[00:53] cdns care about tcp access times i think [00:53] and prefer faster loading pages [00:53] like from cdns [00:55] actually when i say search engines, i mean google, and it's only what i've heard [00:56] acf: i have limited anycast [00:56] usually you use your normal asn for anycast, but you do have to kind of dedicate a /24 to it [00:57] the most used case for anycast atm is dns [00:58] and dns resolvers often consult dns servers that aren't the cloesst location. if using anycast you still should have more than one server location [00:58] err, i mean you shouldn't just advertise a /24 in multiple locations, and all of your name servers as seperate hosts at that location, as if location has an issue thigns can become unreachable. [01:16] *** brycec has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** CaZe has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** hazardous has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** NiTeMaRe has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** Hien has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** eryc has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** pjs has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** BryceBot has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** up_the_irons has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** josephb has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** m0unds has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** phlux has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** KILLALLHUMANS01 has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** mike-burns has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** pcn has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** meingtsla has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** kevr has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** KDE_Perry has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** mercutio has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:16] *** twobithacker has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:20] *** Hien has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** eryc has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** hazardous has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** brycec has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** CaZe has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** pjs has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** NiTeMaRe has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** BryceBot has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** up_the_irons has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** josephb has joined #arpnetworks [01:20] *** barjavel.freenode.net sets mode: +o up_the_irons [01:21] *** m0unds has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** phlux has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** KILLALLHUMANS01 has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** mike-burns has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** pcn has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** meingtsla has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** kevr has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** KDE_Perry has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** mercutio has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** twobithacker has joined #arpnetworks [01:21] *** barjavel.freenode.net sets mode: +o mike-burns [01:21] *** novae has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) [01:21] *** jpalmer has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) [01:24] *** novae has joined #arpnetworks [01:24] *** jpalmer has joined #arpnetworks [01:24] *** tabthorpe has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) [01:25] *** CaZe_ has joined #arpnetworks [01:28] *** CaZe has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [01:28] *** CaZe_ is now known as CaZe [01:28] *** tabthorpe has joined #arpnetworks [01:28] *** tabthorpe has quit IRC (Changing host) [01:28] *** tabthorpe has joined #arpnetworks [01:29] mercutio: Anycasting dns resolvers is very commonplace. We do that within our network mainly for resiliance, so resolvers in one city are reachable on the same IPs the clients are using if one set fail [01:31] mercutio: Doing it on the authoritative side is slightly more controversial though. When DNS was invented hostnames were never intended to change IP rapidly, or to have different records depending on where you were asking from. [01:32] It was intended that record caching would keep the answers local in the resolver for popular hosts, and only be re-fetched from the authoritative server once a day/week/month/whatever [01:33] In that model it doesn't really matter if the authoriative server is 500ms away, as you're only sending it one query a week [01:33] *** tabthorpe has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** brycec has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** hazardous has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** NiTeMaRe