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| Who | What | When |
|---|---|---|
| brycec | brycec is now hosting/serving http2. Why? because why not. | [00:12] |
| kellytk | brycec: Via Nginx? | [00:17] |
| .... (idle for 17mn) | ||
| brycec | Yep
Upgraded from jessie-backports' 1.9.4 to nginx.org's 1.9.9 Word to the wise: nginx.org's nginx package doesn't 'conflict' with nginx-common or nginx-full | [00:34] |
| mercutio | oh god
nginx likes to really screw with config if you use their packages. i mean if you go from ubuntu/debian to nginx. i've been hit by that before too. i did one test with http2. it didn't seem any faster. didn't really look into it further. err faster than spdy that is. mercutio can't remember specifics; i wouldn't mind so much if my config didn't get broken :) | [00:39] |
| brycec | No biggie on the configuration, just told Debian to keep my existing configs. sed s/spdy/http2/ and I was good to go. | [00:41] |
| mercutio | hmm maybe it's better now, i seem to remember it overwriting or such | [00:42] |
| brycec | And I didn't expect it to be faster or anything, but figured I might as well stay current. Especially as Chrome is supposed to be dropping SPDY support (in favour for h2) next year. | [00:42] |
| mercutio | yeah it doesn't hurt. | [00:42] |
| brycec | Oooh I'd raise hell if it overwrote configs. (though I keep my configure modularized too, to minimize that sort of nuisance) | [00:43] |
| mercutio | i might just have to try it somewhere else again to see if it still does breakage.
i also haven't tried php7 yet. i haven't found myself using php for anything personal. i'm thinking 2x... faster.. wouldn't it be great if smokeping was 2x faster... oh wait a moment.. smokeping uses perl. | [00:43] |
| brycec | Nothing like using spdy/h2 to serve a single static jpg. All that asynchronous pipelining and what do I use it for most? A single image file. :D | [00:44] |
| mercutio | heh. | [00:44] |
| brycec | lol perl | [00:44] |
| mercutio | yeah i'm not a huge fan.
speaking of making things faster, i've been build a home test network with 10gbe :) i was kind of surprised i managed to route an iperf at 9.91gigabit/sec. | [00:44] |
| brycec | I've been doing lots and lots of Ruby lately (because $job) and enjoying it. Still much more fluent with PHP, and there are things I don't like about Ruby (starting with DSLs), but it's quickly taking over as my scripting language of choice, surprisingly quickly.
Sweet | [00:45] |
| mercutio | i'm pretty rusty on php myself. | [00:45] |
| brycec | I'm totally rusty on Rust :p | [00:46] |
| mercutio | i kind of don't do much coding anymore. i've done more c than anything php-like. | [00:46] |
| brycec | (having never written any) | [00:46] |
| mercutio | i don't quite understand why people say that c is complicated. | [00:46] |
| brycec | Because you can't "echo 'Hello world'" | [00:46] |
| mercutio | i find most of the complexity comes from the problem you're dealing with rather than the language.
true, but hello world isn't that difficult. i used to try and tell people that assembler was one of the simplest languages though... | [00:46] |
| brycec | Most of the complexity in C (to me) is knowing which #includes I need for given functions | [00:47] |
| mercutio | yeah the include system is a nightmare.
as far as learning languages goes, assembler is pretty easy really. | [00:48] |
| brycec | Not that scripting languages are any different, but at least they include their stdlib by default so I can print/echo/puts/whatever :p | [00:48] |
| mercutio | there's less guessing / unknowns.
it's just more long-winded to do stuff. but the base complexity is low. then you take these high level languages and you're looking at code and you have no idea what it does :) what bugged me about php at first was the whole echo/print thing why is there echo, and print! when using it more, it bugged me that people kept sticking php code in the middle of html though. which i think is kind of the point of php? i do like this new shift happening towards web applications rather than individual self-contained pages. y'know one thing i've noticed about ruby is that no-one that's used it has said how much they hated it.. | [00:48] |
| BryceBot | <mercutio> tudtultvcud tsubcnus tfdu appcbtboudtnardsuncbuappltcadttbsurad crud abutbdtvtdualusclf-ctbdatbcdupaocs. | [00:54] |
| mercutio | perl and php on the other hand..
and with programmers tending to be pretty open about things they dislike that is actually quite noteworthy. | [00:54] |
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| mike-burns | I've really wanted to hate Ruby, but it turns out I still like it. | [02:00] |
| mercutio | heh | [02:05] |
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| brycec | I hated on Ruby for a long time until I sat down and really started using it... | [11:26] |
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| kellytk | I look forward to using Swift outside of Apple's platform. Specifically for web apps | [12:16] |
| mike-burns | Really? | [12:16] |
| kellytk | I've been producing a web app using Node.js and JS for the past six months and I miss static typing
Since Apple announced it would be open-sourced earlier this year | [12:17] |
| mike-burns | It is open source. | [12:17] |
| kellytk | Yes, it is
I may have not understood you there | [12:17] |
| .... (idle for 16mn) | ||
| PostgreSQL 9.5 nears (http://www.postgresql.org/about/news/1631/) | [12:34] | |
| mike-burns | Oh, I see what you're saying now. Yes, we agree.
