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| Who | What | When |
|---|---|---|
| brycec | Well it's not trivial... And the name is typically already there, as the domain component of the hostname
(I haven't looked to see if the lg passes -n) | [00:32] |
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| pyvpx | isnt the skype infra still very separated from the rest of MSFT? | [00:52] |
| brycec | To my knowledge, yes, but I doubt it will stay that way. Like most things, it will eventually get folded in, one way or another. | [00:53] |
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| mercutio | mnathani: probably in theory if someone was to modify the code
mnathani: not sure of the best way to get a list of numbers to naem mappings - i usually use whois, but there may be limits to crawling that. http://bgp.potaroo.net/cidr/autnums.html ahh found this flags destination gateway lpref med aspath origin I 8.8.8.0/24 208.79.88.2 200 0 15169 [GOOGLE] g so saying something like that would be fine? like [GOOGLE] etc for the diff providers after the numbers. i wonder if it's better to change the looking glass or bgp show rib | [02:15] |
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| cpet | pjs ! | [11:04] |
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| fink | yo RandalSchwartz
RandalSchwartz: do you happen to have your Virtualbox configs for your arpnetworks VPS's at hand? i'd like to compare notes | [11:09] |
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| mnathani | mercitio: yeah something like [GOOGLE]
or even hyperliks to bgp. he. net./as15169 etc for each AS in the path mercutio ^ | [15:33] |
| mercutio | well that file i found has names like that.
i think hacking in support to bgpctl show rib is probably best but then people will want traceroute support :) bgpctl show rib is show ip bgp just more people understand it when it's said show ip bgp my openbsd instance doesn't have a useful route table. so i need to get that sorted, then i could try implementing it on there first. but i'm pulled in a few directions atm | [15:35] |
| staticsafe | I 192.67.222.0/24 208.79.88.135 100 51 2914 12179 62638 i
usually I don't see Internap in the best AS path | [15:37] |
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| up_the_irons | to quickly find ASN info: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/up_the_irons/arpnet-toolbox/master/asn.sh
I just type "asn.sh <foo>" | [16:04] |
| mercutio | up_the_irons: what do you think about me modifying traceroute / bgpctl to show from db the name?
i imagine it shouldn't be too difficult. actually, as a first step, i suppose the footer could have something that does a javscript query to do a lookup where you manually type in the ones you're curious about | [16:04] |
| up_the_irons | not something i'm going to worry about, but feel free to take a stab at it if you like. keep in mind people are using the lg now, so treat it as such (e.g. no breaking it ;) | [16:06] |
| mercutio | up_the_irons: yeah, i'd do it somewhere else first. | [16:06] |
| up_the_irons | cool | [16:06] |
| mercutio | on that note, can i get a copy of the routing table on my vps? | [16:06] |
| up_the_irons | ? | [16:07] |
| mercutio | just another peer | [16:07] |
| up_the_irons | like, you want to peer with it? | [16:07] |
| mercutio | i could get a peer from somewhere else to test.
yeah peer with it and get full table. | [16:07] |
| up_the_irons | go ahead and peer with yourself | [16:07] |
| mercutio | ok :) | [16:07] |
| up_the_irons | that sounds kinda dirty. dunno why... | [16:07] |
| mercutio | i probably can't look at this until weekend.
hahaha | [16:07] |
| up_the_irons | no worries | [16:08] |
| mercutio | i was also thinking that it'd be kind of useful to be able to do a few quick lookups
and traces. like google, etc. and back to yourself. | [16:08] |
| BryceBot | That's what she said!! | [16:08] |
| up_the_irons | BryceBot: no | [16:08] |
| BryceBot | Oh, okay... I'm sorry. 'and back to yourself.' | [16:08] |
| brycec | s/e.g./ie./ | [16:09] |
| BryceBot | <mercutio> likie.ogle, etc. | [16:09] |
| brycec | d'oh | [16:09] |
| mercutio | like he.net's looking glass makes it quick/easy to traceroute back to yourself. | [16:09] |
| up_the_irons | lol | [16:09] |
| mercutio | but yeah the name thing actually kind of bugs me
i just do whois AS<as number> and remember 2914, 174, etc. like a few of them. | [16:09] |
| up_the_irons | did u guys see that Level 3 bought TWTelecom? | [16:10] |
| mercutio | yeah
i dunno what it means, other than way more data centres. do twtelecom have a large network? | [16:10] |
| brycec | I'd assume TWT is the backbone for Time Warner Cable... but that's an uninformed assumption.
[in which case, perhaps a better network experience for those customers] | [16:12] |
| mercutio | when level3 got announced i got way more traffic on anycast for some reason.
it was surprising. i added prepends. | [16:13] |
| brycec | "tw telecom was originally founded as Time Warner Communications in 1993 as a joint venture between US West and Time Warner Cable. Time Warner Telecom rapidly evolved into a business provider specializing in fiber-based last mile solutions."