has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** Hien has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** eryc has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** pjs has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** BryceBot has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** up_the_irons has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:33] *** josephb has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [01:44] *** tabthorpe has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** Hien has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** eryc has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** hazardous has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** brycec has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** BryceBot has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** up_the_irons has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** josephb has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** NiTeMaRe has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** pjs has joined #arpnetworks [01:44] *** barjavel.freenode.net sets mode: +o up_the_irons [02:41] *** jcv has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) [02:41] *** jcv has joined #arpnetworks [03:01] well now ttl's are like 300 seconds etc plett [03:02] peltt: dns resolvers and authorative are both commonly anycast now [03:02] but it's also common for people to anycast primatry and secondary dns servers [03:02] it's also common not to [03:02] but if you anycast to the same dc... [03:02] one of the cdn's was doing it i think [03:02] and i'm pretty sure opendns do it too [03:06] plett it is actually realyl hard to benchmark dns performance though, most isp's are fast for google etc, but when you get to werid domain names they can vary [03:06] so do you take notice of "average request time" or how quick the less common domain name lookusp are [08:40] *** ant has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [08:40] *** ant has joined #arpnetworks [09:02] you could always test w/dnsbench (late reply) [09:02] it can be a handy way to test recursive resolver perf [09:22] (no later a reply than up_the_irons ...) [09:23] He must have overexerted himself last week upgrading 2 hosts [09:30] *** ^Erick^ has joined #arpnetworks [10:32] *** ^Erick^ has left "Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com" [13:06] *** abthorpet has joined #arpnetworks [13:11] *** abthorpet has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [13:11] *** tabthorpe has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [13:19] *** jcv has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** hazardous has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** NiTeMaRe has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** Hien has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** eryc has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** pjs has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** BryceBot has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** up_the_irons has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** josephb has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:19] *** dr_jkl has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** jcv has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** Hien has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** eryc has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** hazardous has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** pjs has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** josephb has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** up_the_irons has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** BryceBot has joined #arpnetworks [13:20] *** barjavel.freenode.net sets mode: +o up_the_irons [13:22] up_the_irons: wb [13:23] *** NiTeMaRe has joined #arpnetworks [13:24] *** brycec has quit IRC (*.net *.split) [13:30] *** brycec has joined #arpnetworks [13:31] http://i.imgur.com/uqmZK9v.png wee [13:32] heh [13:32] * brycec grumbles about Freenode [13:32] nice netsplit there [13:33] m0unds: yep [13:34] m0unds: btw, up_the_irons emailed NTT [13:34] got the same response as I did [13:34] fantastic [13:35] bummer [13:35] it's rendering my use of this vm as a ts/murmur server sort of moot since 80% of my users are on comcast or centurylink [13:35] both of which have heavily congested ntt peering during peak hrs [13:35] yeah, I know what you mean [13:36] i moved murmur and teamspeak to a box on my home cable connection temporarily so we can actually use voice [13:36] haha [13:36] up_the_irons hasn't been around in a while, maybe he'll do something when he gets back [13:36] yeah, it kills voip [13:36] i'd only use ts, but some of the guys who play project reality really like the positional audio stuff you can do w/PR and mumble [13:37] hmm, interesting [13:37] @last up_the_irons [13:37] brycec, I last saw up_the_irons 4 days 19 hours 51 min 15 sec ago saying in a channel: m0unds: roger. [13:37] nearly 5 days... [13:39] he'll have a giant /away log to go through [13:39] hahaha [13:58] up_the_irons: