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| Who | What | When | |
|---|---|---|---|
| brycec | Interesting - mtr to t.co, 3 hops in NTT and it's only the last hop that's bad. 1.0ms, 1.0ms, 192ms. | [00:00] | |
| mnathani | icmp deprioritization maybe? | [00:03] | |
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| acf_ | I'm beginning to think that maybe NTT just sucks | [00:22] | |
| Level3's path is fine: http://paste.unixcube.org/k/b87f9d
just saying | [00:30] | ||
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| mercutio | yeah it's strange isn't it | [01:24] | |
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| acf_ | >:( http://paste.unixcube.org/k/3cd15c
up_the_irons: could you please go yell at NTT for us? | [08:56] | |
| m0unds | i don't think it'll do any good - they're in the same position as tata
comcast is buying peering from them and running it really hot, so it gets congested as hell during high demand hours same with telia random baby spider just dropped out of thin air and climbed into my macbook keyboard under the right shift key haha | [09:01] | |
| :q
err | [09:15] | ||
| acf_ | lol I do that in openoffice documents all the time | [09:29] | |
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| *** | tellnes has quit IRC (*.net *.split)
z310 has quit IRC (*.net *.split) tellnes has joined #arpnetworks z310 has joined #arpnetworks z310 has quit IRC (*.net *.split) z310 has joined #arpnetworks | [10:23] | |
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| m0unds | god, comcast escalation support has gotten bad
it used to be really, really good they want to roll a truck for this ntt/comcast congestion issue in LA the dude determined my modem is "at death's door" and needs to be replaced to fix a signal issue, but the signal levels reported by the modem on the customer-facing part of it are well within spec | [13:50] | |
| *** | m0unds_ has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) | [13:51] | |
| m0unds | it's like their way of saying 'i don't understand what you just explained to me, so i'll fold it over into a context i can understand. your modem is bad." | [13:51] | |
| gizmoguy | tell them their modem that connects them to NTT is bad :)
then they'll understand | [13:51] | |
| m0unds | hahaha | [13:52] | |
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| gizmoguy | why are we so lucky enough to have two m0unds | [13:52] | |
| m0unds | one's via v4 at home, the other's via v6 on this box | [13:53] | |
| mercutio | they just don't understand mounds | [13:54] | |
| m0unds | mercutio: no shit | [13:54] | |
| mercutio | well are yuo surprised
tier 1 helpdesks always suck | [13:54] | |
| m0unds | well, considering 2+ years of biz support would have been able to understand it and suddenly in the last month and a half, it's a room full of retards | [13:55] | |
| mercutio | ntt is a japanese transit provider primarily
so most people probably have no idea who they are | [13:55] | |
| m0unds | and they're a transit provider in the us for lots of stuff | [13:55] | |
| mercutio | and it looks kind of like ntu
hmm | [13:56] | |
| m0unds | verizon is in a transit spat with them now, according to a friend of mine that works for an isp that competes w/vz | [13:56] | |
| mercutio | verizon in transit spat with comcast? | [13:56] | |
| m0unds | no, with ntt | [13:56] | |
| mercutio | or with ntt?