(So... separate) | [16:14] |
| mercutio | i was reading something interesting about fiber providers in the US having huge costs to get government permission for laying cables.
doubling the cost etc. and google somehow managed to bypass all of it. | [16:15] |
| brycec | mercutio: Is that long-haul fibre? | [16:16] |
| mercutio | but i'd hate to feel like i was forced onto google fiber myslef.
brycec: yeah i think so we say fibre here, but i realise it's kind of us-centric here :) | [16:16] |
| brycec | I was unaware that Google had long-haul fibre of their own
I say fibre too, because I can spell :P | [16:16] |
| mercutio | well i imagine they need it to go between neighbourhoods.
and it looked like google may haev fiber from kanas to dallas, chicago, san jose kansas sucks for transit from what i could tell. | [16:17] |
| brycec | That would be news to me, since there's already fibre between everywhere | [16:18] |
| mercutio | well yeah it's probably someone elses fiber. | [16:18] |
| brycec | Lots of dark fibre around here -laid and unused, comparatively cheap to buy | [16:18] |
| mercutio | yeah so it's probably lease.
i'm half interested in US net topography. | [16:18] |
| brycec | I can see how laying new fibre across the country would be expensive and subject to US permits
But can't see how that would apply to existing fibre. | [16:18] |
| mercutio | but it's hard when you're not in it i suppose.
some places seem extra bad. like tampa, florida is pretty bad. | [16:19] |
| brycec | Bad in what sense? | [16:19] |
| mercutio | kansas, kc i s pretty bad
i dunno about states hah | [16:19] |
| brycec | (Don't get me wrong, Tampa is bad in many ways :P) | [16:19] |
| mercutio | well like tampa has internet going via miami often
even though tampa and miami are ages away | [16:19] |
| brycec | Miami is a major transit point for the US to the carribean | [16:20] |
| mercutio | but it goes the long way around georgia
and so on yeah. if you're near a major transit point you have quite direct routes. | [16:20] |
| brycec | ... You might want to check a map. Tampa - Miami is only a couple of hours' drive. | [16:20] |
| mercutio | but like kansas you're often stuck with chicago/dallas. | [16:20] |
| brycec | (And Georgia is in the opposite direction) | [16:21] |
| mercutio | it seems to increase latency
hmm yeah but atlanta is out east. | [16:21] |
| brycec | All three are "out East" :p | [16:21] |
| mercutio | ok north east. | [16:21] |
| brycec | Negatory | [16:21] |
| mercutio | so you take a quite roundabout way to get there i meant | [16:21] |
| brycec | see: Map | [16:21] |
| mercutio | damp i need a site to test again
i suppose georgia doesn't look that bad | [16:22] |
| brycec | http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f2/US_map-South_East.png Florida is the most south-easterly state (Miami, Tampa, Orlando, etc), with Georgia (Atlanta) bordering on the north.) | [16:22] |
| mercutio | why is georgia to miami to tampa so high ping then. | [16:23] |
| brycec | No idea
No logical reason A little odd that you aren't seeing Atlanta - Orlando - Tampa though | [16:23] |
| mercutio | orlando is uncoommon
jacksonville happens sometimes. | [16:23] |
| brycec | I see ORL far more often | [16:24] |
| mercutio | actually i know someone in spring hill which is near tampa | [16:24] |
| brycec | Heck, HE has a POP in ORL | [16:24] |
| mercutio | and their route is actually not terrible
like 215 msec from new zealand | [16:24] |
| brycec | brycec knows someone in Tampa too | [16:24] |
| mercutio | when arp is 140 msec. | [16:24] |
| brycec | That's not unreasonable... | [16:24] |
| mercutio | but it does varies.
err vary. i was playing with this geoip stuff to route stuff to vps's and then go to web sites. | [16:24] |
| brycec | considering west coast -> orlando is about 90-120ms for me, a 70ms difference is reasonable | [16:25] |
| mercutio | the other thing i noticed is web sites aren't hosted in many places for common ones :)
90 to 120 hmm they were on brighthouse networks. which i'd never heard of before | [16:25] |
| brycec | I've heard the name before. Definitely not Level3 scale | [16:26] |
| mercutio | they use level3!
