#devious 2012-11-29,Thu

niteye

that's okay though, ill just use my imagination

sharvey

yes

benDos

Huh

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[07:01]

lteo

it's annoying when computers do what i say, instead of what i mean

[07:06]

benDos

Use more Pascal?

[07:07]

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[07:14]

lwhalen

ninjapants: so good of you to log in this morning ;-)

[07:29]

ninjapants

-.-
I've been busy. y'know. *workin'*

[07:30]

dbtid

howdy ninjapants

[07:32]

ninjapants

hiya!
I am surprised, I haven't had coffee today, but am still (mostly) alert

[07:32]

piroko

INCREDIBLE

[07:34]

ninjapants

I didn't drink much caffeine this weekend, and I've been experimenting with not having coffee. No headache yet

[07:35]

lteo

i always get the "helmet feel" if i don't get my morning coffee
if you know what i mean

[07:35]

piroko

ninjapants: I get the WORST headaches when I go cold turkey by accident
Everytime I swear up and down that I'm done with caffeine
Until the next day

[07:36]

ninjapants

I normally do. I'm not sure why this time is different, but so far so good. I realized I was leaving at least half of my morning coffee in the mug, and I have some tasty teas that I've neglected

[07:38]

lteo

i refuse to listen to this crazy talk

[07:38]

ninjapants

I also have cut back the amount of crap I'm eating a lot.
Cheese is normally my weakness - but I haven't had a craving in a few days
which is *huge*

[07:39]

mcchunkie

twss!

[07:39]

piroko

Cheese is awesome

[07:42]

ninjapants

it is. but I realized last year that it's also part of the reason I break out constantly (nothing huge, but still)
for some reason the hormones in the dairy interact with my face. Within a few weeks of not eating cheese or dairy daily, I clear right up

[07:43]

piroko

Sucks to be a woman
I kid I kid
piroko is listening to the new ke$ha album and FUCKING LOVING IT
piroko flicks off everyone in the room

[07:50]

qbit

qbit quits piroko as a friend

[07:51]

piroko

piroko hugs qbit

[07:51]

lteo

so, piroko exits qbit's friend zone?

[07:51]

piroko

I like where this is going

[07:52]

qbit

lal
http://cheezburger.com/45090305

[07:53]

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[07:55]

piroko

qbit: haha nice

[07:59]

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[08:04]

qbit

whoa
sigur ros sounding remix of a fuckbuttons song
yesplz
http://open.spotify.com/track/6R0iKZfNjebmwP7UrmWzDe

[08:20]

BryceBot

Error fetching information for http://open.spotify.com/track/6R0iKZfNjebmwP7UrmWzDe: Can't call method "find" on an undefined value

[08:20]

qbit

you shut your whore mouth BryceBot !

brycec

YOU SHUT YOURS qbit
damn, was hoping noembed had got their spotify shit together

lteo

BryceBot -- dampening qbit's excitement since November 2012!

brycec

qbit

;D
anyone running full disk encryption on theys hot openbsd boxins?

brycec

I read this as you're prostituting yourself 08:30:39 < ninjapants> I've been busy. y'know. *workin'*
pffft silly qbit, OpenBSD is soooo secure it doesn't need WDE

[08:23]

lteo

lteo doesn't have enough balls to do full disk encryption

[08:26]

brycec

If the whole disk is encrypted, how does the bootloader read the kernel and stuff? (legit question) I know that on Linux systems, you keep an unencrypted partition for /boot stuffs... Do you do the same for *BSD?

[08:29]

qbit

they booklearnt boot(8) to do the encryption

[08:31]

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[08:33]

lteo

sometimes i just want to give it all up and be a supermodel

[08:35]

qbit

haha

[08:35]

dbtid

lteo how many iq points do you have to give up?

[08:36]

zod000

being a supermodel would be lame, having one around for recreational purposes sounds good though

dbtid

zod000: you could have lteo

zod000

dbtid: enough that he might experience a freak gasoline fight accident

dbtid

now BOTH your problems are solved

lteo

dbtid: i dunno, but i will just answer "world peace" to every question

dbtid

lteo: you'd be better off answering "whirled peas"

qbit

haha

zod000

lteo: if you can't master Blue Steel, you won't get anywhere in modelling

dbtid

they're ain't never gonna be "world peace"
zod000: I was thinking Magnum

zod000

dbtid: also a valid skill

dbtid

i love the "IT'S THE SAME LOOK!" line from that movie.

zod000

zod000 breakdance fights dbtid
me too

dbtid

dbtid whips out his gasoline can

ninjapants

brycec: sometimes I feel that way.

dbtid

"that way" -- like you wanna have sex with girls???

brycec

is lwhalen forcing you to, ninjapants ?

ninjapants

"that way" - like I'm prostituting myself.

brycec

dbtid: see scrollback or context

zod000

bad lwhalen ...or good?

ninjapants

brycec: nah, it's all work-related

dbtid

no fun

ninjapants

exactly
I'm the person everyone goes to with their "little projects"
like: hey, I need a chart that has this little bit of info

dbtid

ninjapants: one time, someone who i solved problems for said something like, "I could not do my job without you!" so i said, "Thanks; please tell my boss."
she did
next quarterly meeting, i got a check for a grand as a thank you

brycec

wow
nice

dbtid

it helped that she was the HR boss

ninjapants

which turns into: oh, yeah, and I need a chart that goes with it that's clustered stacked bars with some lines included

zod000

excellent

ninjapants

dbtid: these are mostly from people in my group
and they all give me full credit for being awesome

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unity_(user_interface)

dbtid

aw, bummer

[08:42]

ninjapants

it's funny how often the words "and NJ put this together for us, which looks great. and she did it so quickly!"
come up in our staff meetings

[08:42]

brycec

Sometimes I touch Unity and think "Gee, why did I hate this so much?" and as I think on it, I realize I'm using it at 640x480, and that when scaled to run on two screens at native resolution, it crrrraaaawwwlllled.

[08:43]

dbtid

brycec: what's Unity?

[08:46]

brycec

[08:46]

BryceBot

Unity (user interface) :: Unity is a shell interface for the GNOME desktop environment developed by Canonical Ltd for its Ubuntu operating system. Unity debuted in the netbook edition of Ubuntu 10.10. It is designed to make more efficient use of space given the limited screen size of netbooks, including, for example, a vertical application switcher called the launcher. Unlike GNOME, KDE Software Compilation, Xfce, or LXDE, Unity is not a collection.

[08:46]

dbtid

[08:47]

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[08:48]

benDos

Hai

[08:48]

qbit

halla

[08:49]

kyl

moin

[08:49]

benDos

I just sat through an hour and a half discussion whether or not games are art
It was hella rough to actually sit there and not just walk out
Fucking undergrad.

dbtid

hi kyl

http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,2128881_2129111_2129112,00.html

ribo

qbit

ribo

oh 4chan

qbit

haha

lteo

kyl: annoyingly i found out that vmware.com themselves are offering fusion 5 at $29.99 also, but the electronic download version. had i known earlier i would've opted for the download.
coz i h9 physical media

[08:51]

kyl

heh this came with a flash drive which i <3
hi dbtid

[08:51]

benDos

lteo, why not qemu+kvm?

[08:51]

lteo

kyl: last night i upgraded fusion via the flash drive without even detaching it from the CD ;)

kyl

because that sucks

lteo

benDos: because i don't have enough brain cells to figure it out

kyl

lteo: heh, the macbok pros don't have CD drives brah
so i would have had to bring it into work

lteo

oh right forgot about htat

kyl

also i have a mac mini at work without a cd drive
but that is (was) running a trial version

[08:53]

benDos

lteo, qemu-manager really is pretty straight forward
They've gui;fied vm setup and maintaince if you prefer that
gui-fied*

[08:54]

lteo

i might check it out though i would dread having to disable mpbios in the openbsd kernel every time i upgrade just to make it run in kvm

[08:54]

benDos

Oh yeah i have no idea about kvm on obsd

[08:55]

kyl

also, kvm on os x is <<<< vmware fusion
it runs way slower and is a lot more of a pita
i've done it
and i have to do it if i want to emulate a mips machine

[08:55]

benDos

Yeah i only know qemu and kvm on linux
i'd certainly believe it's total shit on !linux

[08:55]

lteo

fusion fries on the mac
anyway, bbiab runch

[08:56]

benDos

s/r/h

[08:57]

lazylopez_

anyway, bbiab hunch

[08:57]

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[08:58]

brycec

ninja[chipotle]: you cruel bitch!
what the... Psy is up for Time person of the year???
lol EL James

[08:59]

benDos

brycec, who would you suggest if not Psy?
Mittens?

[09:01]

brycec

kittens
kindof want to see the words "pussy riot" on the cover
legitmacy aside, I think it would be funny

[09:01]

dbtid

brycec: yeah, of all the important things going on the in the world, who REALLY gives a fuck about the guy who has the most watched youtube video? someone is going to break that record, and then THEY'LL be POTY?