my vps is still network-deaf :| [14:36] who's roger [14:38] "The International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) officially defines the word "roger" to mean "I have received all of your transmission."" [14:44] i wonder why roger of all things [14:47] *** m0unds has quit IRC (Quit: derf) [14:52] *** m0unds has joined #arpnetworks [15:13] *** jlgaddis has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [15:22] hazardous: Before 'r' was romeo in phonetic alphabets, 'roger' was used. [15:22] @wiki Voice procedure [15:22] Voice procedure :: Voice procedure includes various techniques used to clarify, simplify, and standardize spoken communications over two-way radios, in use by the military, in civil aviation, police and fire dispatching systems, citizens' band radio (CB), etc. Specially, for civil aviation - it used to be called aeronautical phraseology. Voice procedure communications are intended to... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voice%20procedure [15:52] "Roger" was the U.S. military designation for the letter R (as in received) from 1927 to 1957.[4] [15:54] *sigh* [15:54] *sigh* [15:58] no ticket update in 24h for a deaf server :| [16:00] dr_jkl: what exactly is happening? [16:00] acf_: account was reactivated from suspension and the vlan is supposedly active but the vps can't ping it's gateway or the world [16:00] networking is configured correctly [16:01] and while the initial response to the ticket was nice and fast, i updated the ticket at around 6pm last night and here we are at 7pm today and i have the cube root of sweet fuck-all to show for it [16:02] out of curiosity, what happens if you run tcpdump on the interface [16:02] and try to ping the machine from outside [16:03] i can't, because tcpdump isnt installed on this box [16:03] and i cant reach the world :D [16:03] so [16:03] traceroute stops at r1.lax.arpnetworks.com so it's not my issue [16:04] s1.lax? [16:04] r1.lax.arpnetworks.com (208.79.88.2) [16:04] thats the last hop before the void [16:05] is that normally the last hop before your box? [16:06] So what you do is open hexedit and start copying over tcpdump :p [16:06] lol [16:06] or zmodem [16:06] maybe check the output of ifconfig [16:06] Heck you could base64 encode/decode files and paste it through console.arpnetworks.com [16:06] acf_: tbh i do not know, i haven't had a reason to poke this box for ~6months [16:06] see if it says it received anything [16:07] RX bytes:250505173287 (233.3 GiB) TX bytes:257057917197 (239.4 GiB) [16:07] also arp -a [16:07] my rx/tx counts are in the kilobyte range, the thing is deaf as a post [16:08] my arp cache is empty [16:08] ahh darn [16:08] well, hope you get that fixed soon [16:08] I'm sure you'll get a reply within 48 hours of your posting [16:09] yeah considering i have to do stuff on this box today i am kinda hoping it gets fixed sooner rather than later [16:09] I just up up_the_irons wasn't run over by a bus or similar [16:09] up_the_irons: you werent run over by a bus were you [16:09] It's very unusual for him to be silent so long [16:10] when did he reply to your support ticket the first time? [16:10] brycec: i know... i mean [16:10] The upside: Free service until things break down. <.< [16:10] >.> [16:10] (at least for those with working VPSs) [16:10] acf_: 6/16/14 @ 06:02pm (T+6 minutes [16:10] so it was rly fast [16:11] June 16? That would be last night... [16:11] so he was alive then :) [16:11] yeah [16:11] So where was he??? Why wasn't he here then? [16:11] Unless you're referring to the autoresponder... [16:11] im just getitng shit from people who need stuff the box provides [16:11] and i mean [16:11] i cant really be mad [16:11] thing got suspended because the card expired and nobody noticed [16:12] & the lack of response is very atypical [16:12] its almost like the ethernet interface isnt attached properly in whatever hypervisor etc is being used [16:13] I think he probably just disabled your vlan config thingy on the router [16:13] do you have multiple boxen with arp? [16:13] he said he enabled it [16:13] acf_: no [16:13] Perhaps he reused your IP on another vlan? [16:13] thats the thing, he said it was enabled, so i poked around and im like 'nope, use a bigger hammer' [16:14] well, in the mean time, you *could* try brycec's base64 idea [16:14] get the .deb or whatever, base64 encode it, write a perl/python script... [16:15] i'm not sure i want to put the effort into that for a $10 vps [16:15] It can't be that much effort... [16:15] what variant of Linux? [16:15] debian wheezy [16:15] oh cool [16:16] The binary is only 16,741 lines base64-encoded [16:16] do you have libpcap? [16:16] 'only' lol [16:16] acf_: probably not - i made this box a mailserver and didnt really put anything else on because i was in a hurry [16:16] dr_jkl: just curious, what's the IP of your host? [16:16] won't make that mistake again [16:16] brycec: 174.136.100.58 [16:17] Yep, the router just doesn't know where to go with it. [16:17] dpkg-query -l libpcap0.8 [16:17] dpkg-query -l libssl1.0.0 [16:17] dpkg-query -l multiarch-support [16:17] So I'm guessing that the VLAN