they're not like cox using cogent i wonder what it's like from arp it's 70 msec from arp via level3 but yeah, most of my testing was with web sites and vps's and so on it seems level3 just show los angeles to tampa jump so it's hard to know what it's like except it's somehow only 55 msec. | [16:26] |
| brycec | mercutio: This is from arp to a server in Orlando http://sprunge.us/XdOh | [16:28] |
| mercutio | and that's reallyt relaly uncommon from my earlier looking | [16:28] |
| brycec | mercutio: And this is from my office in the pacific nw http://sprunge.us/CJER | [16:28] |
| mercutio | yeah it looks like level3 have sensible routes
i'm going to tryh e;) i so prefer arp's looking glass | [16:28] |
| brycec | https://smokeping.cobryce.com/?target=Internet.HENet.NorthAmerica :) | [16:30] |
| mercutio | damn he.net is slow
damn no tampa You have too many active queries. Please wait at least 60 seconds before submitting additional queries. grr it's cos i tried adding on la This command is not available for core1.lax2.he.net at this time. 75.435 ms136.187 ms74.274 msv114-tpafl14-ear2.bhntampa.com (71.44.2.49) that hop has terrible icmp deproropsoitaiton acutally ahh but it's the same to the hop that doesn't. so yeah it's 58 to 60 msec on arp, nad 74.3 to 75 msec on level3 err on he.net so i suppose it's only 15 msec more, and that's fremont. i think their traceroute is udp too | [16:30] |
| meingtsla | Bright House? | [16:34] |
| mercutio | yeh
oh you know what, he.net aren't even carrying the traffic. damn arp for having good transit oh cool cogent have a looking glass even cogent is good weird so yeah, maybe it's moot to there now. i still wonder why slashdot.org has high pings from arp but they're on savvis. and i think savvis is probably just crap it's like 160 msec ping to chicago. | [16:34] |
| staticsafe | o_O | [16:49] |
| mercutio | i dont' really care about slashdot, it'se just bene a reference site since the 90s | [16:56] |
| mnathani | +1 on the asn.sh script, however I would probably like to modify it to allow searching with AS12345 as well as simply 12345
^ up_the_irons | [17:00] |
| cpet | so fare ive been here for a fvew days all i see if mercutio bitching about pings | [17:10] |
| brycec | cpet: it's a pretty quiet channel. And to be fair, that's about 50% of what we've seen from you :P
cpet: What would you like to see from this channel? :P | [17:12] |
| cpet | se drugs and tool?
er sex | [17:16] |
| BryceBot | That's what she said!! | [17:16] |
| mnathani | lets give cpet a break, bitching about pings when all you got is satellite for connectivity seems fair to me | [17:16] |
| cpet | now that is funny
you may continue | [17:16] |
| mnathani | are you a customer yet, cpet? | [17:17] |
| cpet | naw I just asked for a donation to port a filesystem to FreeBSD
but I think ill give up since its been 3 days take care all | [17:17] |
| *** | cpet has left "WeeChat 0.4.3" | [17:18] |
| up_the_irons | mnathani: go ahead and modify, then send me a pull request ;) | [17:18] |
| brycec | Huh. Slightly odd. | [17:18] |
| up_the_irons | umm.. ask for a donation and then bitch when it takes too long.. guess who's not getting a donation now? | [17:19] |
| brycec | I think his complaint was a lack of any reply
brycec stabs his computer | [17:20] |
| mnathani | up_the_irons: I have never sent a pull request before, do I first clone the repo, make the change and then send you a request?
I meant fork | [17:20] |
| brycec | mnathani: Yes. If you're on Github, it makes it all pretty easy | [17:21] |
| mnathani | s/clone/fork | [17:21] |
| BryceBot | <mnathani> up_the_irons: I have never sent a pull request before, do I first fork the repo, make the change and then send you a request? | [17:21] |
| brycec | mnathani: In fact
mnathani: In fact, you can do it all on the site itself, just open https://github.com/up_the_irons/arpnet-toolbox/blob/master/asn.sh click the edit "pencil", make your changes, commit, and submit the pull request I'm honestly a bit surprised this isn't written in Ruby :p | [17:21] |
| up_the_irons | no reason to use ruby
if shell is all i need, i use shell wow i didn't know you could do a pull request like that... | [17:22] |
| brycec | Makes simple fixes (like grammar, typos, etc) really easy :D Only downside is I don't get to name the branch.
brycec clicks save, clicks "Create pull request" https://github.com/up_the_irons/arpnet-toolbox/pull/1 | [17:24] |
| up_the_irons | what in the hell...
ASN=${1##AS} that actually works? :) | [17:29] |
| brycec | http://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/string-manipulation.html
And in general, yes it does. | [17:29] |
| up_the_irons | that's amazing
merged | [17:30] |
| brycec | My favourite tricks are the default value assignments
Sweet - but, does the script actually work? :p | [17:30] |
| up_the_irons | and yes, it does :) | [17:30] |
| brycec | As expected? Excellent.