[09:02]

ninja[chipotle]

brycec: I know :D It just opened up near my office.

[09:02]

brycec

benDos

ninja[chipotle], that's baller.

brycec

I work across the street from a Chipotle... only ever been there (that location) once

benDos

brycec...
benDos unfriends

brycec

benDos...

dbtid

not really a fan of chipotle

brycec

benDos: it's not a great lunch food imo

dbtid

their meat has too much non-meat in it
the mcdonald's of mexican food

benDos

brycec, it's great lunch food knowning that the hour after lunch will be productivity forever lost

dbtid

if i wanted gristle i'd go to mcdonald's

brycec

meh I've no complaints, never noticed any gristle ...

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brycec

Maybe Chipotle[ohio] just hates you dbtid ?
or for that matter, sucks

benDos

Not that chipotle is the all best faux-mexican food

kyl

heh i don't go to chipotle anymore

benDos

but it's usually adequate

kyl

because qdoba 4eva

ribo

qdoba is superior

kyl

jk illegal petes

benDos

We don't have any of thse up here not even taco bell

kyl

hopefully ribo knows whats up

benDos

we have fajita grill

ribo

qdoba. queso.
IP is good too

kyl

ip is best

brycec

I should try Qdoba one of these days...
Moe's is pretty damn good

kyl

qdoba's ranchero burrito is muy bueno

ribo

get q queso burrito, then queso & chips
queeessssoooooo

[09:06]

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[09:07]

brycec

damn, closest qdoba is about 10mi from work (one-way)

[09:07]

ribo

shitty
had the same problem when in denver
luckly, the first chipotle ever was like a block away, next to illegal pete's

[09:07]

brycec

haha
Ooh Spokane has THREE qdboas
(North, South Hill, and Valley)

[09:08]

zod000

i really don't care for chipotle

[09:09]

brycec

versus the ONE Chipotle in Spokane (downtown)

[09:09]

zod000

Moes and tiajuna flats are decent though, not sure how widespread those chains are

benDos

brycec, are you checking out your mexican food options before moving?

brycec

Moe's is surprisingly widespread... but they closed the shop that was near me, so now I'm sad
benDos: already done, repeatedly in fact

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brycec

wb netsplit refugees

benDos

So you've picked out an apt in delivery range of as many as possible? :p

[09:11]

brycec

ha no (apt choices are kinda suck anyways)
Besides... since when is there mexican delivery?
I live in AZ and know of NO PLACES that deliver Mexican
or hamburgers, for that matter

[09:11]

benDos

I'm in central new york homie
And i can get a chimichango delivered right now if i wanted

[09:11]

brycec

i hate you

zod000

lol

brycec

i hate you so much

benDos

It's ok i just had a gyro, and started some coffee
nomnom

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brycec

But... can you get a burger delivered?

zod000

there are actually services around here you can get anything delivered from anywhere else, but it is rarely worth the cost imo

brycec

zod000++

zod000

cheap zod is cheap

benDos

brycec, i tots can by like at least 5 or 6 places i can think of

brycec

what the hell. so not cool

benDos

benDos lives in a college town
I can actually get things like that delivered until like 4am

[09:13]

brycec

brycec lives near a collegetown

[09:13]

zod000

zod000 lives in a town

[09:14]

benDos

benDos lives in a town with 3 nuclear reactors
Not to brag or whatever

[09:15]

zod000

enjoy your extra limbs
jk

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benDos

Just the one
;)

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benDos

brycec, easymode cooking > delivery anyway
About 95% of the year, my apt is stocked with stuff to make tacos/burritos

[09:20]

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[09:20]

benDos

zod000, delayed rebuttal I may grow some extra arms but you statistically already have or are about to fall into a sinkhole

[09:24]

zod000

benDos: my years of console video game training have trained me to avoid holes in the ground

[09:25]

benDos

To me that sounds like you're about to fall into a sinkhole

[09:25]

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[09:26]

zod000

benDos: unlikely, but sinkholes really do suck

[09:27]

benDos

brycec, they are opening the 4th subway in my town
just opened*

zod000

more in the house ruining way than actually getting a person

benDos

All within 2 miles of each other on the same street

brycec

only 4 in your town?

benDos

zod000, limestone just isn't as baller a foundation as floridians of yesteryear thought
It was more that we have 4 of them within 2 miles on the same street it a <30k person town
Along other with sub shops ofc

zod000

it is too bad subway kinda sucks
i swear there are 30 in my area
i find their quality to be highly variable depending on the owner of the franchise

[09:30]

benDos

Yeah're hit or miss
Yeah
Some are ok subs for ok prices
Some pretty terrible

zod000

the one closest to work is abyssmal

qbit

damn!

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qbit

boot(8) doesn't like my yubikey

zod000

the one near my house is decent, but there is a firehouse sub and quizno right down the road

dbtid

yahoo! ok, i don't have to muck about with 1 msec time resolution, which is sadly hard to get on this chip because none of the clocks are nice that way, and i'd end up having to do ugly integer division

zod000

and a publix

qbit

oh wait
it does

brycec

congrats dbtid

qbit

hot

brycec

what changed?

jrick

qbit: setting up FDE?

dbtid

brycec: the requirement :)

brycec

swoot

dbtid

i could have it done in the FPGA, but that's a hassle

qbit

jrick: si

mcchunkie

New sets for amd64!
New sets for loongson!

jrick

schweet

dbtid

i could give a time base of 1024 not 1000, but he didn't like that because if we change platforms, it might be hard to generate that on the next chip
so this is a good compromise

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[09:34]

ninjapants

wtf just happened
I came back and the channel was empty

[09:34]

benDos

I'm still here.
Maybe you got a funny netsplit coming?

[09:35]

ninjapants

there was a netsplit, but it said netsplit - hexreel quit
I have no idea
I was going to tell brycec that the meat that I get at the chipotles I've been to has always been tasty
no gristle.

[09:36]

sharvey

ugh

benDos

brycec, is here for me

sharvey

forgot fire alarm tests were today

brycec

ninjapants: still here

benDos

ninjapants, maybe rejoin?

ninjapants

I did

brycec

I see 93 nicks in the channel

ninjapants

right, that's after I rejoined

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brycec

well netsplits are fun

ninjapants

somethin' funky went down while I was grabbing foodz

[09:38]

brycec

dbtid: quick pm?

[09:38]

dbtid

brycec: any time

[09:38]

sharvey

:( more fire alarm tests

[09:39]

dbtid

brycec: hell, if you want to call me on the phone, you can do that, too :)

[09:39]

sharvey

will there be more I wonder

[09:40]

brycec

lol dbtid harder to send URLs that method :p
besides irc lets you leave it for later if you're busy now

[09:40]

zod000

just read off the characters brycec

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brycec

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http://cheezburger.com/6796967168

ninjapants

[09:45]

benDos

hah

[09:45]

ninjapants

ha - this one's good, too http://cheezburger.com/6813015808

[09:46]

benDos

I know this must exist but i don't know of any
LaTeX-esce markdown languages?
A markdown that compiled to LaTeX would be neat
Can someone point me in the direction of something stablish?

[09:49]

ribo

markdown > html > latex
:P

[09:50]

benDos

Wut.

[09:50]

ribo

:P
:3

[09:50]

benDos

For like, you're particular web-centric use-case?

ribo

.ymf thenrightnway
https://mdb.io/ymf/jDr.jpg

benDos

Or, generally?
your.

ribo

you wanted a markdown that compiles to latex
compile it to html first
then use one of 8902349820 html to latex tools

benDos

I guesss

[09:52]

ribo

IT'S UNIX. I KNOW THIS. PIPE ALL THE THINGS.