was reenabled, but the router didn't get the /29 readded to it. [16:18] acf_: nada [16:18] brycec: ever heard of r1.lax? [16:18] yes [16:18] brycec: the irritating problem is it's like 30 seconds worth of work for something that has me dead in the water :P [16:18] Maybe the Debian ISO has the package? [16:18] oh good idea [16:18] brycec: i was given the netinst iso, i doubt it [16:18] Or at least boot to one of the other ISOs that has tcpdump on it [16:18] if the iso is still there, i mean [16:19] you can change ISOs in the portal [16:19] to basically anything [16:19] There are some "rescue" ones that might [16:19] oh yeah i forgot i can do that [16:20] but he only hsa the debian netinst [16:20] :| [16:20] * dr_jkl uses SUMMON up_the_irons [17:11] *** mus1cb0x has joined #arpnetworks [17:12] happy to report back that enabling the green status bar (and therefore clock->minutely network traffic for update) has caused my connection to vps on kvr14 to become stable [17:12] 2 days and no d/c which wouldn't have happened before [17:13] so is the most likely cause of the silent broken pipe my pf config losing state after some time and treating the connection traffic as unknown? [17:23] mus1cb0x: is this since the node update? [17:23] last monday? [17:23] something like that [17:23] i'm on kvr15 so i can't be sure :) [17:24] it seemed like it, however i doubt it now. i think it's a config problem on my end [17:24] i don't really use state with pf myself [17:24] why not? [17:25] i don't see the point [17:25] and it can break things :) [17:25] i hate it when i have a ssh open for a couple of days, adn i type something on it, and it closes [17:25] and that kind of problem is quite common when using state [17:26] which means applications have to send regular puluses to stay alive [17:26] yea true [17:26] ssh has rekeying at least [17:27] i use the arguement sometimes that state doesn't work with ddos [17:27] but really on a "good" ddos nothing works [17:27] rekeying? [17:27] ssh changes it's key between client/server [17:28] acf_: no response, just requested a quote for a dedi from prq [17:28] i don't get your point on state and ddos 'working' [17:28] sadly, the person i was doing the work for has decided to go with another company over arp because of this :| [17:28] *shrug* i tried... [17:29] over what dr_jkl? [17:29] itll be spensive but tired of waiting and presumably they can get it done Ive had good experiences with them in the past [17:29] mus1cb0x: no update to ticket in 24h for a server with a netowrking problem on arp's end [17:29] i tried. sorry guys. [17:29] *** dr_jkl has left [17:30] erratic: dedi sounds expensive [17:31] did they say the could route you a /29 ? [17:31] it might be nice to have it at prq actually if you're going to be in Europe [17:31] what's prq? [17:32] http://prq.se/ [17:32] acf_: waiting to find out from them [17:33] looks good [17:34] acf_: yeah I donno it means a lot to me I've wanted this for a long time now and finally I found arp and they seem too busy [17:34] I'd give it a bit more time [17:35] usually up_the irons is pretty fast on the response time [17:35] it's also a really nice service once it's set up [17:37] ooo [17:37] http://prq.se/?p=special&intl=1 [17:38] lol [17:38] ddos often overflows state tables [17:38] BryceBot: 625 SEK to USD [17:38] its about 90 dollars [17:39] not too bad [17:39] it really would make more sense to colo with them [17:39] http://prq.se/?p=colo&intl=1 [17:39] ...alright, going through a ton of scrollback. This was my b-day weekend and also Father's Day, so i've been pretty afk... [17:39] definitely if you have a nice 1U lying around [17:40] up_the_irons: good to see you back [17:40] up_the_irons lives :) [17:40] and happy birthday [17:40] happy bday :) [17:40] aol me too happy birthday [17:41] is that gemini or cancer [17:41] gemini i imagine [17:41] gemini [17:42] acf_: well I know tpb doesn't use prq anymore, wonder if I could contact that neij fellow and get him to colo my box in some unknown location (pirate party data center cough cough) for me [17:42] aol? [17:42] mus1cb0x: people on aol used to say me too to a whole lot of posts [17:42] without adding anything useful to the discussion. [17:43] was that just an aol thing? [17:43] no, but aol typified it [17:43] oh [17:43] lol/win 4 [17:44] http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/A/AOL-.html [17:44] the great up_the_irons returns! [17:44] "See also September that never ended." [17:44] hahaha [17:44] no doubt [17:45] acf_: @exch [17:46] @exch 625 SEK to USD [17:46] 625 SEK -> 94.164966172931 USD (as of Tue, 17 Jun 2014 17:00:44 -0700) [17:46] ah thanks brycec [17:46] PS happy birthday up_the_irons [17:46] today is my lady's birthday... and I'm still at the office :( [17:49] ty all for the birthday wishes [17:49] @exch 400 eur to usd [17:49] 400 EUR -> 541.87031959511 USD (as of Tue, 17 Jun 2014 17:00:44 -0700) [18:03] mnathani: IPv6 BGP and IPv4 BGP work similarly, yes [18:12] up_the_irons: good to know [18:16] *** mus1cb0x has left "WeeChat 0.4.2" [18:19] erratic: "do you guys have any clients who need large numbers of