(more fun: http://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/parameter-substitution.html) (I use it for things like: SOMEVAR=${1:-BLAH} ; if [ "x$SOMEVAR" = "xBLAH" ] ; then echo YOU FAILED ; exit 1 ; fi) | [17:31] |
| mercutio | i think i still prefer using a database
there's something ick about calling lynx | [17:38] |
| brycec | Agreed about lynx, but at least it's caching
(I prefer curl, for starters) | [17:38] |
| mercutio | heh
asn.sh: line 5: syntax error near unexpected token `newline' oh that doesn't get raw does it asn.sh: line 35: lynx: command not found it's still not working | [17:39] |
| brycec | Well lynx was removed from OpenBSD base :P | [17:41] |
| mercutio | i'm using linux | [17:41] |
| brycec | Apparently Linux without lynx | [17:42] |
| mercutio | oh | [17:42] |
| mhoran | Unheard of. | [17:42] |
| mercutio | i need to prepend 0
this is bizzare | [17:42] |
| brycec | for... "0lynx"? | [17:42] |
| mercutio | oh it cached my lynx not found | [17:42] |
| brycec | haha | [17:43] |
| mhoran | mhoran doesn't even understand what's going on. | [17:43] |
| up_the_irons | LOL | [17:43] |
| brycec | Very "dumb" caching is what's going on | [17:43] |
| mercutio | ahh this is nicer
you can just change lynx to links and it looks better now i can uninstall lynx again :) | [17:44] |
| brycec | Technically one could make a quick call to stat to check the datestamp of the file to introduce some expiry | [17:44] |
| mercutio | it's too much information for me anyway
damn this file is 7mb ok i have my own hack nearly ready | [17:44] |
| ok
working this is messsy too i have http proxy that helps http://pastebin.com/DLJ3D17q % sh myasn.sh 17746 AS17746 ORCONINTERNET-NZ-AP Orcon Internet,NZ % sh myasn.sh 9559 AS9559 PLAINCOM-NZ Plain Communications Ltd,NZ that's what my version does but it's not actually caching the huge file it's curling which would be a more sensible place to cache. my web proxy does, so it doesn't matter for me. if [ -n "$2" ]; then rm $AS_FILE fi haha brycec: i think you can do an if-modified somehow curl -I --header 'If-Modified-Since: DATE-FORMAT-HERE' | [17:59] | |
| i suppose you could have both modes with -v to show more information | [18:09] | |
| brycec | mercutio: Even then you're still "slow" because you're making a request to the backend *every time*
Also the backend webserver would need to properly support i-m-t | [18:11] |
| mercutio | brycec: oh i'm goign to predownload i think
it probably does. | [18:11] |
| brycec | Most do on static files, but dynamic stuff is up to the script | [18:11] |
| mercutio | what do you think about my way of outputting versus the verbose way?
hmm well you can cron it for once a month :/ this isn't dynamic anyway Last-Modified: Thu, 06 Nov 2014 01:14:47 GMT Age: 1642 you still may not want to update lal the time AS393392 PNWUPRIMARYPUBLIC - Pacific Northwest University of Health Sciences,US | [18:12] |
| brycec | 1642 seconds? that's about a half hour? | [18:14] |
| mercutio | wow i've never seen ASN's that high before | [18:14] |
| brycec | heh | [18:14] |
| mercutio | yeah it seems that way
so yeah you may want to update less frequently like once a month if it hasn't been updated in over a month i will have to look into that later. | [18:14] |
| brycec | I like up_the_irons' approach, since the ASN-name pairings aren't going to change, just the addition of new ASNs. You only need to update when you hit an unknown ASN-name mapping. | [18:15] |
| mercutio | for my modifcations
mine's doing that too it's not caching the 7mb file :) but they do change btw when companys change ownership usually the name changes it's just less to cat, and changing links to curl awk/sed/grep but yeah i wonder if having on the footer of output some links would be handy too it's all c though, so ... it's a bit messier :) | [18:15] |
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| mnathani | brycec: why does this not work: http://pastebin.com/x3gYP1WE
trying to match lowercase / uppercase as/ASN | [19:02] |
| brycec | lol
For starters, I don't think ### is a thing (I could be wrong?) But mainly because you keep overwriting $ASN with $1 (modified) mnathani: you probably want to keep the first line, and make the following lines ASN=${ASN#... (And I'm sure there's a simpler, cleaner solution too) | [19:02] |
| mnathani | This was my first attempt: http://pastebin.com/0fnKARPZ
before I saw your one liner unsuccessful too | [19:05] |
| brycec | If you're getting that complicated, you might just consider using sed to extract a number from $1 | [19:07] |
| mercutio | wow
it'll be AS<asn> or <asn> just do a bloody s/^AS// | [19:08] |
| brycec | s/$/i/ | [19:08] |
| BryceBot | <mercutio> just do a bloody s/^AS//i | [19:08] |
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| mnathani | https://github.com/up_the_irons/arpnet-toolbox/pull/2
working using sed | [19:28] |
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| mercutio | nice | [19:46] |
| mnathani | :-) | [19:48] |
| mercutio | facebook has their own http server
i've only just started exploring nginx | [19:52] |
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| mnathani | did they get back to you regarding dns
and geolocation was it? | [20:26] |
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| mnathani | ^mercutio | [20:35] |
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| mercutio | they got back to me asking for more information
a bit of to and fro then nothing for a couple of days so i emailed them again today. i improved my facebook temporarily by using unbound's ability to send domains to different parent dns | [21:15] |
| mnathani | does the issue impact many users? | [21:15] |
| mercutio | but i hate doing that.
yeah, heaps from my research. at least here. they probably don't care much about new zealand though | [21:16] |
| mnathani | is Australia in the same boat? | [21:16] |
| mercutio | well australia has their own server
and there's a double hop peer with them there and it still doesn't direct to it ie one in betwen hop in AS PATH it's doubled up too - there's two providers with one in between ASN | [21:17] |
| mnathani | where does your facebook traffic end up presently with no DNS hacks? | [21:17] |
| mercutio | i think their server selection needs an overhaul.