[09:52]

benDos

It was more wanting to latex stuff in markdown
But yeah

[09:53]

Lefty

ribo++

kyl

or use pandoc

Lefty

"you didn't say the magic word"

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brycec

"cocaine"

[09:56]

Lefty

dingdingding

[09:56]

ribo

markdown < html < latex
:D

[09:56]

brycec

HOLY CRAP an email from Pebble! I'd forgotten I'd pre-ordered a Pebble, it was that long ago...

kyl

latex > *

benDos

@wiki Pebble

BryceBot

Pebble :: A pebble is a clast of rock with a particle size of 4 to 64 millimetres based on the Krumbein phi scale of sedimentology. Pebbles are generally considered to be larger than granules (2 to 4 millimetres diameter) and smaller than cobbles (64 to 256 millimetres diameter). A rock made predominantly of pebbles is termed a conglomerate. Pebble tools are among the earliest known... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pebble

brycec

and finally, an email from them! (versus me hunting down info on the forums)

ribo

I remember I used to write all my papers in LyX

benDos

Que es un Pebble?

brycec

benDos: Pebble Watch
@wiki Pebble (watch)

BryceBot

Pebble (watch) :: The Pebble E-Paper Watch is an upcoming smartwatch. Developers Pebble Technology had raised venture capital for the product under their former name inPulse, but after initially failing to attract traditional investors under their new brand name, in April 2012 the Pebble became the most highly funded Kickstarter project to date. Development Initial... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pebble%20%28watch%29

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benDos

oh neat

kyl

you should just write in texinfo

benDos

wait

kyl

it's way superior

ribo

only problem I have with all these new awesome watches is battery life : (

benDos

brycec, didn't i just see swatch put that out
like 1:1 the same as the wiki image

kyl

heh ribo the only problem i have is i don't wear watches :p

ribo

well, that too
I might wear one if it was cool enough
like the pebble

kusuriya

pocket watch FTW

ribo

if it had like a 6month run time

kusuriya

kusuriya puts on the hipster glasses

ribo

was just gonna say
I have a pocket watch, it's called a cell phone

kyl

i don't even remember to grab my pocket watch most mornings

brycec

heh maybe benDos

kusuriya

ribo: how did you know my secret?

brycec

I've seen a few

kyl

mostly i just don't care about time

ribo

are you a time lord?

brycec

When Pebble was annoued and stuff, it was new and revolutionary

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brycec

lol ribo

kusuriya

ribo: well i was

JainAmber

Hello

kusuriya

until i took an arrow to the knee

brycec

but small startup has been slow, and big companies have said "hey what a neat idea, let's do it too" and I think I've seen Sony with one on the market already

zod000

kusuriya: are you sworn to carry my burdens?

kusuriya

zod000: nope i am the thane!
... the DOD is building swarm drones that are anti drone attack drones XD
they are supposed to attack in swarms :D

[10:01]

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[10:02]

JainAmber

x86 Surface with W8 Pro Coming in early 2013. Starting at $899. No matter what, I won't spen 900 fcking dollars on anything-surface!

[10:02]

kusuriya

JainAmber: a lot of people are looking at that though
remember microsofts only strength is tight intergration with everything they have every where

[10:02]

zod000

my company is looking at those for field techs and outside sales
makes more sense that anything i*

[10:03]

kusuriya

like my buddys RT surface was able to get on my wireless network find my Xbox and after a few seconds of telling my xbox he is approved he was playing youtube videos from the surface
on the xbox
then at the same time i was able to from my windows machine tap the stream and watch it
there is a group of people especially enterprises that are looking at adopting surface because of the fact it works soo well with the MSFT stack they already have

[10:03]

zod000

or so they can enforce gpo

[10:05]

kusuriya

^
then again i can enforce policy on your ipad if i link it to my exchange serve :)
**server

[10:05]

zod000

not quite as much as you can with the w8 i imagine

[10:06]

kusuriya

actually pretty much yes :)

zod000

with android and ios it is pretty much just enforcing encrytion and passphrases

kusuriya

depending on what version of iphone/ipad it is
android mostly ignores most of the EAS profiles so EAS control is useless

zod000

nah, it follows it in any of the more recent versions

kusuriya

worse android will lie to your exchange server and tell it that it supports * and has implemented it

zod000

don't blame that on android, that can only be done via replacing the mail app with a rogue one

kusuriya

for all of our high security customers like banks Android* is blocked from EAS

zod000

same can be done via jailbreaking an iphone

kusuriya

suprisingly not, you can tell it to not implement a profile

zod000

incorrect

[10:09]

kusuriya

and if i look at your device it will show me the implementation of the profile failed
and that profile is not implemented
android (you must be rooted) will report back to my exchange server that it implemented the profile even though it didnt

[10:09]

zod000

if you root and then modify/replace the Email.apk, then yes

[10:10]

kusuriya

you dont have to replace the email.apk
there are apps to let you do it if you are rooted since its not that hard to do

[10:10]

zod000

you most certainly do, at least on 2.2 and 2.3
well, same difference, you are replacing the mail app

[10:10]

kusuriya

nope
the app sits between email.apk and the EAS stuff
since the exchange stuff is not built into email.apk its part of a different system object

[10:11]

zod000

oh, so it acts in the middle

[10:11]

kusuriya

yep

[10:11]

zod000

most of the exchange stuff is actually built into the email.apk
but you can still attack it from in thye middle

[10:12]

kusuriya

but regardless the fact that it can so easily be done on android is why a lot of our finacial customers for their secured exchange disallow android

[10:12]

zod000

it is not much harder on ios, but let them do as they wish
i could do it on winmo 6 as well

kusuriya

meh i dont make up their rules

zod000

was much more work though

kusuriya

actually on winmo6 you couldnt because it checksummed its EAS :P

zod000

i assure you i could, because i did

http://boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/LOLlinguist.jpeg

kusuriya

im willing to bet it didnt lie to the exchange server ;)
and if i audited the profiles it would tell me what profiles you have disabled or "failed"

[10:14]

zod000

if you say so

[10:14]

kusuriya

when you did it zod000 did you ever audit your exchange profile from the servers view
because i can tell when people stop profiles with their iOS device its pretty trivial

[10:15]

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[10:16]

kusuriya

then again if it was me and i designed theese peoples security EAS would be off all together for their secured systems
because fuck your mobile device its to easily stolen and hacked

[10:16]

lwhalen

[10:18]

zod000

lwhalen: excellent

[10:18]

kusuriya

score
kusuriya really does hate EAS

[10:18]

qbit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=x1hLREgL194

[10:21]

BryceBot

YouTube Comedy: "Harvard Sailing Team - Hipster Thanksgiving" by HSTSketchComedy (4m 59s), 390,212 views, 2,703 likes and 96 dislikes. Uploaded 2012-11-21T18:55:56.000Z.

[10:21]

qbit

qbit whispers essence of wildflower

[10:23]

piroko

lol I'm tethering on edge

[10:24]

brycec

I've done that before... was better than nothing at least
Hell, I've tethered on GPRS

[10:25]

piroko

True. And ssh + compression really isn't even bad

[10:25]

benDos

piroko, no mosh?
mosh was that latency tolerate screen + openssh mashup right?

[10:25]

kusuriya

benDos: oh you ported that to openbsd?
:P

brycec

and a weak GPRS signal no less - I hung my RAZR (those things had freakishly slow UARTs to start with) on the door of the hotel room in order to get any signal, and BT tethered from there.

benDos

kusuriya, I go about my life under the assumption that if i have it in linux you have it in openbsd
As i don't use openbsd

brycec

benDos: no screen, just latency-tolerant ssh

benDos

It hasn't really lead me to any issues
brycec, i thought it had some other features that were screen-y

brycec

would you like to be led into some issues? we know of some ;)

kusuriya

it will for things like MOSH since no one has had the desire to port
:P

benDos

We had a tangential discussion last night

***

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benDos

About qbit liking obsd cause nothing works and instead of being productive he's secure
I like linux cause it's easymode
:p

qbit

lol

kusuriya

meh i like good code

qbit

tangential

benDos

kusuriya, so you run netbsd?

kusuriya

too bad FBSD has issues with this system

benDos

kusuriya

benDos: i said good code not architecture compatibility :P

benDos

qbit, what's wrong about tangential?

zod000

I like reactOS, because..umm..ok i don't

qbit

i like it

piroko

benDos: I ssh to devious
Which doesn't have mosh

benDos

piroko, gotcha
..but pipes
=D

piroko

Though now that my home connection is stable I can give it a try...

kusuriya

but SSH Compression once you get SSH set right is very latency tolerant

benDos

I like Solaris cause SPARC is sexy for certain workloads.

http://www.thehollywoodgossip.com/videos/crazy-lady-and-vacuum-cleaner-man/

kusuriya

[10:30]

benDos

I dislike Solaris cause udev,systemd,native kvm,and Larry Ellison.