instances?" -- I can answer this, but i'm not sure i understand the question... [18:20] mnathani: basically, everything is a tagged port [18:22] yeah I wreckon anybody would want that would just go with rackspace or ec2 [18:22] sorry to ask [18:23] mnathani: brycec : mercutio : the backup VLAN is indeed a single VLAN, so everyone who has the dedicated NIC for the backup server is on a "shared switch", so-to-speak; and yeah, you can see other customers' backup port [18:25] up_the_irons: so, technically I could request the dedicated NIC on 2 VMs, and pass traffic between them using their link local IPv6 at Gigabit speeds? [18:26] and those vms dont necessarily need to be on the same customer account [18:26] mnathani: yeah that sounds right [18:26] up_the_irons: cool [18:27] erratic: well, we don't have too many customers that have like 30 VMs, but there are some [18:27] up_the_irons: do you create a bridge interface for each VPS to communicate on a different VLAN on each KVR host [18:28] bridges are involved, yes [18:29] mnathani: no plans for a looking glass in the near future, i just don't have the time to set it up [18:31] acf_ | I think he uses Qemu/KVM with an in-house management system [18:31] acf_: ^^ that's correct [18:39] up_the_irons: Happy birthday! [18:39] erratic: btw, i'm sorry for the slow response times; it's not typical. Father's Day and my b-day weekend all at once, so things got behind. [18:39] novae: tnx! [18:41] sorry about that [18:48] *** erratic has quit IRC (Quit: Reconnecting) [18:48] *** erratic has joined #arpnetworks [18:48] *** erratic is now known as Guest85668 [18:48] *** Guest85668 is now known as erratic_ [18:56] I'll volunteer to run+admin the ARP Networks NTP server, up_the_irons :) (I'm already running one http://www.pool.ntp.org/scores/2607:f2f8:a650::3 http://www.pool.ntp.org/scores/174.136.103.130) [18:56] (But I'm rubbish on LG, sorry) [18:57] brycec: tell me what you need to get started (or if you just want to use your existing one(s), that's cool too) [18:58] looking glass is pretty easy to do with openbsd [18:59] up_the_irons: I'd be happy to use my existing one, but it's tied to my account so I'd rather not (what if my CC should fail, then ARP's NTP would be down). It's exceedingly minimal, the "small" package would be more than enough. (Could probably do it in 128MB and 2GB) And since you're familiar with Debian/Ubuntu, I'd say put up a Debian image. [19:00] it would be neat to have a hardware GPS reference on it [19:00] not sure about feasablity though [19:00] acf: yeah [19:00] That's less feasible... [19:00] it's probably not unfesasable [19:00] if it'll go through the datacenter ceiling? [19:01] brycec: ok, i'll have to set up a new VM for it then [19:01] can't ti go through the window [19:01] It would require an antenna on the roof and patching the antenna down to the datacenter, probably $$ for it. [19:01] i suppose it depends how close to window it is :) [19:01] mercutio: windows... like to the outside world? in the middle of a datacenter? [19:01] ok that sounds complicated bryce [19:01] it might "just work" [19:01] bryce: that's what the dc where iam is like haha [19:01] i forget they're not all like that [19:02] not all datacentres are in basements [19:02] I think arp machines are at 900 N Alameda [19:02] source: I've worked with cell companies, which require GPS signal [19:02] it's a post office? [19:02] Probably a former post office ;) [19:02] i see windows :) [19:03] Big fancy datacenters with all kinds of safeguards and security don't have windows on to the floor [19:03] up_the_irons can see if his phone gets GPS in there? [19:03] http://www.coresite.com/locations/los-angeles [19:03] What if there's a storm and the window breaks? [19:03] i'm looking at that top image, which i got when searching for 900 n [19:03] or an earth quake [19:03] bryce: tehy're reinforced. [19:03] well earthquake is more relevant [19:04] or like that movie right at your door [19:04] i've been in a big earthquake, and server issues wren't that major [19:04] the biggest problems were things ilke generator power [19:04] and refuqeling [19:04] because of restricted access etc [19:04] I'm just going to let up_the_irons answer whether there are windows exposed to the floor... [19:04] but what about this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_at_Your_Door [19:04] Right at Your Door :: Right at Your Door is a 2006 American thriller film about a couple and follows the events surrounding them when multiple dirty bombs detonate in Los Angeles. Chris Gorak both wrote the screenplay and directed the film in his writing and directorial debuts. It was first screened at the Sundance Film Festival in January 2006 where it was nominated for Cinematography Award and the Grand Jury Prize, winning the Cinematography.. [19:04] * brycec has to go home anyways [19:04] lol [19:05] with that flooding in new york i think that was the general problem too [19:05] no windows in the suite that my cage is in [19:05] there are windows on the same floor [19:05] Im going to watch this now on netflix [19:05] ok well gps is off :) [19:05] well probably off [19:05] is there cellphone reception there ok? [19:05] GPS isn't impossible, but a whole lot more work than it's worth. Being a stratum 2 is plenty. [19:07] general recommendation for ntp servers is 3 [19:07] or more [19:07] is the idea to have one arp ntp in the pool? [19:07] mercutio: the idea is to have an NTP server on-net, for low-latency and in case The Internet implodes [19:07] in the normal pool? [19:07] (It's been requested a few times) [19:08] If up_the_irons is okay with it, sure. Or maybe he'd prefer it were ARP customer only [19:08] what if it goes down? what if it has widely wrong time? [19:08] what if theres a zombie virus out break and the zombies start attacking the servers [19:08] mercutio: both of which are addressed in NTP protocol [19:08] the idea of 3 servers or more is that if one has widely inaccruate time, you need 3 of them to balance it out [19:09] s/balance it out/invalidate it [19:09] the idea of 3 servers or more is that if one has widely inaccruate time, you need 3 of them to invalidate it [19:09] heh [19:09] *whoosh* [19:09] Bye brycec! [19:12] acf_: how is the latency using a tunnel? [19:12] prq was guranteed at least 200ms [19:12] depends on where you are [19:12] since I'm not too far from lax, I get ~10ms sometimes [19:13] when Comcast and NTT aren't being stupid :) [19:13] how is the comcast issue going [19:13] afaik not good [19:13] up_the_irons got the same response as I did for the Verizon one [19:13] and nothing has changed on NTT/Comcast end [19:14] did anyone see the level3 blog? [19:14] http://blog.level3.com/global-connectivity/observations-internet-middleman/ [19:15] erratic_: I get 154ms from ARP to xs4all.nl fwiw [19:15] thats cool [19:15] mercutio: yeah, saw that a while ago [19:16] very interesting read [19:16] *** erratic_ has left [19:16] "interesting" is one way to put it [19:16] *** erratic_ has joined #arpnetworks [19:16] the problems are mostly us-centric [19:16] yep. US ISPs suck [19:16] and mostly in areas were monopolys exist [19:16] which is everywhere? [19:16] heh [19:17] so if comcast/verizon/at&t have issues to cogent/ntt/level3 [19:17] which side is to blame [19:17] yeah I dont understand the us anymore, pretty much everything is comcast [19:17] there's at&t dsl quite commonly available i thought? [19:17] I wont buy service from them anymore [19:17] Comcast, TWC, AT&T, Cox, Verizon, CenturyLink [19:17] that's all of them afaik [19:17] cox is cheap and nasty right? [19:17] but still better than the others? [19:18] we have Comcast here, Cox next door [19:18] I've heard relatively good things about Cox actually [19:18] that youtube thing was saying that twc and comcast won't compete? [19:18] haven't heard of any peering congestion issues, but that doesn't mean the don't exist [19:18] yeah, they have their regional monopolies [19:18] i've heard bad things about comcast and verizon [19:18] they want to merge, and they're arguing that it won't reduce competition [19:19] and i've heard that at&t is ok if you wsant a cheap slow service. [19:19] verizon sucks super duper bad [19:19] yep yep yep [19:19] f*** verizon [19:19] at&t is like $30/month for a cheap plan? [19:19] they will never get a dime from me [19:19] acf_: frontier ? [19:19] i get disconcerted when i read price for 6 months [19:19] frontier did some pretty stupid stuff when I used them [19:19] frontier is old verizon afaik. I guess I should count them? [19:20] $25 for 3 megabit for 6 months [19:20] http://kremvax.acfsys.net/smokeping.cgi?target=Remote.verizon-snloca-dsl [19:20] look at the graph for ec2 [19:20] dunno how much it changes to [19:20] yeah theyre pretty much fios (which is nice and terrible support wise) [19:20] http://kremvax.acfsys.net/smokeping.cgi?target=Remote.verizon-snloca [19:20] non DSL router in the same building as from the previous one [19:21] we don't have fios here [19:21] I heard they stopped deploying it completely? [19:23] so how much of the market does comcast have? [19:23] *** dj_goku has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [19:23] here, probably Verizon's only market is people who don't know what the Internet is [19:24] everybody else has Comcast [19:24] Verizon's speed/service is just unbearable [19:24] is it just a location thing? [19:24] idk about other places. I would guess it's pretty much the same everywhere for DSL [19:24] fios is very competitive though [19:25] Comcast and Verizon compete aggressively in areas with fios [19:25] i dunno my friend had verizon and it seemed to have ok speeds, just terrible peering [19:25] it was vdsl [19:25] oh and it had higher pings [19:25] strange. was it on the west or east coast? [19:25] they're independent systems I think [19:25] kansas? [19:25] what is that considered [19:26] not sure [19:26] middle [19:26] if you look at a map, it seems it's bsaically in the middle of the US [19:26] yeah, DSL uses an error correction algorithm that basically adds 32ms [19:26] atleast ADSL [19:26] dsl varies in that respect, but yes [19:26] my adsl has 10 msec pings [19:26] to next hop [19:27] probably east coast system. I've never seen vdsl anywhere around here [19:27]