umm it varies between uhh hangon you to our Ashburn (ASH) and Forest City, NC (FRC) Data Centers. forest city, and ashburn so ages away bu thtere's some stuff hitting prc too which is closer and i'm not sure where it is but it seems west coastish | [21:18] |
| mnathani | the other 2 seem halfway around the globe? | [21:19] |
| mercutio | yeah
it comes into facebook's network in san jose. running traceroute -A http://pastebin.com/k7JU8WpE | [21:19] |
| mnathani | have you tested other NZ networks that have public looking glasses | [21:20] |
| mercutio | pastebin always has kaptcha
new zealand networks don't have looking glasses :/ i've tested other ones i ahve access too to weoll one other one i have access to, and got a couple of people to test themselves. so there's at least 4 networks that have issues http://pastebin.com/HVErFSga that's sydney weird, i dunno why it says AS1221 on hop 3 that's 9559 too | [21:20] |
| mnathani | here is a trace from UK:
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/1917708951399df0f7f8 | [21:24] |
| BryceBot | Gist: "https://gist.github.com/1917708951399df0f7f8" | [21:24] |
| mercutio | you're going to the same dc as me :)
maybe frc is their default? my uk vps goes there too oh except my one connectoins to facebook in the uk! 5 linx.br01.lhr1.tfbnw.net (195.66.225.69) [AS10026/AS4637] 4.896 ms 4.877 ms 4.859 ms | [21:24] |
| mnathani | maybe facebook geolocates based on friends, and connections and news interests and likes. LOL :-) | [21:27] |
| mercutio | i dobut it :)
i think their network is just non ideal like they should terminate in london if they're going to accept traffic in london even if they just put the page together there and get the information from further away at least that's what i'd do :) | [21:27] |
| mnathani | maybe they havent figured out how to replicate everything everywhere? | [21:27] |
| mercutio | they can still pull in stuff from remote
spdy really benefits from having close servers that can pull stuff in from afar | [21:28] |
| mnathani | cache it locally though? | [21:28] |
| mercutio | and tehy're using spdy.
yeah cache locally is good but even not caching you can still get some benefit https has 5 rtt latency often | [21:28] |
| mnathani | fewer roud trips? | [21:28] |
| mercutio | yeah | [21:28] |
| mnathani | utilize compression? | [21:29] |
| mercutio | there's various ways to improve it
it gets really complicated. old nginx has a bug, where if you have more than 4k of data it waits an extra rtt. which means if you have large certificates it delays normal ssl can't do quick start with some buggy implementations which means browsers require NPN and one other thing enabled. some secrecy thing spdy improves things too npn and forward secrecy https://istlsfastyet.com/ it still makes sense to have close https servers though with normal http you want to be < 20 msec ping beyond that it starts mattering less. | [21:29] |
| mnathani | are you active on nznog? | [21:33] |
| mercutio | but 100 msec ping is definitely bad.
yeah. sort of. i occassionally rant i'm a ranty kind of guy :/ | [21:33] |
| BryceBot | That's what she said!! | [21:33] |
| mnathani | I wonder if there were any facebook performance related discussions on here | [21:33] |
| mercutio | nznog hardly has anything technical on it tobh
tbh there was someone talking about akamai years ago i've had a pet peeve against akamai for years. i did this proxy mesh thing years ago, to try and get browsing faster by bouncing to local hosts. this was before linux had native 10 packets sending etc. and i implemented the 10 packets thing early, and did shaping to limit max speed. and i had it so i'd do persistent connections to the vairous proxies and do a geoip lookup to know which to send to. in the end i got web page load times down from about 1400 msec to about 1200 msec average. but that doesn't show the whole picture - often there were quite noticable latency improvements to less popular more weird web sites. and one of the slowest web sites was a local news site. one of the fastest web sites was typekit.com i tested on various isp's too. one isp was more like 1600, the other was more like 1800 typekit.com has changed since i tested. but yeah typekit didn't have low ping or anything they just were sensible i think tehy've moved data centres too. i'm pretty sure they used to be at steadfast. | [21:34] |
| hazardous | hi!!!!!!!1 | [21:38] |
| mercutio | hey hazardous | [21:38] |
| hazardous | sup | [21:38] |
| mercutio | not much
i'm ranting again it seems. | [21:38] |
| hazardous | nznog exists? | [21:39] |
| mercutio | yeah. | [21:39] |
| hazardous | the non-nanogs (and i guess eu) were almost barren the last time i clicked through a link and ended up there somehow | [21:39] |
| mercutio | nanog -> ausnog -> nznog
now i'm feeling old, i've been on nznog since about 2001 i think. | [21:39] |
| hazardous | going off on a random tangent i'm really surprised about chrome | [21:40] |
| mercutio | recently people have been talking aabout the impact of 1 gigabit fibre connections.
