haha yeah
mhoran: the only reason 40 Gbps Ethernet became a thing was because the backplane in Cisco switches couldn't go higher than that.  And aren't they a big player in IEEE ?  So it was codified and everyone was like, " wtf fuck you"..  because they held back adoption of 100 Gbps ethernet
mercutio: that Arista...  it makes no sense to have 40x 100 Gbps but only 8x 40 Gbps..  the uplinks are a bottleneck
brycec: looks like I can ping one of your IPs now (yay!)
up_the_irons: that's why i thought it might be a typo it just seemed odd
but the datasheet matched
up_the_irons: What a wonder when systemd actually starts!
(much smoother now that I can SSH in)
that's always my worst fear after my arp box has been running for 2 years
6 months in my case
Upside: zfs snapshots are kept for 6 months
I was shocked everything started back up without any intervention after the cage move the other day
You lucky duck :P
well well well... The March 1st snap is good, the April 1st snap has a busted /sbin/init
wow how did /sbin/init get corrupted
hack?
mercutio: maybe the data sheet is wrong? hahha
Went from being a symlink to some old-ass sysvinit
(narrowed it down to sometime between March 1st and March 25th... because I only keep 30 daily snaps)
you think the result of an upgrade?
Must be?
(No evidence of unauthorized access)
that system must have been installed a long time ago if it has any sysvinit binaries anywhere near it :P
I mean, it's Debian, so...
heh
bit of a change of subject but
has ARP ever thought about buying ARM server hardware?
pretty niche atm, but aws is offering it now
Found a forum post (two, in fact) that described what happened precisely \o/ https://forum.proxmox.com/threads/upgrade-to-kernel-4-15-18-12-pve-goes-boom.52564/#post-243333
might be cool to get in ahead
brycec: so it was zfs's fault in the end :P
(sort of)
shuddup :P
*packagers
i wonder if the idea of the 8 uplinks is to connect to legacy 40gigabit networks for your 100 gigabit supercomputer cluster up_the_irons ?
"pve goes boom" hahahah
acf_: never thought much about it...  i'm so tired of buying hardware
it's the opposite of an investment...  if you want to make sure your money runs the other way of inflation, buy technology
I suppose it is a necessary evil though
buying hardware
https://www.gigabyte.com/ARM-Server/R150-T62-rev-10
I wouldn't say buying is "necessary" - there's always theft :P
this looks like it's roughly US$5,000
or, more legally, leasing :P
cool thing about these arm boxes is they seem to have a ton of cores
so I presume you can dedicate 1 core to each of 47 customer VMs
on a single blade
I've learned that to survive in this biz, you have to let someone else eat the depreciation.  so, after AWS or Google offload 10,000 of these boxes onto eBay, then we'll buy some haha
hahaha fair enough
that's how I buy my laptops actually
always off ebay, and always at least 2 generations old
price is like 1/10th and the box is good as new
yup
I'm still using my Lenovo T520 which I got for $240
I had another T520, which a client had bought me years earlier, and it was $1800 new
ah damn that's good
I was using an ebay X250 until recently
nice
I decided I needed 16GB for all my chromium tabs so I upgraded to a 5th gen X1 carbon, also off ebay
Not to mention by waiting, there's either an established market for $newtech or you know it's a flop and not to waste your money :)
spoiler: chromium figured out how to eat the 16gb
chrome is such a huge memory hog
i've started using firefox sometimes now
it seems to be getting worse and worse
computer cpus have hardly been rising in speed
they've actually been getting slower over time with all of these spectre/meltdown workarounds
https://unixcube.org/who/acf/tmp/images/screen/top-1.png
this pretty much describes it :P
there's very little performance boost from ddr3 to ddr4
graphics cards have improved
chromium chromium chromium chromium chromium java chromium
nvme is stupidly fast for disk
but single threaded processing speed struggles to make much improvement
acf_: I have a tab addiction too
and most code still isn't designed to parallelise well
the main benefit to performance ordinary users get now is things like JIT compiling of javascript
I think it's time I leave the DC...  it's been another like 12 hour day here
if people coded for performance like they did in amiga days computers would probably rocket along
yikes, yeah time to go home :P
:)
must be working quite hard with all this migration stuff recently
mercutio: haha yeah
acf: there's a lot of little things
acf_: certainly, it's been a whirlwind
but things are becoming simpler
You basically start over, but with a fresh design
ipv6 and ipv4 terminate on the same router
and you take what you learned over the years and make changes
yeah all that plus the cage move
our setup is soooooooo much simpler now; not quite as redundant, but the areas where we built redundancy before, in over 10 years, never needed it
our s1.lax still has over 10 years uptime
also we have spares so we can still resolve any issues quick
s1.lax uptime is 10 years, 9 weeks, 4 days, 13 hours, 10 minutes
10 years is the standard service life of industrial electronics
it will go down, not due to failure, but because we simply don't need it anymore
I'm going to keep it in my living room for a while
hhahaah
and because it's physically huge
I'll rest my feet on it
G'night #arpnetworks thanks for your help tonight. My server is back to its normal working order.
