completely ignorant just not aware of stuff there so much	[21:52]
arenlor	If it was Verizon, AT&T, or CenturyLink you'd have heard of it.	[21:52]
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mercutio	http://www.broadbandreports.com/comments/1677?1=1&p=7 i know comcast, verizon, at&t dunno centurylink	[21:53]
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mercutio	verizon fios seems common? well with geeks i suppose :)	[21:53]
arenlor	mercutio: Third largest telecom. Those three are the surviving Baby Bells.	[21:53]
mercutio	i'm not having luck finding much is it the same as gigaset? http://www.wikidevi.com/wiki/Sagemcom_SE567_(Frontier_Communications) i think you had typo :) oh god it's TI chipset	[21:54]
arenlor	arenlor is lightly dyslexic. Got a clue what OAM end-to-end is?	[21:55]
mercutio	ok do you have atm statistics?	[21:56]
arenlor	Yep	[21:57]
mercutio	ok pastebin me them?	[21:58]
arenlor	http://pastebin.com/bSZf1a8K	[21:59]
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mercutio	it really doesn't line up very well	[22:00]
arenlor	mercutio: How so?	[22:01]
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jlgaddis	click "raw" oh, doesn't help 88520 rx errors?	[22:01]
mercutio	arenlor: the columns to the words 88520 errors isn't bad enough to explain his problems he's been doing a lot of packets also look how high his transmit is compared to receive i mean he's doing more transmitting than receiving aren: you might have a virus are you using windows?	[22:02]
up_the_irons	mercutio: HGC (Hutchinson Global Communications) also leaked routes, for months actually. I tried to contact them, as well as Internode, but to no avail. I actually had to shut off their peer. Was causing very bad routing from AU -> US through Internode	[22:03]
arenlor	mercutio: Yeah, it could be that Freenet isn't being fair.	[22:03]
mercutio	arenlor: freenet?	[22:04]
arenlor	mercutio: The Freenet Project	[22:04]
mercutio	up_the_irons: curious that internode are hard to contact arenlor: do you do soemthign with them? well you need to stop uploading as much arenlor is the gist.	[22:04]
up_the_irons	mercutio: Internode isn't hard, it is HGC that is hard	[22:05]
arenlor	mercutio: I have it limited to < 20k up	[22:05]
mercutio	up_the_irons: oh right i know nothing about HGC arenlor: just disable it and see if problem goes away	[22:05]
arenlor	mercutio: I've tried, totally shut down the computer it's on, didn't help.	[22:06]
mercutio	up_the_irons: you don't have transit through TATA do you? arenlor: how many computers do you have?	[22:06]
arenlor	http://i48.tinypic.com/34g9buo.jpg should line it up better.	[22:06]
mercutio	dude you have 384 kbit upload that sucks :) well i'm sure you know that sucks i wouldn't upload anything with 384kbit	[22:06]
arenlor	mercutio: Depends on how you count. 3 computers, 2 cells, plus a verizon wireless extender.	[22:07]
up_the_irons	mercutio: no Tata	[22:07]
mercutio	one of the problems with adsl is that if you have lots of small packets it can easily use up more than the kbit rate	[22:07]
arenlor	mercutio: You're wrong, I have 384kbit MAX.	[22:07]
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mercutio	also when it says 384 that includes overhead	[22:07]
arenlor	The other day it was at a nice strong 8kbit.	[22:08]
mercutio	arenlor: you are likely to get about 38k/sec max arenlor: can you hook up just one computer?	[22:08]
arenlor	mercutio: I'm not sure what you mean by hook up one computer?	[22:08]
mercutio	you've done like 3.7 gig of upload in 10 days. 1 megabit can do 300 gig in a month	[22:09]
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mercutio	(rough rule of thumb) it's actually a bit higher	[22:09]
arenlor	I wonder how much of that is that it's our cell tower too.	[22:09]
mercutio	so that's like doing around 10 gig of upload a month so 1/30th of 1 megabit which means your average utilisation is about 1/10th of you rbandwidth	[22:09]
arenlor	mercutio: MAX bandwidth.	[22:10]
mercutio	do you have a static ip?	[22:10]
arenlor	mercutio: Nope, and every time you've seen my disconnect in here (~1/4hrs) I get a new one.	[22:11]