that it's getting slower and slower? | [21:40] |
| hazardous | i don't really look at naalytics but i was tracking down some attempted exploits in access.log and http://i.imgur.com/TBCMa6u.png
that's from the last 6h of one of my sites and it's just a giant mindfuck i wasn't expecting it to be skewed that hard | [21:40] |
| mercutio | wow i had to decrease my zoom :)
75% wow. i'm getting so pissed off at chrome. it keeps being slow | [21:41] |
| hazardous | it's a gaming fansite; with adblock rates around 90%
i was expecting some chrome skew, but not that far | [21:41] |
| mercutio | i use adblock
yeah i'd except 50 to 60% when you say gaming web site there's no competition anymore even opera is using chrome | [21:42] |
| hazardous | i mean video game graphs and analytics
nah, opera is still there (uses useragent, not rendering engine or whatever) somewhere around 0.1% lemme double check opera is lumped in with "other" and isn't at 0.1% | [21:42] |
| mercutio | ahh ok
do you use chrome? | [21:43] |
| hazardous | i use firefox day to day
i use chrome for testing sites actually chromium nightly | [21:43] |
| mercutio | ahh ok | [21:44] |
| hazardous | i can't deal with chrome day to day because i actually want my tracking beacons blocked | [21:44] |
| mercutio | i isntalled canary
it keeps crashing i can't do anything | [21:44] |
| hazardous | like chrome's plugin hook system is really really weird
everything is pretty much a basic userscript you can see this with some extensions in devtools | [21:44] |
| mercutio | oh woot canary is working again | [21:44] |
| hazardous | there's like a .css file loaded in after domcontentloaded
that tries to css display:none!important hide things like share buttons instead of actually blocking the content from loading in the first place | [21:44] |
| mercutio | wow canary scrolls way faster than chrome
oh nah it's just this page | [21:45] |
| hazardous | also blocking specific elements in chrome is akin to getting told to gfy | [21:45] |
| mercutio | i hate it how variable chrome scroll speed is | [21:45] |
| hazardous | firefox adblock has decent ruleset engine, i can tick things like third party and edit a regex | [21:45] |
| mercutio | actually even facebook is scrolling fast now | [21:45] |
| hazardous | chrome adblock is infuriating
and essentially stops at css rules | [21:46] |
| mercutio | yeah | [21:46] |
| hazardous | and trying to block things that are invisible, like if i wanted to block */analytics/beacon.aspx$
not happening, period | [21:46] |
| mercutio | i want adblock on tablet
i wonder if anyone has forkced chromium yet. | [21:48] |
| hazardous | adblock on tablet is pretty much like | [21:48] |
| mercutio | and tried to make it nicer | [21:48] |
| hazardous | hosts file at best
firefox has adblock addon on their mobile firefox | [21:48] |
| mercutio | yeah that sucks | [21:49] |
| hazardous | but it's useless at best | [21:49] |
| mercutio | i might do a proxy for it
i dunno | [21:49] |
| hazardous | i really wish mobile providers didn't utterly fuck any http connection
i should not have to be wasting battery life and data quota to have a usable internet because vpn and crypto padding and whatever else | [21:49] |
| mercutio | yeah | [21:50] |
| hazardous | since i can't visit many sites on mobile | [21:50] |
| mercutio | it's fine here | [21:50] |
| hazardous | i'm on tmobile and they filter all "18+ content" automatically
and don't allow me to remove webguard | [21:50] |
| mercutio | you were in australia right? | [21:50] |
| hazardous | i'm in the states
(this literally includes reddit api calls, so i can't even browse askreddit) | [21:51] |
| mercutio | oh
i got you confused with someone else i think light vpns are needed | [21:51] |
| hazardous | this also includes DPIing all http traffic for user agents too | [21:51] |
| mercutio | that use fast light encyption | [21:51] |
| BryceBot | That's what she said!! | [21:51] |
| mercutio | for non critical things. | [21:51] |
| hazardous | like
on my phone, the actual mobile device itself | [21:51] |
| mercutio | so they stop casual snooping and interjection | [21:52] |
| hazardous | if i spoof a firefox useragent
it will block all data and upsell me a tethering package | [21:52] |
| mercutio | why
oh | [21:52] |
| hazardous | all http requests are hijacked to their page
all dns requests return nxdomain + A record pointing to them they also hijack actual dns server traffic if you use 8.8.8.8, they route that to their own systems | [21:52] |
| mercutio | even if you change ports? | [21:52] |
| hazardous | same with 4.2.2.1 and 4.2.2.2, etc
they hijack all dns traffic to/from those hosts and redirect it to their own that part is just completely bizarre and ridiculous | [21:52] |
| mercutio | this sounds ick
does your ip change much? ideally speakign a light vpn that automagically worked when changing ip's woudl be great. | [21:53] |
| hazardous | on mobile? yeah often
openvpn takes like.. a minute+ to establish link and is completely impossible on low-signal areas | [21:54] |
| mercutio | so it encodes everything relevant in udp packets.