it's also 10 years of doing a lot of changes to config
with no flash failures or anything
brycec: cool!!  great to hear!
mercutio: yeah.. not even a RAM failure
s3 on the other hand
s3 is gone
s3.lax was just a software router (OpenBSD)
and yeah, s3 is dead
oh s3 was the software router
for some reason I never made that connection
yeah
iirc it was the one that always kept crashing :P
s3, then s32, then r2
we have hardware forwarding of ipv6 now
but r2 performance was fine
acf_: b/c of Any2 IX terminating on it?   That was actually s7.lax, a Cisco 6506.  But it never crashed after we took Any2 off it
it's just we get to consolidate
yeah
ohh I must be thinking of s7 then
yeah it must have had some bug
t\hat was a long time ago
haha feels like yesterday
but it's done pretty well recently
s7.lax uptime is 4 years, 36 weeks, 3 days, 23 hours, 49 minutes
acf_: see how time flies?
especially when you haven't been on the irc in 3 years :P
yeah irc isn't as active as it used to be
alright guys, I'm gonna head out too...  too much data center noise for today
well the +r really reduced user count
 but we had to do it b/c of the spam
well even before that it was pretty quiet
yeah I remember going on here for a minute during the supermicro thing
irc logs had been basically empty for days
supermicro things?
"the big hack"
oh right
seems like it's picked back up a bit the last week or so with all the stuff going on though
a little
https://danluu.com/input-lag/
re what you were saying earlier
you've seen this yeah?
have you done the reaction speed test?
https://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime
what i found most interesting was that my reaction time would get slower when i was tired, but i didn't feel like my reaction time was slower
looks like I'm at roughly 300ms right now
it's kind of like how they say that driving sleep deprived can be as bad as driving drunk
i'm usally aruond 220
i'm like 280 when tired
mouse can make a difference though
some add like 20 msec latency
thinkpad integrated trackpoint for me
249 now
oh and screen can make a difference too
but if you use the same device and test yourself against yourself you can see how much you vary
oh also reaction times tend to be quicker when you're younger
lol I get like 500ms on my phone
yeah phones are notorious for lag
it's all accumulative also
so there's the input device latency plus the screen latency plus the os/software latency
also you can speed your reaction up slightly by turning your head the side slightly and using peripheral vision
hmm my older thinkpad I get 230ms
yeh device makes a difference
so 70msec changing device? :)
so like if you ssh'ed half way across the world you might notice a difference on your slower device vs your faster
but if you ssh'ed to a computer in the same city as you you probably won't
yeah that's a lot of latency
i think if you play first person shooter games as a kid you'll tend to have faster reaction times too.  but at the same time if you have slow reaction times you probably hate first person shooters.
hahaha yeah I've never played fps
probably any twitch type games would help it
ever played vvvvvv?
or sporting things that use reaction time
nope
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/52/VVVVVV_-_The_Tomb_of_Mad_Carew.png
only game that comes to mind I've played that requires good reaction times
i've been playing factorio  recently
which isn't really reaction time game
oh yeah old games used to be so hard!
and there would be things like you die once and you go back to the start of the game
actually that's my favourite thing about vvvvvv
that little "C" there is a checkpoint
they're quite often
ahh
you only go back to that, and there is no concept of lives
yaeh i think checkpoints were nice tbh
so you can just keep trying until you make it
otherwise I'd give up after 5 minutes :P
i think games used to be too hard
but now they're too easy instead generally
can't stand re-doing a whole level because I hit a spike
yeh
that was so common though!
I guess it instils discipline
well also less code
haha really
well things like sega master system had kilobytes of code i think?
like 20k?
yeah back in the day when video games were written in assembly
well sega soem games were bigger than others
it has 8kb ram 16kb vram
so yeah i wouldn't be surprised if games were 20k
20k including graphics?
idk the code and graphics would probably be stored on rom right?
oh they went up to 1024kb
yeah so the roms can be quite big
surprising
yeah small ram makes sense
quite a few old amiga games didn't use the whole floppy
like pre native games
the performance vs laziness (or "work") tradeoff you mentioned earlier is pretty interesting
hmm the sega master system came out at $200
that's cheaper than i thought
i wonder what equivilent that is now
yeah around 2001 or so languages liek perl, pyhton etc were taking off a lot
using lots of ram and having subpar performance
java is what really comes to mind
heh
yeah
when you say lots of ram and subpar performance
so java when it came out was really slow
but that would have started in the 90s yeah?