[10:30]

lwhalen

benDos

I just got spam "Explosive Deals On Used Cars" harharhar

kusuriya

benDos: whats wrong with KVM :o

benDos

kusuriya, nothing
But i like native kvm

kusuriya

then why do you dislake solaris for having it ;)

benDos

kvm attached to other operating systems varies greatly in quality
For not having native kvm, udev, or systemd
And having far too much Larry Ellison.

kyl

qbit: in that HST video, when they drink coffee that's how i imagine you do it brah

benDos

devfs just depresses me.

kusuriya

well yeah the ellison is the dealbreaker for me
that and the wireless drivers they are missing for no good reason

benDos

And the lack of udev.
Hah
Fair enough

kusuriya

meh what they use instead of Udev does work better

benDos

Am i really the only one with such a strong preference for devfs than udev?
er
udev over devfs*

kusuriya

probly

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benDos

s/$/ in here

lazylopez_

probly in here

kusuriya

but solaris uses somthing a bit different

benDos

It's more or less an old bsd style devfs
At least in solaris, um
10 or 9
I think 10 is what i've used mostly

qbit

haha
kyl: i totally is

mcchunkie

I am a respectable lady! I will not take this lying down!

qbit

every cup

benDos

wut.

kyl

hah

kusuriya

latter 10 and 11 use somthing similar to devfs but it is vastly different when you dig into it

kyl

I KNEW IT

benDos

kusuriya, locally mounting usb on solaris thin clients is pretty painful

kusuriya

benDos: never has been for me

benDos

Instead of doing the normal "Hey you plugged in a usb stick i mounted it here for you"

kyl

qbit: put a turkey in your butt brah

mcchunkie

TWSS!

kusuriya

benDos: it always automounts for me

qbit

benDos

Well it does automount

kusuriya

but maybe thats because i know how to use it ;)

benDos

Just in a weird location

kusuriya

its right there in my desktop :P
but solaris has a lot of shitty bits :(

[10:35]

benDos

It automounts, in my setup anyway, in like /opt/someshit/someothershit/$USER/tmpsomething/something/deviceid
We also have a bunch of nfs partions that usually are machine local

[10:35]

kusuriya

if you want easy mode unix just install OSX :)

[10:36]

benDos

That's a weird way to abbreviate ubuntu.

[10:36]

kusuriya

Ubuntu technically is not unix
its never been certified
OS X is
^fact

[10:36]

lteo

OS X is a true BSD
kyl: ^

benDos

.addtroll OS X is a true BSD

lazylopez_

OS X is a true BSD: was added

kusuriya

benDos: that is also a fact :P

benDos

I think the notion of a certified BSD has maaaybe lost some of it's meaning since 1987?

lteo

kusuriya: ask kyl what he thinks of OS X as a true BSD ;)

[10:38]

benDos

Vocally or sarcastically strongly opposed or fore
If i had to guess

[10:38]

kusuriya

benDos: actually OS X has a true certifcation from the UNIX group, no linux distro or BSD distro having it is the reason its all *nix and not Unix ;)
BSD for legal reasons cant call its self unix because of a lawsuit

[10:38]

kyl

lteo: bro you mean The One True BSD?

benDos

The UNIX group?

kusuriya

benDos: yep

lteo

kusuriya: btw about what you said the other day, is it true apple geniuses are even aware of OS X's BSD stuff?

kyl

http://www.unix.org/

benDos

I know of the unix group

kusuriya

lteo: some are

benDos

I was just unaware that anyone cared what they said

kusuriya

benDos: the unix group holds the copyrights to unix

kyl

well, technically to call yourself unix you have to pass their certifications

benDos

Post SCO?

kusuriya

and if you use unix with out their permission they will sue your ass off

lteo

suenix

kusuriya

benDos: even post SCO they own the copyright to the name

benDos

Right
My point is "unix certified" used to really mean something

CyL

Evening folks. What is usually the lunch break in US?

benDos

Now, at least in my work/dev/etc community
it's more a joke than anything else

kyl

now linux, based on popularity, is hijacking that

kusuriya

even if you dont think it means mich now it still means a lot to enterprise
and you still cant call yourself unix without it

kyl

they just whatever dumb shit they want (systemd, pulse, etc)

lteo

CyL: all the time since everyone's goofing off all the time

kyl

and it gets called unix pretty much

benDos

kyl, you don't like systemd?
:/

kusuriya

im meh on systemd

kyl

i do not

benDos

kyl, how come?
I really enjoy it
Despite it not really being unix's in that is' pretty monolithic
And maybe joining repos with udev was premature
s/premature/premature/unnessesary

lazylopez_

And maybe joining repos with udev was premature

benDos

Thanks lazylopez_ you're the best.

kyl

the basic unix philosophy is do one thing and do it well

CyL

lteo: I mean, I tried to call someone in US, in Massachusetts, and I know it is a quarter to 2 pm right know. Would people normally be at a lunch break in USA this time?

kyl

it's not as easy to hack on

benDos

kyl, i get that
I really do

kyl

it's way too monolythic

kusuriya

its a bit of a mess honestly

kyl

the fuck
monolithic

benDos

In practice the nicities outweigh it being so big and do everything-y

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benDos

Logging is just so much nicer
socket activation again, so much nicer
systemd > init.d much nicer
Individually anyway

kusuriya

like a lot of stuff linux the code and the function is kinda sloppy and seems to have a philosphy of "we will fix it in version 2"

lteo

CyL: it really depends, some people take lunch break earlier and some later

kusuriya

that thought process is what bit microsoft in the security ass for many years

kyl

i think it's an answer in search of a problem

kusuriya

CyL

lteo: Sure, but I mean the usual break.

brycec

^^^

kyl

adds complexity and overhead to a problem we've already solved

benDos

To me it simplified a lot of things
And makes existing things faster and easier to use

kyl

quit wasting time on shit like that and work on doing more useful things

kusuriya

like what
init.d was pretty simple

lteo

amen brotha

brycec

CyL: I would say that there isn't a "usual" break, besides maybe 12pm-1pm

benDos

the systemd journal, at least sounds, like the correct way to do logging

CyL

brycec: Okay, thanks.

kyl

now, you've just increased the work load

zod000

CyL: I took lunch at 10am, so ymmv

benDos

init to systemd better lets you express deps imo in processes

kyl

a bunch of people now have to figure out how the fuck to integrate systemd if they want to jump on board, or face getting shut out

benDos

plus async ftw

kusuriya

thats not really any simpler or better than the dmesg/syslog output

brycec

CyL: but that break applies to <50% of the working population. Lots of people take [lunch] breaks at different times

benDos

kusuriya, it really really is
Strings suck

kusuriya

benDos: init.d could start async

kyl

devs that could be doing something actually productive with their lives now have to spend time on this

benDos

kyl, integrating with systemd is trivial

kyl

it increases the barrier to entry

benDos

you know this
you can give it an init script and get a systemd script back

kusuriya

benDos: it really isnt because systemd is still spitting strings out

kyl

not if your system is built around rc.d

CyL

zod000, brycec, lteo: It is just that I got an answering machine, so I thought that was calling at a bad time.

benDos

kusuriya, no
it compresses and dedups
the on disk format is objectively far far better

kusuriya

benDos: it compresses and dedupes strings

benDos

for the systemd journal than dmesg

brycec

CyL: It seems more likely they didn't hear it, were busy, or didn't want to answer

zod000

CyL: some people just don't answer their phones or are in meetings and can't answer

lteo

or pooping

benDos

And index I believe

kusuriya

which various systemloggers were able to do

zod000

or getting coffee, or whatever other bs

benDos

kusuriya, right
few to none were default

brycec

brycec <3 circular logs

benDos

Heh

CyL

BTW, would anyone recommend a good RFID module manufacturer company?

kusuriya

again that doesnt make systemd any simpler

benDos

I <3 any in disk format that is indexable

brycec

CyL: module being...?

kusuriya

that actually makes it more complex

benDos

simpler to do interesting things with

kyl

also

brycec

rfid reader, or card?

benDos

more complex in implementation

CyL

brycec: The transceptor that would interface to a computer.

kyl

lennart poettering is involved

benDos

Well yeah

kusuriya

and more complex in use

benDos

But people are auditing his code kyl :p
kusuriya, i haven't found that to be true
different, but not more complex

kusuriya

because now if i want to centralize it i have another piece of software to deal with

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kusuriya

instead of having it all pumped into my system logger which i already have setup to export logs

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benDos

I believe you can just tell systemd which logs go where
local files or remote transport

kyl

anyways, those are my feelings
you are free to choose what you want for your distro
but i won't be supporting anything using systemd

kusuriya

its still another piece of software you now have to configure :P

benDos

Fine.

kusuriya

kyl: sooner or later with how things go you may not have a choice sadly

lteo

let's merge systemd and autotools

kyl

kusuriya: or i stop using linux

benDos

We can agree that systemd will not bring about the year of the linux desktop

kyl

make linux go the way of windows in my life

kusuriya

kyl: most BSDs are looking at having to port and use things like udev and systemd due to applications pulling in more and more linuxisms

benDos

and the AF_BUS in kernel is lovely

kusuriya

but systemd is like pulseaudio

benDos

http://lwn.net/Articles/504722/ short description if you're curious

kusuriya

a solution in search for a problem

benDos

kyl, will you refuse to use AF_BUS?
In favor or muuuuuuch more expensive 0mq or similar?
s/or/of/

lazylopez_

In favof of muuuuuuch mofe expensive 0mq of similar?

benDos

damn typod.

kyl

I don't know enough about AF_BUS to comment

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kyl

0mq is awesome

brycec

qbit

guys
gusy
NODE

brycec

and multiplatform, and network-friendly, and and and

kyl

qbit: bro ZMOG RLY

qbit

qbit dusts off his hands and walks away

benDos

AF_BUS is AF_UNIX + reliable multicast more or less

lteo

qbit: node > *?

kyl

we should just write an os in node
for performance

benDos

For proximity to metal.

brycec

for baremetal performance

kusuriya

benDos: AF_BUS looks more like its AF_UNIX with dbus and multicast roled into it

benDos

Beat ya to it brycec !
kusuriya, dbus in AF_BUS?

brycec

by 1 second... I shouldn't have paused to consider adding emphasis to _baremetal_

kusuriya

so i dont know if its anybetter or worse

lteo

some just said roll. did they mean spring roll? i'm here now

kusuriya

benDos: according to what you linked thats one of its goals

kyl

mmm spring rolls

brycec

ohai lt

benDos

Well yeah

BryceBot

That's what she said!!