or generic ip | [21:54] |
| hazardous | http://esd.io/blog/t-mobile-dns-hijack.html has a writeup of it | [21:54] |
| mercutio | depending on what is necessary
so that it doesn't need the ip err for state | [21:54] |
| hazardous | like.. they are actually abusing others' ip space
for their own ad pages | [21:55] |
| mercutio | or at least can quickly reget it's state and work things out when ip changes | [21:55] |
| hazardous | one could argue that changing your dns servers from the isp-provided ones is pretty much saying "fuck you i want to opt out of your spam"
but they are refusing to obey that and they also don't obey opt out anyway so lol | [21:55] |
| mercutio | i think it's perfectly ok in corporate networks to not allow external dns. | [21:56] |
| hazardous | yes, but this is a consumer connection | [21:56] |
| mercutio | but on the internet at large i think not | [21:56] |
| hazardous | and there's a difference between blocking external dns
and hijacking MITM external dns with your own spoofed, invalid replies | [21:56] |
| mercutio | yeah
so do you use openvpn atm? | [21:56] |
| hazardous | ya
also, their idea of "opt out" of their NXDOMAIN search result page wanna guess what it is? | [21:56] |
| mercutio | how well does that work?
what is it? | [21:56] |
| hazardous | it uses javascript and cookies, the actual page is served, the nx domain is still hijacked
javascript checks if you have a cookie set to opt out and just does a window.location="/404.html" after the adpage has fully loaded | [21:57] |
| mercutio | oh what | [21:57] |
| hazardous | llllol | [21:57] |
| mercutio | do you have 4g? | [21:57] |
| hazardous | yes | [21:57] |
| mercutio | is it ok speed? | [21:57] |
| hazardous | but i'm rate limited to about 1 KB/sec after 5GB per month
at 1000-5000ms latency | [21:57] |
| mercutio | i talked to someone on skype who was driving on tmobile
and it broke up heaps | [21:58] |
| hazardous | it's good only in super urban areas i'd say | [21:58] |
| mercutio | but i've done the same thing when driving before and never had issues | [21:58] |
| hazardous | i have no problem in sf
i lose data service very fast leaving sf in between sf and la, verizon seems to be the only one with coverage (sanely) tmobile is kind of really really urban i guess? i dunno how to describe it | [21:58] |
| mercutio | wow
that's a huge area | [21:58] |
| hazardous | the only time i get good, stable service is near or in a major metro area | [21:59] |
| mercutio | but they're cheap :) | [21:59] |
| hazardous | tbh the part that pisses me off the most is how they lie about unlimited too
yes, it's unlimited, but no, it's not actually USABLE once you hit your cap loading a 16KB JSON response takes around 48 seconds a random imgur jpg takes 3-6 minutes | [21:59] |
| mercutio | we used to have that on dsl here | [21:59] |
| hazardous | even irc lags | [21:59] |
| mercutio | we had 64kbit rate limits | [22:00] |
| hazardous | yeah, it's like | [22:00] |
| mercutio | where it's meant to go to "dialup" speed
after your cap | [22:00] |
| hazardous | like a stable 64kbit is fine
i have no problem with a very stable and consistent 64kbit | [22:00] |
| mercutio | but there was like no buffering | [22:00] |
| hazardous | but this is some really really bad software artificial throttling or something | [22:00] |
| mercutio | and it was insanely slow with insanely high packet loss
and it would always get overshot all the time | [22:00] |
| hazardous | and i average out to be ~1KB/s with prboably 50%+ packetloss | [22:00] |
| mercutio | dialup was much more usable.
that said, a few years back i tried using dialup even logging into msn etc is slow | [22:00] |
| hazardous | i've never used dialup before so i don't have anything to compare against | [22:00] |
| mercutio | all these ssl certificates etc are huge.
the local news web site that was slow before they had a 4 meagbyte image today | [22:00] |
| hazardous | did you enable ssl
lol | [22:01] |
| mercutio | resized to a small image | [22:01] |
| hazardous | one of my friends kept bothering me about why their site was so slow | [22:01] |
| mercutio | on the page itself
it's like a straight off camera pic | [22:01] |
| hazardous | they had a gallery with 10mb jpg's resized to like 320x240
grid of about 50 of them | [22:01] |
| mercutio | but like 500mb caps on internet are common here on cellphgones
and lots of people browse news on their mobile | [22:02] |
| hazardous | the problem is whatever awful artificial throttling they use
i have no problem with a stable, steady 5 KB/s i have a problem when it takes 15 minutes to load imgur.com/something | [22:02] |
| mercutio | well that's what dialup gives you
yeah that's what rate limits / policers can often be like esp at lower speeds. like their 1kb/sec may actually be 64kbit with like no queueing | [22:02] |
| hazardous | it's r eally weird because on monitoring it looks like i burst up to 15KB/s for less than a second
and then drop to 9 bytes/second for the next five minutes openvpn is really unusable and annoying on high latency / random connectivity drop networks several minutes to connect | [22:03] |
| mercutio | mm
if you can tether | [22:03] |
| hazardous | i'm trying to figure out what i can do | [22:03] |
| mercutio | run a tpcdump and count how many packets it receives
if you're routing to it from a linux box you can change your route like ip route change (your route) initcwnd 2 | [22:04] |
| hazardous | i really don't get why every mobile provider here treats the internet as a molestation victim or something | [22:04] |
| mercutio | and it'd probably go a little better