so android is java
yeah in the 90s
solaris used to be called slowaris
it was always a little sluggish
linux had a reputation for being fast and unstable
solaris for being slow and reliable
but lots of old solaris programs would fail pretty badly at times
java's awful performance seems to have kept up with improvements in computing power somehow
yeah there's been so many new versions
eclipse is still super slugish and uses all my ram
and it still seems to be kind of sluggish.  also the amonut of ram programs use these days is insane
ios vs android is actually a good example of compiled vs jit code
yeah well some people thought it would be a good idea
there are some situations where ios is a lot better than android
like running a bit of code when a phone has to wake up
to make desktop applications in html / javascript and ship and entire chrome installation with them
so like if your phone is mostly idle... you can turn the cpu on for a fraction of a second and not actually warm up the caches
so you leave your caches cold to use less power
hm
so when you have compiled code it's much easier to stay within a tight cache instruction window
and that can directly transfer to better idle power consumption
although there are other tricks in use too, like wifi will do arps etc with hardware offload
afaik today Android's Java runtime actually does ahead of time compiling
oh it does doesn't it
although no idea about performance. I'm sure there is still tons of overhead from the java rutime
but yeah .. so iphones actually end up having less ram than android phones
for similar performance level
yeah I'm not surprised
mfw my phone has a higher display resolution and more ram than my laptop
heh my tablet is 2560x1600"
my phone is 2560x1440
my laptop was 1366x768 until earlier this year
my monitors are 2560x1440s too
now 1920x1080
my laptop is 1920x1080 too
phone is 2560xSomething
my phone is from 2014 hah
galaxy note 4
ahh nice
it's not a bad phone
i think it has like 3gb of ram
until last year I had a Nokia windows phone from 2013
if MS had continued supporting the platform I would have continued buying it
yeah 3gb
but oh well
my friend who works for google was saying that windows phone was good
yeah tbh I think people don't give it a chance
because desktop windows sucks, and it has the same name
it's odd, he used to (probably still does) use openbsd etc.
so then he comes and tells me windows phone is good
and i'm like hmm..
haha yeah. I run linux on all my laptops, etc.. and (used to) windows on all my phones
apparently it's been canceled
yeah that was sad
so it's good?
imo it was very good
curious
i wonder why it never took off
i suppose lack of apps
yeah that's probably the big one
actually i know someone else who said that it was good but he's a windows fan boy
my thing is I don't like installing a ton of random apps anyway so I'm fine with it
yeh i don't ilke too many apps either
imo the Android UX used to be awful
i hardly use my phone compared to a lot of people it seems
i tried to add a contact the other day and i had to figure out where everything was :)
like I remember samsung long ago
it's odd you go down the bottmo left to contacts.. then to the top right to add
swiping through the 3 screens of apps trying to find the one I wanted
it just seems a weird ui
on WP, I'd just search the first 3 characters
like human eye goes top left to bottom right normally
so a goood way to confuse people is go bottom left to top right
for phones swyping from the left etc isn't actually that bad a way of doing things
pushing your thumb bottom left seems odd though
also you have a samsung right
yeah
so they make everything novel
iirc samsung replaces all the default android stuff with super shit samsung stuff
yeah it does
some of it's nice
last I checked (galaxy 8) they still do it
and it's still bad
but some of it's just odd
one of my biggest peeves with them
yeah i dunno some things are nice on it though
is their software all updates separately from the both the "system" and the Google store
yeah i wish they did more updates
it's like the least you could do is have a unified update mechanism
note 4 has been abandoned pretty much
all this inconsistency just feels gross
and the newer notes are kind of lame
like they took out microsd and replaceable battery
I heard note 7 is good
like i have a replacement battery on my phone
i don't have a microsd, but i like the option none the less.
i used to use a microsd with phones
but i just don't want to store lots on it anyway
yeah I just get a big internal flash and use that
microsd is kinda slow r/w performance anyway
oh wow apparently it does 24bit/192khz audio
yeah there is uhs-1 that speeds things up a bit but it's not supported on most older phones
also sdcard doesn't tend to have good wear levelling
brycec: did you notice openbsd 6.5 upgrade was weirdly fast?
i think openbsd must have improved their disk performance...
i can't see anyhting in the release notes about why though
It was fast!
I always accidentally pull from the default ftp4 and have to restart from a reasonable mirror
oh i did it from mirrors.arpnetworks.com
but the pulling/installing bit seemed to be noticably less sluggish
Hacking on virtio(4), including defines, bug fixing and pci device list.
wonder if that was it
Ah nice. Yeah I've got it on a pcengines box
Home router :)
ah
is pcengines x86?
It's an amd64 clone iirc
ah ok
Apu.4
i saw they just moved mips to clang
oh i think they moved to the clang linker too
so compiling should be faster...
Yeah
Every time I upgrade obsd something breaks work dhcpcd, which I need for ipv6 :(
odd
But the maintainer is great and super responsive
they changed openbgpd quite a lot in 6.4
I'm probably one of like 3 people using it
it's kind of cool that they're active, but yeah can require kind of lot mangling to get things right sometimes
has anyone else upgraded to OpenBSD on a VM yet?
up_the_irons: something seems wrong with the ARP DNS servers? My monitoring is going crazy because of timeouts and it seems to be to do with reverse DNS resolution.
Changing to 1.1.1.1 resolved.
you can tag me too mhoran  ;)
reverse dns on what?
Postfix.
i can resolve 1.1.1.1 fine on both the arp dns servers
I had the ARP servers in /etc/resolv.conf and my SMTP checks were timing out. I changed resolv.conf to 1.1.1.1 and they're good again. telnet to matthoran.com 587 was taking ~5s to get a banner, which IIRC is the resolv.conf timeout before it tries another server.
weird
yeh the default is stupid high
3 seconds is better now days