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qbit

awyeah

benDos

But it isn't integrated with af_bus

kusuriya

replace dbus due to resorce starvation

benDos

that's it's main target

kyl

wait
did qbit say node?

lteo

brycec: <3

***

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kyl

WHAT

brycec

lol, she said "Well yeah"

benDos

but dbus's message passing is not very different from most other message passing
lots of pubsub and you'd like reliable multicast

lteo

i'm glad i have regained my +virginity even after offending a #devious god

kusuriya

im not sure why an IPC would need multicast honestly
its an IPC

benDos

You can implement exchangers without unix sockets
kusuriya, my irc bot does multicast ipc

brycec

lteo: I got tired of seeing a space before your nick. You're still on ice.

lteo

lol

benDos

kusuriya, each message gets pushed out on a multicast socket

***

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benDos

all the plugins see the messages and respond accordingly

kyl

i use 0mq pubsub in my bot as well

benDos

Yeah pubsub is really quiet common
Having it in kernel with badass af_unix underlying support makes it about as fast as you can hope for it to be

lteo

kyl: talking bout speed, did i read it right in your benchmarking post that ruby is faster than pythong? ;)

benDos

lol

brycec

I seem to recall the very opposite

kyl

i don't remember the numbers offhand, is definitely possible

benDos

I would imagine it depends on the workload and language implementation

kyl

and highly likely

kusuriya

benDos: that still doesnt awnser why id want it :P

benDos

pubsub?

kusuriya

multicast IPC

benDos

Right, pubsub.

kyl

benDos

@wiki Publish-Subscribe Design Pattern

BryceBot

Messaging pattern :: In software architecture, a messaging pattern is a network-oriented architectural pattern which describes how two different parts of a message passing system connect and communicate with each other. In telecommunications, a message exchange pattern (MEP) describes the pattern of messages required by a communications protocol to establish or use a communication... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messaging%20pattern

benDos

kyl

very very useful

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brycec

benDos: um yourself -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=Publish-Subscribe+Design+Pattern

BryceBot

Publish–subscribe pattern :: In software architecture, publish–subscribe is a messaging pattern where senders of messages, called publishers, do not program the messages to be sent directly to specific receivers, called subscribers. Instead, published messages are characterized into classes, without knowledge of what, if any, subscribers there may be. Similarly, subscribers express interest in one or more classes, and only receive messages that

kyl

haha http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOtzvi4tiig

BryceBot

YouTube Comedy: "Harvard Sailing Team - Puppy Pictures!!!" by HSTSketchComedy (3m 31s), 309,649 views, 1,483 likes and 49 dislikes. Uploaded 2011-08-02T15:28:35.000Z.

kyl

now i'm caught watching HST

benDos

kusuriya, "Hey every active program that cares, there's a usb stick now at /dev/whatever" etc

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benDos

"Hey every program that cares, the network interface just went down/up" etc

kusuriya

benDos: meh i just havent delt a lot with IPC honestly
directly anyway

benDos

I've done a fair bit, on unix sockets and with network protocols

kyl

i have used it quite a bit

benDos

it?

BryceBot

That's what she said!!

benDos

BryceBot, no

BryceBot

Oh, okay... I'm sorry. 'it?'

kusuriya

last time i even started looking into it i was thinking of playing wiht HURD
and it made my head hurt

BryceBot

That's what she said!!

benDos

The kernel based IPC has several benefits for D-Bus over the userspace
emulation:
- Context switching between userspace processes is reduced.
- Message data copying is reduced.
- System call overheads are reduced.
- The userspace D-Bus daemon was subject to resource starvation,
client contention and priority inversion.
- Latency is reduced
- Throughput is increased.
Sorry for flood :/

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benDos

I said sorry :/

qbit

ha
that's what put you over the edge!

benDos

benDos checks his +v
Ok

qbit

phew

brycec

no no, it was the same time as I hit enter
besides, I didn't know how many more lines would flood

lteo

at least you didn't lose your +virginity, benDos

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kusuriya

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benDos

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benDos

Hay.

brycec

benDos

Not cool mang.

lteo

yeah it's not cool to hang out with lteo. i get that

brycec

"not cool" would be if I removed +V from you :P

kusuriya

but yeah I wont argue the merits for AF_BUS i dont know enough about the topic :D

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lteo

_^: hi Guest38271

brycec

damnit _^ get a real nick

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benDos

kusuriya, fair enough

kyl

oh hai piro^wGuest234234

piroko

You guys suck

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benDos

kusuriya, but those are the kind of use cases that dbus makes way easier

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benDos

Without that kind of centralized setup

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^_^

benDos

It just sucks to standardize that kind of thing

kyl

i don't even know what kind of facial expression _^_ would be

kusuriya

.|.. :D

piroko

haha
ok, benDos
I love you
mosh
Is amazing

benDos

Heh :p
Kew

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benDos

Thanks btw

kusuriya

yeah i like the idea behind mosh

qbit

i have never used it

kusuriya

i just wish it wasnt GPL3

benDos

Neither have it qbit :p

piroko

I totally just disabled an entire interface, enabled another interface, and it reconnected

benDos

have I

piroko

I mean it makes sense since it's udp
But still. Fucking mindblown

kusuriya

makes me never want to hack on it honestly

piroko

kusuriya: How about dishonestly?

benDos

kusuriya, at what point is linux not unix
I mean it ships a ton of non-kernel things in tree

kyl

yesss another launch coin is coming

BryceBot

That's what she said!!

kusuriya

benDos: at the point its not certified to call itself UNIX ;)

lteo

linux was a unix clone from the start

benDos

It's largely arbitrary imo and for systemd the things that become easier out weight the potential for more complicated code bases

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kusuriya

but seriously its getting further and further away from unix like

benDos

That's a good thing

kusuriya

systemD honestly provides no real benifit that wasnt already there

kyl

mosh has had a couple of vulns

benDos

I just told you the benefits kusuriya :/

kusuriya

you did

kyl

and some of the way it does things don't strike me as being suitably secure

kusuriya

and all those things were already there

benDos

For applications and users, integration between programs gets easier
It standardizes a lot of ad hoc solutions

kusuriya

there was already a pretty basic standard there

[11:07]

benDos

was there?
I thought there were a few
And programs had to deal with a bunch of locations to check for things

[11:07]

kusuriya

accessing the systemlog was pretty standard and pretty easy to access

[11:07]

benDos

But slightly different log formats between various programs
Also may have required root
May have disclosed non-related things

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benDos

It's a software engineering win, and a unix philosophical lose

kusuriya

requireing elevated perms to read system logs doesnt strike me as a problem
meh call it what you want

benDos

I feel like i'm not going to convince you.
Oh well

kusuriya

nope

benDos

I never convince anyone of anything in here...

kusuriya

because again its a solution looking for a problem

benDos

Baaaah
benDos drops it

kusuriya

had there been an actual problem to solve ;)

***

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kyl

for example, pulse audio was a good example of a problem being solved
we need more of that
right lteo?

lteo

wait whut

kyl

it's too bad openbsd hasn't gotten its ass in gear and added support

benDos

lteo, pulseaudio

qbit

haha

***

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lteo

lteo keeps quiet ;)

[11:11]

kyl

lteo: it's the best audio subsystem ever isn't it? brah
are you saying it's not!?

[11:11]

kusuriya

benDos: you have me sort of convinced about AF_BUS as a consoleation prize

qbit

one way to tell if a subsystem is good or not..
is if it has a beard

kusuriya

qbit

no beard.. no good

lteo

frankly i don't know anything about audio on *nix

[11:13]

qbit

wish there was someone named "frankly" in the chan

[11:14]

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[11:15]

lteo

i wonder if rubinius will make ruby less painful

[11:19]

kyl

what is rubinius?
how is ruby painful?