Though we disagree on excitement about using Swift outside of Apple. | [12:35] |
| kellytk | https://github.com/apple/swift/commits/master I love the smell of commitlogs in the morning
Which language(s) do you prefer to use? | [12:36] |
| mike-burns | Ruby, C, Haskell, Python, Rust, sh, Scheme, probably others.
I'd love to find a use for Idris. | [12:38] |
| mercutio | i like how you put C between Ruby and Haskell :) | [12:41] |
| kellytk | Do you think Rust is capable of displacing C for new systems engineeering work? | [12:41] |
| mike-burns | Nah. | [12:41] |
| mercutio | it feels out of place haha | [12:41] |
| mike-burns | Heh, C, Ruby, and Haskell all occupy the same "mainstream coding paradigm" part of my coding mind.
But Rust doesn't have system calls, so I don't see why it would be used for systems coding. | [12:42] |
| kellytk | Another 40 years for C! | [12:43] |
| mike-burns | C is fun. | [12:43] |
| mhoran | Agreed. | [12:44] |
| kellytk | I sure like it | [12:44] |
| mhoran | I enjoy having to do systems programming so I can justify using it. | [12:44] |
| mercutio | i prefer systems programming myself
low level is easier than high level | [12:45] |
| mike-burns | I don't get to use C at work. I sneak it in, but I have no reason to. | [12:45] |
| mercutio | yeh people get put off by using C for work | [12:45] |
| mike-burns | Especially for Web programming. | [12:46] |
| mercutio | i don't know if it's always fair. but the strongest arguement these days seems to be that most people don't want to do C. | [12:46] |
| kellytk | Haha | [12:46] |
| mercutio | or don't know the language or whatever. | [12:46] |
| mhoran | I use Go and C#/C++ at work these days (guess which platform I'm on!) | [12:46] |
| mercutio | so that maintaining it is more complicated. | [12:46] |
| mike-burns | C#? | [12:46] |
| mhoran | Yup. | [12:46] |
| mike-burns | Wild. | [12:46] |
| mercutio | mhoran: a piano! | [12:46] |
| mhoran | Sure is! | [12:46] |
| BryceBot | That's what she said!! | [12:46] |
| mhoran | mercutio: you got it! | [12:47] |
| mercutio | i've never used c#. | [12:47] |
| kellytk | mhoran: Do you think Go could replace C? | [12:47] |
| mhoran | No. | [12:47] |
| mike-burns | Do you think Go could replace Python? | [12:47] |
| mhoran | Yes. | [12:47] |
| mercutio | but people who like c# talk about it similar to people who like ruby.
the general sentiment of enthusiasm is there. | [12:47] |
| mhoran | Agreed.
I'd prefer to write Ruby in this particular case, but ruby is an outcast on this project, and it's tough to do Windows systems programming in Ruby. We have a C++ interface exposed via a WebSockets API in C# to a Go library and daemon that interfaces with a protobuf backend. I think we've got all the things covered. | [12:47] |
| mike-burns | Wowzers.
I like protobufs. | [12:49] |
| mhoran | So does Go. | [12:49] |
| mercutio | what happened to corba ? | [12:50] |
| mike-burns | Heh. | [12:50] |
| mhoran | Can't say I miss that. | [12:50] |
| kellytk | It went the way of WAP I think | [12:50] |
| mercutio | a quick look into protobufs reminded of corba :) | [12:50] |
| mike-burns | But CORBA didn't have a giant company behind it? | [12:51] |
| mercutio | not that it looks to be the same :) | [12:51] |
| mhoran | I met with a client the other day who is struggling to go agile with their C# web-app to mainframe API.