mercutio	i'd suggest running smokeping oh bah just change isp's :) if you have a linux host at hoem you could run it from home generally speaking if it's your area/dslam being congested	[22:11]
arenlor	mercutio: Yeah, speaking of, if next Wednesday 16:30 ET passes and I'm not happily annoucing the comcast guy is here, turn on the news that evening to learn about the destruction my wrath brings on them.	[22:12]
mercutio	aand what someone said about atm ould be correct then it'll be worse during the evening	[22:12]
arenlor	mercutio: My tower is Linux, and I duel boot.	[22:12]
mercutio	yeh the thing is you want to not pay your bill :) based upon them not providing you a reasonable level of service	[22:13]
arenlor	mercutio: I'm in America.	[22:13]
mercutio	you can't do that there?	[22:13]
arenlor	If it's on most of the time, they have fulfilled their contract.	[22:13]
mercutio	don't you have any "reasonable" expectations? like 8kbit isn't broadband web sites not loading etc	[22:14]
arenlor	mercutio: I do. They just have no requirement to meet them.	[22:14]
mercutio	i meant in law :) i dunno	[22:14]
arenlor	mercutio: That's what I mean, they have no legal requirements.	[22:15]
mercutio	there have been court cases here over packet loss :/ but it's a bit diff for an individual	[22:15]
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mercutio	well yeh comcast may fix it	[22:15]
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mercutio	but yeah 384kbit upload will suck at the best of times well kind of dropbox will screw it badly web browsing will screw it uploading files etc	[22:16]
arenlor	mercutio: up_the_irons can provide shit service and all we get a choice to do is leave. Most ISPs in America require you to be in a contract, so you can't leave.	[22:16]
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mercutio	hmm	[22:17]
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mercutio	i hate contracts i had a year long contract for dsl once and it started sucking	[22:17]
up_the_irons	if service is shitty, even with a contract, you can always cancel for non-performance	[22:17]
arenlor	mercutio: only one year?	[22:17]
mercutio	although it was near the end of the year i bitched and it got faster well it didn't quite go like that	[22:17]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Yeah but I only get "up to" so much.	[22:18]
mercutio	basically there are two ways for isp's to get DSL here with different handover/uplink and one of them sucks and the other is good and i got them to move me to the good one by specificalyl asking for it and most people would probably not know about hta that	[22:18]
arenlor	I'm basically just happy right now that the phone can ring without taking down the Internet.	[22:18]
mercutio	but like most providers in this country resell dsl and all had the same issues arenlor: do you have a master filter? oh bah you're moving to cable anyway aren't you my dsl disconnected today :(	[22:19]
arenlor	mercutio: Yes mercutio: That sucks, what happened?	[22:19]
mercutio	and it wouldn't resync well it resynced but pppoa didn't come up i rebooted it and it came back up but generally dsl is ok here about 8 to 9 msec latency	[22:19]
arenlor	mercutio: I called in and after a few hours they did something on their end, including something outside the house, that fixed the issue.	[22:20]
mercutio	i have smokeping of it	[22:20]
arenlor	I'm not even sure what in the hell could cause your phone line ringing to take down your DSL.	[22:21]
mercutio	hmm it's around 9 msec atm arenlor: there's mre than one rason that can happen i forget though	[22:21]
arenlor	mercutio: I had good filters on.	[22:22]
mercutio	yeh there's another reason to too when i got my line hooked up my phone didn't work but my net did and it didn't ring lots of werid stuff can happen then found out it did ring but with no noise	[22:22]
arenlor	mercutio: That's really screwed up, but at least you had the Internet.	[22:22]
mercutio	oh it was dead copmletely at first yeh then the internet went away and i'm like wtf then someone turned up bah my attenuation is still higher than it should be though which blocks me getting vdsl atm probably so i'm stuck with shitty 16/1 internet	[22:22]
