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| plett | ww: There are clueful .uk ISPs, for example aa.net.uk (disclaimer: I work there, so am biased) | [04:08] |
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| ww | plett: actually... you're right, there are a handful.
in fact, would you mind if i sent you an informal RFQ that I just sent off to goscomb the other day? having to do with some rural broadband things i'm working on in scotland | [05:05] |
| plett | Sure. What sort of stuff is it for? Colo or connectivity? | [05:08] |
| ww | connectivity
possibly one or two routers colocated to support that | [05:09] |
| plett | ww: sales@aa.net.uk is probably the best place for the RFQ. It'll probably get given to me anyway if there's anything compliated in it :) | [05:10] |
| ww | oh aye, there beyond the "in the first instance" section there'll be a few complicated things :) | [05:10] |
| plett | If you want to cc: paul@aa.net.uk on it, I'll get it too | [05:11] |
| ww | sent.
mind that the architecture is very much up for discussion. the basic problem is, small isolated communities, they put in their own local infrastructure, then want/need redundant links out the links out are, at the moment, either tunnels over JANET or multiple DSL lines | [05:13] |
| plett | How redundant? In lots of the country, you'll have a hard time getting anyone other than BT interested in fibre/copper in the ground | [05:15] |
| ww | for example, the best developed of these things, the wireless network extending from Loch Hourn, through the Sound of Sleat, Knoydart and Rum and Eigg has (or will have soon) internal redundancy sufficient that a network partition is unlikely.
upstream bandwidth comes via the UHI/JANET network at Sabhal Mor Ostaig, which is, as I understand it, made out of C&W wireless links (DS3?) extending to Inverness. The other outbound link is a clutch of BT ADSL lines in Arisaig, that most likely follow the train tracks from there to Ft. William. apart from the ugly NAT at the borders, it should be pretty robust. | [05:17] |
| plett | Does it eventually reach one common ISP, or are they NAT internally?
Ahh :) | [05:19] |
| ww | the thing is, for various reasons, private addresses are a PITA.
there's another, for the moment unconnected, network in Applecross just to the north. the moment someone gets a bright idea to join them up, we've got address collisions. | [05:22] |
| plett | I assume becoming an LIR and getting your own IPs is financially infeasible? | [05:24] |
| ww | yes, for the moment, but we can possibly go via JANET for that
each of these little networks, though, is too small for an individual globally routeable block so need to aggregate them together somehow, and I htink the first step is to get control of the far end of some of these DSL links (aside from tunnels everywhere) | [05:26] |
| plett | I'm just reading through your email. It's certainly something we can help with
If you want IPv4 PI, you need to be applying now. RIPE are going to enter their final /8 in the next few months and won't be allocating PI from that | [05:31] |
| ww | ack. noted. technical justification not difficult, but some herding of cats will be required to figure out which entity makes the application... | [05:33] |
| plett | ww: I'll talk to our sales guys tomorrow and work out what we can offer | [05:34] |
| ww | cool. thanks | [05:34] |
| argh. sorry, i just noticed i neglected to put in the subject header! | [05:42] | |
| ... there is an alternative approach, that might fit better with the ofcom and scotgov policy direction but might be harder to get right and manage.
we can do tags over the local infrastructure, so carry those from the cpe to some interconnect and have third party isp do the IP layer "unbundling" not unlike what the ilec does with its copper plant | [05:48] | |
| plett | ww: That's an interesting approach. I suspect there would be lots of politics involved in getting that working | [05:57] |
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| up_the_irons | up_the_irons looks around
how's it shakin' in here? | [22:38] |
| mjp | low and a little to the left | [22:50] |
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| up_the_irons | lol | [23:11] |
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