Apparently the mainframe programmers aren't on board with continuous delivery. | [12:51] |
| mike-burns | I did a Perl Web app-to-mainframe API! It sucked. | [12:51] |
| kellytk | They simply lack cloud synergy | [12:51] |
| mercutio | i used to think iot'd be really cool to have distributed applications over computers
but everything's shifted to containers instead :/ and vm's etc | [12:51] |
| mike-burns | Distributed programming is really, really hard. | [12:52] |
| mhoran | It's always a cycle; we'll be back to it! | [12:52] |
| mercutio | mike yeh
but so is smp etc | [12:52] |
| mike-burns | Also true.
Hence, OpenBSD is still mostly non-paralleled. | [12:52] |
| mercutio | i'm not saying it's necessarily the solution to performance or anything | [12:53] |
| mhoran | Go makes SMP easier (especially compared to C.) That's about the only benefit I see. | [12:53] |
| kellytk | Network Programming Barbie says "Distributed programming is really, really hard" | [12:53] |
| mercutio | but it seems like a nifty thing :) | [12:53] |
| mike-burns | Rust make SMP safer, but so does Haskell.
Oh and also: Erlang. (And Elixir.) | [12:53] |
| kellytk | And https://bitbucket.org/trijezdci/m2r10 | [12:57] |
| mike-burns | Oh nice. | [12:57] |
| kellytk | I've been following it for a couple of years. The principles have put a lot of work into it | [12:57] |
| mercutio | damn there are a lot of languages :) | [13:00] |
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| kellytk | Great isn't it | [13:57] |
| ....................................................................... (idle for 5h52mn) | ||
| mnathani | "not doing SAV by default for all new customers,"
what would SAV stand for here? @google SAV means | [19:49] |
| BryceBot | 420,000 total results returned for 'SAV means', here's 3
SAV - Definition by AcronymFinder (http://www.acronymfinder.com/SAV.html) 27 definitions of SAV. Meaning of SAV. What does SAV stand for? SAV abbreviation. Define SAV at AcronymFinder.com. What does SAV stand for? (http://www.abbreviations.com/SAV) Looking for the definition of SAV? Find out what is the full meaning of SAV on Abbreviations.com! The Web's largest and most authoritative acronyms and ... Sav | Define Sav at Dictionary.com (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sav) Sav definition at Dictionary.com, a free online dictionary with pronunciation, synonyms and translation. Look it up now! | [19:49] |
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| mnathani | http://root-servers.org/news/events-of-20151130.txt | [20:58] |
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| mercutio | 420k results hah
i actually have no idea mnathani. | [21:35] |
| mnathani | it was on the dns-operations mailing list | [21:36] |
| mercutio | you read a lot of technical mailing lists :)
i wonder if it's some dnssec thing or something source address validiation | [21:36] |
| mnathani | here it is being said again, perhaps you can read into the context"
in other words, the only people who can measure SAV compliance are the operators and customers of networks who do not have SAV compliance. and in general, not caring about one means you don't care about the other, either. so basic BCP-38 stuff? | [21:38] |
| mercutio | yeah it seems
i thought it meant acl's on dns servers for customers on other peoples networks err like how anyone can use 4.2.2.2 etc. but it seems that it's basically bcp-38 and about spoofing | [21:38] |
| mnathani | did you see the link I posted about the DDOS on root name servers? | [21:39] |
| mercutio | root-servers.org?
didn't check it out | [21:39] |
| mnathani | yea | [21:39] |
| mercutio | the nameservers are so stupidly overprovisioned it's not funny
from a user pov i'm not relaly worried. err the root nameservers did you see me post about dynect dns? | [21:39] |
| mnathani | you would need to take them all out for a week to impact users | [21:40] |
| mercutio | dynect had some strange weird partial outage.
and apparently twitter and paypal and various other sites use them. i know you read a lot of random mailing lists so you may have seen it heh | [21:40] |
| mnathani | you posted on the mailing list? | [21:42] |
| mercutio | nah on another mailing lists
-s but you read a few :) cool you didn't see it. hah | [21:42] |
| mnathani | did you use your name? | [21:43] |
| mercutio | not terribly exciting.
yeah i think so? it was on ausnog. you read a few don't you? :) no hangon it was on nznog nznog hardly ever has anything technical on it :/ | [21:43] |
| mnathani | I might not have nznog on this alias
but on another should be there | [21:44] |
| mercutio | ahh | [21:45] |
| mnathani | 6/18/13 | [21:45] |
| mercutio | yeah i like to consider myself anonymous when i post on the internet in general | [21:45] |
| mnathani | I have a nanog reply from that date | [21:45] |
| mercutio | it's kind of scary to think that everything is out there forever.
so the supermarket finally has 4g here. but i still have none at home :( | [21:45] |
| it's kind of crazy here how 4g is starting to be similar in performance to peoples home internet | [21:56] | |
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