arenlor	16/1?	[22:23]
mercutio	16 megabit down 1 megabit up	[22:24]
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arenlor	arenlor sticks knife in mercutio and takes his internet.	[22:24]
mercutio	hahaha yeh i dunno comcast is pretty fast isn't it?	[22:24]
arenlor	I'll have 30 down, not sure what up, but the next lower was 4 up. They sadly don't have the 105/105 out here :'(	[22:25]
mercutio	tbh 10 an d20 megabit isn't that diff for just web browsing	[22:25]
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arenlor	mercutio: I don't just browse the web.	[22:25]
mercutio	multiple users and simultaneous transfers etc more helps you've got 3 megabit atm :/	[22:26]
arenlor	mercutio: Max.	[22:26]
mercutio	yeh i had 1 megabit temp at the beginning of the year	[22:26]
arenlor	I measured it a bit ago. 1.25	[22:26]
mercutio	oh real on speedtest.net? i get over my line speed on speedtest.net it's unreliable it's better to just do an http download	[22:26]
arenlor	mercutio: Comcast and speedtest	[22:27]
mercutio	yeh don't trust those things they can overestimate i mean my adsl sync rate is like 17 or 18 megabit	[22:28]
arenlor	One entertaining thing with this is that it takes time to echo keystrokes when I'm ssh'd into my VPS.	[22:28]
mercutio	and there are overheads and i can get like 18.5 megabit	[22:28]
arenlor	mercutio: Comcast has a file you download.	[22:28]
mercutio	oh real i wonder what i get to it i found some flash one 11.79/0.84 to san jose comcast peak 17.75 megabit that peak is wrong oh and i have to snr tweak agian	[22:29]
arenlor	I found a file while googling.	[22:31]
mercutio	ahh ok cool resynced Path: 0, Upstream rate = 1144 Kbps, Downstream rate = 17603 Kbps	[22:31]
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arenlor	Nice, but what K are they using?	[22:32]
mercutio	http://stage.results.speedtest.comcast.net/result/160281622.png that's kilobit the upload was way too short and ping is like twice what it is	[22:32]
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arenlor	mercutio: DSL reports may be better. I haven't checked theirs for a long time.	[22:33]
mercutio	http://stage.results.speedtest.comcast.net/result/160281772.png see how the download speeds are higher than they should be	[22:34]
arenlor	Yeah	[22:34]
mercutio	so yeh that's why i don't trust them texas has lower ping than san jose	[22:34]
arenlor	mercutio: I'd like to see how that network happens.	[22:35]
mercutio	what do you mean?	[22:35]
arenlor	Still, if I'm supposed to have 2.5-3M and I'm getting 1.25 on the tests, I can assume that 1.25 is closer.	[22:36]
mercutio	Chris: Hi, I'm a live Comcast product specialist. What questions can I answer for you today? Chris: Just type your question below. You: stop spamming me Chris: I apologize for the inconvenience. Our chat window box will pop up once you are on the home page and is left idle. Chris: Please enjoy your time on our site. In the meantime, let's move this window. That way, you'll still see this web page and I'll be here to answer any questions you may encounter. Please click 'Move Chat Window' to move it now. Chris: Once you click on 'Move Chat Window' you can view our site and I can continue to assist you. Chris: How are things coming along? Chris: Are you still with me? am i the only one that hates those things?	[22:37]
arenlor	mercutio: I don't see those.	[22:38]
mercutio	Chris: I haven.t heard from you in a while. Would you like to continue to chat? You: Look! Leave me alone. when does it go to a human?	[22:38]
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arenlor	mercutio: Try cursing or saying call 911 or something? http://www.dslreports.com/im/102361591/78188.png	[22:38]
mercutio	i'm asking if they have gigabit what did comcast speed test say?	[22:39]
arenlor	mercutio: Careful, it's an American company, we've all seen what an American company can do to Kiwis.	[22:39]
mercutio	huh?	[22:40]
arenlor	mercutio: Megaupload? http://stage.results.speedtest.comcast.net/result/160282572.png	[22:40]
mercutio	that pignis fine is traceroute still high?	[22:42]
arenlor	mercutio: It's lower. In 300s now, which is normal for half the time.	[22:42]