[11:19]

benDos

lteo, the onyl way to make ruby better is jruby
I'm sorry
kyl, rubinus is like pypy
self hosted ruby

[11:19]

kusuriya

the only way to make ruby better is to uninstall it

benDos

kusuriya, i'll convince you about systemd
for now i'm doing maths though

lteo

kyl: from website "Rubinius is software that translates the code for the Ruby programming language such as"

zod000

kusuriya: that made ruby 100% better for me

benDos

jruby on openjdk 7

lteo

puts "hello world"

kusuriya

benDos: the only way you could is if you could find an actual problem systemd solved

lteo

and turns it into efficient machine code like this
push %rbp; mov %rsp, %rbp; push %rbx; subq $0x98, %rsp; cmp $0x0, 0x10(%rcx); call 0xffffffffff472010; jmp 0x9c; …

qbit

benDos

lteo, that asm doesn't seem terrible?
Though annotated asm is way easier to read, cause i have no idea what is at 0xffffffffff472010;

[11:21]

lteo

i dunno brah, last i wrote asm was 17 years ago

[11:21]

benDos

Fuck i mean i'm quietly doing math and not on irc..
objdump == <3 though

[11:21]

brycec

lteo is a slacker!

[11:22]

lteo

meh, rubinius just became unusable for me. ruby 1.9 not supported
brycec: that's unfortunately true right now in terms of OSS contribution ;)

[11:22]

benDos

jruby supports 1.9....

kusuriya

:( i need a new programming laptop

lteo

i have a problem with the 'j' ;)

kusuriya

i have a problem with the ruby part
so its rounded :D

benDos

lteo, i can't think of a good reason why you'd be fine with ruby but not java
Not that there aren't good reasons to dislike java

kusuriya

benDos: Hipser

qbit

inf problems?

benDos

ruby has most if not all of those traits though

lazylopez_

Ruby syntax looks like someone pulled off all the symbols from their keyboard, inserted them into a shotgun and shot them into a $20 hooker that had been dead for 3 days..

qbit

might not be possible to roll out java to everything?

benDos

...but you only write java once

kusuriya

not as hipster as qbit

benDos

then run it everywhere

qbit

or doing so would require drastic changes to everything?

kusuriya

kusuriya clones qbit's node repo

benDos

You can't clone a clone
der
They tried that with Dolly
All the dna just broke 'n shit

kusuriya

multiplicity told me you can clone a clone

lteo

so you _can_ clone a clone, just that the dna breaks

kusuriya

and hollywood has never lied to be before
**me before

benDos

lteo, but you need the dna for the clone to really be a clone
otherwise it's just a bunch of spaghetti code

[11:26]

lteo

benDos: just a few details doesn't matter

[11:26]

benDos

Fine
What if i did your ruby and you did my calculus
that seems fair.

[11:26]

kusuriya

benDos: ill do your calculus but you have to do my engineering department application

lteo

you sure you want me to do your calculus? i thought you wanted to graduate ;)

benDos

lteo, i reallllly want to graduate

kyl

whatever, lteo is a doctor... OF SCIENCE
he can make it happen

benDos

Yeah lteo i figured you must be good at calculus

lteo

lol

benDos

I thought you did a lot of crypto stuffs

kyl

lteo is a science hero

qbit

lordy i can't type "make"
comes out mkae every time

[11:28]

benDos

Or not math-y crypto stuff?

[11:28]

lteo

benDos: no brah that was one of my professors. i only did the typesetting for one of the crypto conference proceedings

[11:28]

benDos

Oh
Ok

lteo

i did give a few lectures on crypto though but i've forgotten most of it

benDos

Fine don't do my calculus then
you could have just said that
No need for a long backstory

mcchunkie

That's what c0sh said!

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[11:30]

benDos

Idk that came off as facetious
I'm just cranky today
Sorry

[11:31]

lteo

no worries brah

[11:32]

kusuriya

:P
benDos: stop stressing you get to do funstuff
:)

[11:34]

benDos

What do you mean?
I've been cocking back and swinging my face with great force into the brick wall of calc 2 for too damn long

[11:35]

lteo

you're almost done
never give up! never surrender!

qbit

lteo

thanks to qbit for saying that to me back then

kyl

haha

qbit

thank the super nintendo for saying it to me!

benDos

And after all this i'll have a lonely Bachelors of Art degree

kyl

wew swapping four and a half gigs

kusuriya

lol batchelor of arts

http://opensourceecology.org/

qbit

kusuriya

Science > Art
qbit: ive been following that since they started

benDos

shutup..
I know but that's the degree i'm getting

[11:40]

lteo

at least your degree isn't BS ;)

[11:40]

kusuriya

dont know its a BA most BAs are BS :D

[11:40]

benDos

Tbh it seems to not matter tbh

lteo

it really doesn't

kusuriya

i actually want a BSE
but i need to find the time

benDos

I have a degree in comp sci and if someone talks to me for more than a minute they'll know i'm better than most master's they'll speak to

lteo

funny, because in other countries there are so many Bachelor of (whatever)

benDos

In Futurama there's Bachelor Chow

kusuriya

yeah

benDos

But i don't think that's what you're talking about
gaiz

lteo

my bachelor's degree is Bachelor of Computing ;)

benDos

i'm going back to werk
*whoosh*

BryceBot

Bye benDos!

kusuriya

halo thar guize

lteo

aw
$ ruby poop
ruby: No such file or directory -- poop (LoadError)
oh i misspelled it as pooop

[11:43]

qbit

lol

ribo

lol

benDos

Lol so my class uses math terms not found anywhere else online

kusuriya

lawlz

ribo

hate it when my poop has a load error

benDos

but from out textbook
super cool

lteo

that was fast

ribo

I drank a lot of coffee today though
so my poop should load doublequick

lteo

i don't care what y'all say, but ruby's Array.delete_if is kinda awesome

ribo

it's ok, I love ruby too

lteo

ribo: any opinion on rubinius?

kyl

*ahem* the 'thong's generator expressions
though i am caring less and less about python erraday

qbit

lamb duh

kusuriya

hmm wonder how hard it would be to make an email/calendar notifier using AF_BUS

ribo

lteo: I'll care more when its 1.9 compat

lteo

will you care less and less about Go someday? ;)
ribo: same

kyl

lteo: bro possibly
i'm open to that
i mean, i was all about python until Go came along
a Go-killer is feasible

kusuriya

but ruby is not that

[11:47]

ribo

python people have serious ruby envy

[11:47]

kyl

i didn't
i don't like ruby because i've used it

[11:47]

ribo

they even try to make fun of ruby in comments, hurr hipsters use ruby & wear tight jeans
etc.

kyl

heh

lteo

oops i do wear tight jeans

kusuriya

meh C# > ruby is all i can say

ribo

lol

kyl

they're just jealous because ruby devs are all about ascii dongs and no one points that out

kusuriya

when ruby has an entire OS programmed out of it ill consider chaning my position

kyl

the only thing i use python for anymore is ipython-type tasks
stuff in a repl

kusuriya

man fuck you linux mint
all i want is monodevelop

[11:52]

mcchunkie

aw, where's the pun in that?

[11:52]

lteo

whoa an actual linux mint user found in the wild

[11:52]

ribo

an actual mono user in the wild, too
pretending that C# is relevant
:D

[11:53]

piroko

fucking. mosh. holyshitthisiscool
I keep switching from ethernet to wifi just to watch it reconnect. lol

[11:54]

ribo

lol

[11:55]

benDos

This fucking guy

http://i.imgur.com/X4hbx.jpg

qbit

benDos

benDos hates calc2 so hard

JainAmber

Hullo

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JainAmber

I just had this conversation with my friend:
Friend: All I wish is that there were more hours everyday! ...... Me: As long as elon musk is alive, I think someday we might have days longer than 24 hours! :D
;)

lteo

i like that delayed ;) effect

[12:01]

JainAmber

:D <-- This one also belongs to previous conversation!
(sorry for the delay)
:P <--- My reply to lteo's comment!

[12:02]

piroko

qbit: Fuck you

qbit

wat

piroko

qbit: You made me laugh out loud at work
Now people know

qbit

lol
o/

piroko

I am now going to disconnect my laptop from ethernet, walk my computer over to a friend to show him this image, and then come back and watch mosh reconnect

lteo

aw, piroko exits qbit's friend zone and now piroko is giggling at qbit's jokes over the intarwebs. young love..

benDos

d'awee

qbit

benDos

Woo
Submitting this exam

[12:07]

lteo

yay!

[12:07]

benDos

Which i am near 100% certain i failed
hooray

[12:07]

qbit

higgidy

[12:10]

benDos

Few things frustrate me more than failing math tests cause they disallow the tools I use to do math

[12:10]

qbit

that is totally not math

dbtid

matlab is not allowed on your tests?

benDos

What?

dbtid

sheesh!
bastards.

brycec

This made me literally laugh out loud 13:04:50 <+piroko> qbit: You made me laugh out loud at work

[12:16]

lteo

it made you llol?