you used to be able to change window size too ip route change 192.168.1.0/24 dev wlp3s0 proto kernel scope link src 192.168.1.9 initcwnd 2 window 8192 that still works | [22:04] |
| hazardous | like http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/193625-verizons-latest-privacy-wrecking-ploy-an-unblockable-supercookie-that-lets-anyone-track-you-on-the-internet
opt out isn't allowed it's the most hilarious thing | [22:05] |
| mercutio | so yaeh you have a route pointing to it with a low initial window size, adn a low window size
i imagine 8k may still be too much :/ | [22:05] |
| hazardous | i don't linuxes unfortunately | [22:05] |
| mercutio | i screwed around with stuff heaps on dialup
like on dialup i userd to use 296 mtu | [22:05] |
| hazardous | i just pretend to be a sysadmin and hope things work
:^) | [22:06] |
| mercutio | and 2k window size
so irc etc wouldn't lag out when downloading and i wouldn't get 4 second delays etc but in dialup days there was header compresion compression, so overhead was reduced for lots of small packets header compression basically doesn't work well now days you need to disable window scaling, tcp/ip timestamps, etc etc. and even then it doesn't scale and it really hates dropped packets | [22:06] |
| hazardous | is that what those weird "dialup accelerator software" things were
i honestly have never used dialup before | [22:07] |
| mercutio | nah those recompressed images etc. | [22:08] |
| hazardous | i always thought dialup accelerator was a joke
like bluray rewinder | [22:08] |
| mercutio | nah it was real
there's actually some stuff going around now that you can use on faster connections you can compress images to jpeg2000 or webp to reduce size quite a lot hardly any sites use webp or jpeg2000 | [22:08] |
| hazardous | i use webp | [22:09] |
| mercutio | cool | [22:09] |
| hazardous | but that's partially because i have a caching proxy in front of my site | [22:09] |
| mercutio | hardly anyone does though | [22:09] |
| hazardous | not really a caching proxy
i have mod_pagespeed or whatever | [22:09] |
| mercutio | yeah | [22:09] |
| hazardous | it just rewrites the page and replaces images | [22:09] |
| mercutio | you can use mod_pagespeed on a fowrad proxy | [22:09] |
| hazardous | i really like one thing it does, which is add width="" and height="" elements for unstyled things | [22:09] |
| mercutio | you may want to try it :)
could speed up your mobile openvpn | [22:09] |
| hazardous | it seems like it loads in in a container instantly
so everything else is in place so elements don't randomly move after the image late loads in | [22:10] |
| mercutio | i was playing with apache traffic server implemetnation of it
cos i wanted to use it everywhere hah | [22:10] |
| hazardous | android has native support for it | [22:10] |
| mercutio | i think it's easier with apache though | [22:10] |
| hazardous | the mod_pagespeed forward proxy thing
bypasses provider censorship too | [22:10] |
| mercutio | yeah | [22:10] |
| hazardous | but all your pages get tracked by google
since they run the proxy | [22:10] |
| mercutio | what
oh right | [22:10] |
| hazardous | there's a built in option | [22:11] |
| mercutio | i mean you can run it locally | [22:11] |
| hazardous | they re-serve you compressed http over udp+tls
and also run dns on the other end it's much, much faster but.. you know, that | [22:11] |
| mercutio | well that with your own server would be cool
i was going to do something like that hah | [22:11] |
| hazardous | i mean the piss annoying part is that | [22:12] |
| mercutio | damnit i need to stop procrastinating | [22:12] |
| hazardous | i need to toglge it on and off all the time
if i keep openvpn on to browse reddit if i accidentally open paypal app | [22:12] |
| mercutio | there's some mod page speed stuff to be more conservative | [22:12] |
| hazardous | i get my paypal account blocked and suspended/frozen | [22:12] |
| mercutio | why?
cos you're proxying? | [22:12] |
| hazardous | ya
they will freeze the account automatically | [22:12] |
| mercutio | how do they know? | [22:12] |
| hazardous | ip change | [22:12] |
| mercutio | i've used paypal iwith proxy? | [22:12] |
| hazardous | i would assume they have much more fine-grained databases for US geoip
nonresidential providers etc compared to every other country | [22:13] |
| mercutio | hmm
i used to proxy to US vps though i haven't done that in ages though i still want to look at ways to speed things up, but i want transparent and less http centric often what i care more about is things like smooth ssh it used to work to browse hulu heh i wonder if arp works for hulu about 3 or 4 isp's in new zealand are doing "global mode" now so people can use netflix hulu and other geo locked things like even large isp's! apparently australian government suggested people do it for buying games on steam too because steam charges different rates based on your country apparently it's really cheap in russia btw | [22:16] |
| hazardous | hulu should block arp iirc
lemme check | [22:20] |
| mercutio | in the end i couldn't stand hulu ads | [22:21] |
| hazardous | hulu on arp just links to http://www.hulu.com/help/articles/243651
iirc they also check your PTR for things like 'pool' and 'dyn' | [22:21] |
| ..... (idle for 22mn) | ||
| mnathani | hmm hazardous: hulu works for me, (using ARP, I ssh, then use a SOCKS proxy) I am in Canada | [22:44] |
| nvm I get the anonymous proxy message now as well | [22:52] | |
| ....... (idle for 34mn) | ||
| *** | fink has joined #arpnetworks | [23:26] |
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