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jlgaddis	heh, tweet from @bsdvps popped up in the bottom right of my screen and as i was reading it an email notification (alert for vps) popped up in the top right. good timing.	[22:48]
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jlgaddis	mercutio: usually typing in (or saying, if you're on the phone) "cancel" gets you transferred to a real person pretty quick	[22:50]
mercutio	jlg: ahh	[22:51]
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jlgaddis	up_the_irons: "Date: 03/01/2010" whoops	[22:58]
up_the_irons	jlgaddis: yeah i noticed that right after :( a bit flustered right now, <sigh...>	[22:59]
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up_the_irons	i've been holding the hand of this raid since this morning	[23:00]
jlgaddis	understood. no worries.	[23:00]
arenlor	up_the_irons: Maybe you should stop the raid and pay attention to your servers :P	[23:01]
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up_the_irons	wut?:)	[23:02]
arenlor	up_the_irons: MMO joke.	[23:03]
milki	LOL you cant stop the raid you must continue	[23:03]
up_the_irons	ah:)	[23:04]
jlgaddis	i'll leave you alone now so you can concentrate. good luck!	[23:06]
up_the_irons	jlgaddis: thanks! :)	[23:06]
arenlor	up_the_irons: I'm fully willing to participate in distracting you if you need it.	[23:06]
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up_the_irons	man, of course this host couldn't have stayed up a couple more weeks for me to reach 1000 days of uptime. grr!!! :)	[23:07]
arenlor	up_the_irons: That sucks.	[23:07]
up_the_irons	srsly	[23:08]
arenlor	up_the_irons: You could just randomly reset them, then you wouldn't have to worry about uptime anymore.	[23:09]
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up_the_irons	arenlor: lol	[23:19]
arenlor	up_the_irons: "uptime of 10 days, that's odd, why isn't it reseting itself?"	[23:20]
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up_the_irons	man, i was afraid this would happen when i came here today. Both drives in a mirror had reallocated sectors, but one had > 900 and the other (newer one) only 27. Which one did I replace? The > 900 one of course, but now it looks like the one with only 27 rasect is barfing :(	[23:28]
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mercutio	up_the_irons: if a disk shows any errors it's bad :)	[23:34]
jlgaddis	hmm	[23:34]
mercutio	cos it'a already used up it's ecc etc	[23:34]
jlgaddis	up_the_irons: in that case, data loss?	[23:34]
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up_the_irons	jlgaddis: yup, data loss	[23:44]
mercutio	ouch time for raid 6?	[23:44]
arenlor	mercutio: I still think RAID 2 is better, but no one implements it.	[23:44]
mercutio	there's also raidz-2	[23:45]
up_the_irons	mercutio: no, reallocated sectors are normal, all disks have a reserve of sectors that get remapped by the firmware. however, if you start getting LOTS of them, then that is probably a sign the disk is gonna go jlgaddis: actually, data loss is not necessarily the only option. it is possible the bad parts of the disk are unused. I had 2.18TB free in this volume, so if the bad parts are there, then it is possible the "good" stuff can still be copied off. that's what i'm investigating now..	[23:45]
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mercutio	ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME FLAG VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE UPDATED WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE 1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate 0x000f 105 099 006 Pre-fail Always - 8276127 this is bad right? err actualyl i don't know if that's accurate	[23:51]
up_the_irons	not sure...	[23:53]
mercutio	well both disks are showing hugely high numbers they're not raided	[23:54]
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mercutio	the newer disk has a count of lba read/written which seems insanely high too "Once again, with most SMART registers the RAW Values are only meaningful to the drive maker. They are of no interest or meaning to users." oh	[23:56]

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