[12:17]

piroko

lteo: The huehuahua thing? Yes
I'm currently watching the mosh techincal youtube video. It's really interesting

[12:18]

lteo

piroko: i was referring to brycec's "literally laugh out loud" as "llol"
anything techincal must be interesting
output from my poop script
$ ruby poop
yo
^ that indicates success, yay!

[12:18]

brycec

What if it had output nosotros?

[12:21]

qbit

yo poop!

[12:21]

lteo

does anyone happen to know what protocol java in a browser uses to check if a signed applet is ok?

[12:22]

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benDos

lteo, network protocol or the actual signing?

lteo

netowrk protocl
network protocol

brycec

TCP + SSL cert classes?

benDos

I believe it checks the cert locally

lteo

ah ok

benDos

I'm not 100%
for applets but for java security managers in general
they do local checks

lteo

ok thanks. it kinda makes sense if they already have local CA certs and stuff

[12:24]

piroko

lteo: oh

benDos

I actually thought it relied on the system's crypto perhaps not though

piroko

fuck me. This was one of the best technical presentations I've ever seen

benDos

I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't use your systems trusted ca's

piroko

http://mosh.mit.edu/#techinfo
This guy is a baller

lteo

a ballmer?

[12:27]

benDos

@chairflip
... mcchunkie

[12:28]

brycec

[12:28]

piroko

har har har

[12:28]

benDos

I assume some of you have suggestions for being more productive when living with a significant other?
I've found i get much less work done since my gf moved in
Instead of spending my nights coding cause i don't have something better to do, i do stuff with her

[12:30]

piroko

benDos: There is no suggestion. Enjoy your time with her :)

[12:30]

benDos

I do
But i think at the expense of my classwork

[12:30]

piroko

Tell her you have to get yo shit done

[12:31]

benDos

..oohkay
Maybe i just need to drop off irc till after the semester's over
We'll see

[12:31]

piroko

I liked to go to panera with my (now) wife. She would read reddit or a book or something while I did my homework with my headphones on

benDos

Hmm

piroko

Or when she was in college she would do work too. lol

brycec

Yeah I have the same problem benDos

benDos

Yeah my gf just finished school and i'm not done yet

brycec

though we find time to do our own thing too

benDos

i really just need to better manage time for busywork i have to pay to do
(most of my coursework)

piroko

That's really the key

[12:33]

benDos

I have to write a paper on whether video games are art, and cite it
and shit like that just rubs me the wrong way
Why it matters is perhaps a more interesting question

[12:33]

piroko

why college matters is a question in itself
Also why is it so fucking expensive in the US

[12:33]

benDos

But "Are Video Games Art?" is not interesting or inciteful

[12:34]

piroko

true

[12:34]

benDos

Tbh engineering degrees have a purpose imo
But my cs track also requires i take a bunch of math, the math dept is small so all the upper division math is taught for people who are becoming math teachers
I wish they required more math from cs tbh
Just not taught in a way that expects us to be teaching it to someone else on a blackboard
It's fucking annoying and i don't think i'll be able to get over it

[12:34]

piroko

OK edge tethering + mosh is awesome. I can totally tether to my hearts content, not worry about going over on my data plan, and ssh is still usable
And it makes me feel hipster for using ancient cell technologies

[12:41]

benDos

If you really wanted to feel hipster, you'd master dc

[12:44]

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[12:44]

benDos

qbit, might not even be hipster enough to use dc on a regular basis

[12:45]

piroko

dc?
The calc app?

[12:45]

benDos

Yup
rpn yo

[12:45]

piroko

dude fuck that I have an hp48g and an hp32 sitting on my desk right fucking now

qbit

pish
my calculator uses DC

benDos

...dc is arbitrary precision

qbit

the one true current

benDos

aren't those fixed point piroko?

piroko

benDos: Yes

benDos

So there
When you need to be accurate to 116 decimal places
dc is the app you want

piroko

I'll no longer be a programmer :P

[12:47]

benDos

s/p/b

[12:48]

lazylopez_

I'll no longer be a brogrammer :P

[12:48]

benDos

Idk

[12:48]

qbit

holy mercury water!

[12:49]

benDos

So google translate doesn't speak persian..
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2240160/Irans-navy-showcases-bright-new-warship---damage-wont-coming.html
I was curious if the persian word for turquoise was any manlier
http://translate.google.com/#auto/fa/turquoise does not help.

[12:51]

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[12:54]

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lteo

maybe the iranian elite forces wear turquoise uniforms

[13:11]

benDos

I hope so
I'd lol something fierce

[13:12]

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[13:21]

lteo

benDos: just noticed your rant above. i feel for you bro, the university system is totally broken

[13:29]

kyl

kusuriya: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zhn3rTnpk0g

[13:31]

BryceBot

YouTube News: "Alex Jones money MONKEY BOMB (DANCE LIKE A PRIMATE)" by PRISONFORYOURMIND1 (2m 57s), 830 views, 19 likes and 4 dislikes. Uploaded 2011-03-04T21:16:51.000Z.

[13:31]

qbit

wat

[13:31]

kyl

kusuriya: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct21YCEiWMM

[13:32]

BryceBot

YouTube News: "Alex Jones Goes Ape" by vilemonkey (52s), 25,262 views, 165 likes and 46 dislikes. Uploaded 2010-04-08T01:26:30.000Z.

[13:32]

qbit

wtf

[13:33]

kyl

or, kusuriya, how about https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIjA0qnU_hc

[13:34]

BryceBot

YouTube Entertainment: "Alex Jones's Impression of a Obama supporter (((BEST MOMENT)))" by meegowl (4m 58s), 26,255 views. Uploaded 2009-05-12T14:07:41.000Z.

[13:34]

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[13:39]

ribo

what is this garbage I'm looking at

[13:42]

kyl

i dunno, what garbage are you looking at?

[13:43]

ribo

OH BAWWWWMAAA
guy is a tool lol

kyl

hmm?
oh the alex jones videos

ribo

this stuff you just posted lol

kyl

i'm guessing you don't know who he is

ribo

I don't

kyl

the reason i said " kusuriya: "
was because no one else here knows who he is
dude is hilarious

[13:46]

piroko

It's really fun fucking around with mosh's predictive echo engine
Making it delete my prompt and shit

[13:51]

brycec

oh I know who Alex Jones is... and that's why I didn't waste my time clicking :p

[13:55]

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[13:57]

piroko

I'm gonna leave my mosh session up and sleep my laptop and take my laptop home and see what happens tomorrow when I open it back up at work

[14:02]

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qbit

quick -- someone hack piroko's bidness and disconnect him!

[14:48]

....... (idle for 33mn)

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[15:21]

kyl

yer a quick

[15:23]

..... (idle for 20mn)

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[15:43]

piroko

Opened up laptop after I got home. ssh still connected
Fuck yea

[15:51]

sharvey

aw man
jelly

[15:51]

kyl

jelly you say
does that mean
it's peanut butter and jelly time?

[15:52]

sharvey

jealous

[15:52]

kyl

pfft that's not as much fun as pbj time

[15:53]

piroko

sharvey: Why are you jelly? Install mosh!

[15:55]

benDos

piroko, can you run SOCKS over mosh?
I suppose i could just google that....
neat
seems so

[15:57]

qbit

can you vpn over it? :O

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[17:20]

benDos

"Letting the Internet be rewired by bureaucrats would be like handing a Stradivarius to a gorilla." http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324352004578136902821852508.html
win
the quote anyway

[17:30]

brycec

mmmm... I just averaged 300MB/s write speed to rotating media

benDos

How big of a write?

brycec

bs=128M

benDos

I mean overall

Lefty

how many rotating media?

brycec

benDos: about 40G
Lefty: 4 drives :P
and read was 465MB/s

[17:32]

benDos

Oh across 4 drives yeah that sounds pretty solid
RAID0?

[17:32]

brycec

ZFS zpool

[17:32]

benDos

Hah yeah raidz=<3

brycec

not raidz
just a zpool

benDos

Isn't that the same thing?
I don't do much zfs

brycec

no, raidz is raidz

benDos

I can tell you in detail about the internal caching algorithms it uses for pages but i don't remember the userspace stuff :x

brycec

it's only raidz if you set it up as raidz (zpool create $name raidz blah blah blah)

benDos

gotcha
That's pretty sweet io

brycec

but this is just plain zpool which is a lot like raid0
yeah it is :)

benDos

Gotcha

brycec

now to destroy and test raidz performance

benDos

I get in the mid to upper 200's on my RAID10
That said it's with about 5 year old WD desktop drives
And RAID10 != RAID0 :p

brycec

Now THIS is what I call performance! (fuck yeah caches) 3355443200 bytes transferred in 2.079781 secs (1613363672 bytes/sec)
1.6GB/s

[17:40]

benDos

that doesn't look like bonnie++?

[17:41]

brycec

It's dd
quick and dirty test

[17:41]

mcchunkie

That's what c0sh said!

[17:41]

benDos

Do a quick bonnie test :p

[17:42]

brycec

fine

[17:42]

benDos

Yay
benDos <3's io specifics

[17:42]

brycec, did you catch http://youtu.be/-qv7k2_lc0M ?

[17:47]

BryceBot

YouTube Comedy: "Key & Peele: Obama Loses His SH*T" by comedycentral (2m 48s), 5,327,683 views, 36,878 likes and 2,057 dislikes. Uploaded 2012-01-11T21:11:32.000Z.

[17:47]

brycec

no I didn't bother
brycec doesn't click *every* url
brycec has learned not to click every url

[17:55]

dbtid

you don't???
dbtid hunts for URLs for brycec to click

[17:55]

brycec

lol

[17:55]

kusuriya

http://goatse.cx
:o

[17:56]

brycec

Oooh a .cx, it must be friendly and safe for the family!
@tld cx

BryceBot

The top-level domain 'cx' is used for: Christmas Island.

brycec

kusuriya

brycec: i know thats why goatse lost their domain
:P
and now its owned by some one offering free email ...
...
launch rock needs a lesson in internet history

brycec

woo finalyl starting the rewriting phase

[18:00]

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[18:34]

piroko

benDos: You can???? I imagine that wouldn't work well
Because mosh was programmed specifically with terminal emulation in mind
Also, FUCK MEDIASERVER
er wait
That might actually be because I was playing music today lol

[18:38]

It's pretty neat being able to just open my fucking laptop and have irc just waiting for me

[18:45]

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revberaldo

there are only two good fonts for programming
or whatever

kyl

comic sans and?

revberaldo

and GohuFont

Lefty

wingdings

revberaldo

and the one xterm uses

kyl

lefty is correct
revberaldo loses
i've become a fan of anonymous pro

revberaldo

haha, I'm not playing on level hard

[19:06]

kyl

revberaldo: well, that was your final life, so i guess that's game over
thanks for playing though!

[19:06]

Lefty

Bitstream vera!

[19:06]

revberaldo

does that mean I'll have to wait for respawn time?

kyl

Lefty: i tried it, but it didn't look as good

revberaldo

kyl, it's a good font, but I remember it being not sharp

kyl

revberaldo: you'll have to wait until the next game

revberaldo

I like when fonts look sharp

kyl

revberaldo: i'm looking at it on a retina display... it's sharp
this display has made me much pickier

revberaldo

you mean a display with a decent resolution
well, I don't have one, unfortunately
what's the resolution by the way?

[19:08]

kyl

one sec
1920x1200 on a 15" screen

[19:09]

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[19:10]

kusuriya

hm i thought retina was higher

kyl

not on the mbp

revberaldo

that's pretty good

kyl

kusuriya

yeah

kyl

has already ruined all the backgrounds i had before

kusuriya

i cant argue with it because its awesome, and you have one

kyl

can't set the profound programmer backgrounds anymore
don't get me wrong, i still <3 my x230's 1366xwhatever display
but this is extremely crisp

kusuriya

yeah i wish more people gave the 1920x1200 option

revberaldo

ha, I guess it is

kusuriya

because i really have issues with how apple builds their systems now

revberaldo

you're running OS X?
kusuriya, agreed

kusuriya

the soldered ram is like a giant middle finger

kyl

yes
and i have the thinkpad as my upgradeable system / portable server

[19:14]

revberaldo

Apple hardware looks good and has decent amounts of power. I'd have one. I'd never run OS X though.
my new wallpaper thanks to kyl: http://i.imgur.com/0z831.jpg
it's exactly how it feels to try getting tables and figures in reasonable places in LaTeX

[19:15]

kyl

i have the posters of http://i.imgur.com/ES6sP.jpg and http://i.imgur.com/S4N65.jpg

[19:17]

revberaldo

LOL

[19:19]

kyl

kusuriya: did you see the videos i linked you earlier?

[19:19]

lteo

oh mang you gaiz are making me remember the horrible LaTeX stuff i tried hard to forget

[19:23]

revberaldo

clearpage!
>{centeringarraybackslash}m{5cm}!

[19:24]

kusuriya

kyl: i didnt
but i got them pulled up
man whats really going to irritate me is when intel moves to BGA procs

[19:25]

kyl

lteo: bro never forget!

[19:33]

kusuriya

forgetting is the first step of repeating
im kinda irritated that IWL doesnt seem to do 300 megabit wireless n :(
(on loonix)

[19:35]

lteo

revberaldo: -.-

[19:50]

revberaldo

SI{196,5}{ml}! (that's actually pretty cool)

[19:51]

mwheeler

My resume is still in latex

[19:55]

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mwheeler

I thought about moving it to xml or markdown, but I like the result of my current template

kyl

i wrote my resume in mandoc :o

zenmower

heh we are going to get some mac minis

kyl

zenmower: i have one at work

zenmower

to use in a distributed search cluster project

lteo

i just have unpleasant memories fighting with numerous templates the night before submission deadline

zenmower

kyl: my boss might leave
=(

kyl

kyl pictures lteo in a firefight, desperately pitching his last grenade towards the template in all night running gunfight

zenmower

he got another offer

kyl

nice
good for him

zenmower

yeah
i will be the head nigger in charge

[19:58]

revberaldo

I think we shouldn't use LaTeX for anything that's not going to be published
why not use XML or HTML?
so much better.

kyl

revberaldo: my resumé was published

revberaldo

but I love LaTeX

kyl

mandoc supports html and pdf output

revberaldo

that's a pretty good use of LaTeX, kyl

zenmower

there will be some architecture changes

kyl

revberaldo: but my resumé is not in LaTeX

zenmower

as well as language changes

kyl

zenmower: moar coldfusion

zenmower

as well as i better get moar monies

revberaldo

kyl, it should be!

zenmower

kyl no moar

revberaldo

thing about PDF output

kyl

revberaldo: why? it looks good now
and - it's a man page
they can install it on their computer and look me up whenever

revberaldo

you can't really control typography to the extent you can in LaTeX
apropos kyl

kyl

but i don't need to control typography, i pretty much just print the plain text version anyways
and give that to people

[20:01]

revberaldo

kyl, that's such a cool idea

[20:01]

kyl

there's very few people who *won't* accept a .txt file

revberaldo

I'll print the plain latex
and give THAT to people

kyl

revberaldo: i didn't say the source, i said the plain text version

revberaldo

if YOU'RE gonna hire me, you'd better be prepared
kyl, I know, I'm just stretching the idea

kyl

typical

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[20:09]

brycec

huh wtf? bonnie++ on my FreeBSD box is 1.96, and on my Arch box it's 1.03e. how the hell does that work?

[20:17]

wb zdo
benDos: Since you were interested http://sprunge.us/IWZQ

[20:24]

qbit

hummina!

[20:26]

brycec

(SSD - 3x 120GB SATA II drives)

[20:27]

qbit

YOURANSS!
D

[20:27]

brycec

(RAIDZ1/NONRAIDZ - 4x 2TB SATA II drives hanging off a RAID controller as JBOD, PCIe x8)
now what the heck is qbit prattling on abotu?

[20:28]

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[20:29]

brycec

damnit I have never found Tina Fey more attractive than i do now
fantastic ep
of 30 Rock

[20:31]

kyl

that show is still running?

[20:31]

brycec

yes
yes, it is.
season 7, ep 7
more surprisingly, The Office is in season 9

[20:32]

qbit

I find her fantastically attractive

[20:33]

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[20:33]

brycec

qbit: Tina Fey dressed up as Princess Leia, blammo.

kyl

s/f/m/

lazylopez_

qbit: Tina Fey dressed up as Princess Leia, blammo.

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qbit

lol

brycec

i know it's not the first time, but she looked better this time... but I can't tell you ;)

[20:35]

revberaldo

need to relearn irssi

[20:36]

jrick

omg
I got go-gtk working on 64-bit windows
jrick laughs maniacially

[20:37]

brycec

nice jrick

[20:38]

kyl

heh
i do not envy you

[20:38]

jrick

but this means I can use golang for my serior design project

[20:39]

brycec

your sr design project being... reimplementing Xombrero in Go?

jrick

no, I wish.

qbit

qbit imagines jrick designing old people

jrick

we building a robot to paint football fields
and I'm writing the gui frontend
the controller program
communicates wireless using XBees to the robot
wirelessly

qbit

nicee

[20:41]

brycec

brycec imagines the robot going rogue and painting football fields EVERYWHERE

[20:41]

jrick

it's pretty sweet, using lazers for localized navigation

[20:42]

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[20:43]

qbit

:D
that is pretty sweet

[20:45]

jrick

wow
laser*

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qbit

majorlazor

jrick

it's ok guys I'm an engineer no need to spell