welll we alraedy know ntt sucks to both comcast and verizon | [13:56] | |
| m0unds | yeah, but it's because it's due to both vz and comcast shitlisting traffic and dumping it on tata, ntt and telia | [13:57] | |
| staticsafe | peering drama o/ | [13:57] | |
| mercutio | politics | [13:57] | |
| m0unds | yaaaaaaay | [13:57] | |
| mercutio | m0unds: that's what at&t did with cogent | [13:57] | |
| m0unds | everyone does that with cogent | [13:57] | |
| mercutio | but
given equal paths, they'd push things otu to cogent | [13:58] | |
| m0unds | comcast did it with cogent leading up to netflix' paid interconnect agreement | [13:58] | |
| mercutio | which means if you had any cogent in your mix, you'd get bad traffic from at&t
because the ports were way over congested so are you meant to just drop cogent? (well actually should you have cogent in the first place?) cogent's not as bad as it used to be at&t goes via ntt too hmm and looks to have some congestino too so are ntt just becoming another cogent? | [13:58] | |
| just higher ping though at least
17 msec jitter | [14:17] | ||
| acf_ | > <m0unds> but it's because it's due to both vz and comcast shitlisting traffic and dumping it on tata, ntt and telia
what exactly do you think the relationship between NTT/Telia/TATA and Comcast is? Comcast buys NTT transit, but not enough? | [14:22] | |
| m0unds | yeah, they do the same with other transit providers too
and then if you don't play ball w/them, your traffic gets shitlisted, e.g., it gets funneled through one of those providers the worst offender is tata, but they're bad nearly everywhere | [14:23] | |
| acf_ | by "play ball" I assume you mean "buy transit" | [14:24] | |
| m0unds | yeah, arrange for an agreement to peer directly w/comcast | [14:24] | |
| acf_ | so they use the crappy links with Tier 1s to coerce Netflix, etc... into buying transit directly from them | [14:24] | |
| m0unds | yeah, which netflix should just do as a cost of doing business anyway | [14:24] | |
| acf_ | super | [14:24] | |
| m0unds | because it's nonsense that any one party should bear that whole burden | [14:24] | |
| acf_ | so it's really not NTT's fault | [14:25] | |
| m0unds | that's why paid peering agreements exist and have existed forever
not necessarily no way to tell easily | [14:25] | |
| staticsafe | ^
this is all guessing | [14:25] | |
| acf_ | hmm... you'd think NTT would care about the quality of their Comcast links quite a lot | [14:26] | |
| m0unds | yeah, speculation, speculation, speculation
well, if comcast is a customer, ntt isn't in any place to say "buy more capacity from us" | [14:26] | |
| acf_ | so how do you think buying transit from Comcast/Verizon/etc... compares to NTT pricing wise?
ie, why not just by transit from Comcast and get it over with | [14:27] | |
| m0unds | i have no idea, i deal with closed networks not internet-facing networks :) | [14:28] | |
| acf_ | got it
it's interesting that you say Comcast is an NTT customer because you would think NTT would be the primary sender | [14:28] | |
| m0unds | they likely are, but again, speculation | [14:28] | |
| acf_ | and the sender usually pays
of course | [14:29] | |
| m0unds | i haven't been able to find anything that prefers tata | [14:30] | |
| acf_ | I know I've seen it in the path to ARP in the past
so Level3 do they have peering congestion too? | [14:30] | |
| m0unds | not as bad as it used to be - they used to be in the same boat as tata, ntt and cogent were w/comcast | [14:32] | |
| acf_ | what happened? | [14:32] | |
| m0unds | dunno, just remember there was a really public series of blog posts and yelling back and forth in 2010 or so | [14:32] | |
| acf_ | I remember that between Level3 and Cogent
and Verizon and Cogent | [14:33] | |
| m0unds | there was another one between level3 and comcast too
corporate.comcast.com/comcast-voices/comcast-comments-on-level-3 http://corporate.comcast.com/comcast-voices/comcast-comments-on-level-3 | [14:33] | |
| acf_ | interesting | [14:36] | |
| m0unds | yea
i haven't really seen a lick of headend or city-level comcast congestion in years | [14:39] | |
| acf_ | http://www.internap.com/2014/03/07/despite-comcast-netflix-deal-settlement-free-peering-alive-well/
that's a farmiliar graph :[14:43] <m0unds> yeah, haha | [14:40] | |
| m0unds | i think it's a little disingenuous to say that suddenlink and sonic agreed to open connect purely because it benefits customers
they have significantly smaller networks and smaller subscriber counts that's like saying $local_isp supports openconnect because it benefits consumers - i'd guess it'd probably also reduce the strain of their peers at the edge of their network so i guess it's customer-centric in a way, but also protects their own business from having the reputation of being the "slow isp" haha | [14:44] | |
| acf_ | yeah. it's at least nice to see someone writing about the peering congestion though
I haven't been able to find much direct acknowledgement of the issue anywhere http://www.internap.com/2010/12/02/peering-disputes-comcast-level-3-and-you/ internap seems to have some nice blogs http://blog.level3.com/global-connectivity/observations-internet-middleman/ broadband service providers, right behind airlines | [14:48] | |
| m0unds | haha, yeah | [14:56] | |
| was playing with netbsd earlier. hadn't used it in years. | [15:01] | ||
| .... (idle for 17mn) | |||
| mercutio | i tried netbsd on winuae
painfully slow :/ | [15:18] | |
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| acf_ | I would imagine so
I ran NetBSD on some NeXT hardware a while ago just for fun it took like 15 minutes to boot and 2 to log in and 30 seconds to ls don't even try ssh | [15:46] | |
| mercutio | haha | [15:55] | |
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| is next 68k? | [17:06] | ||
| acf_ | yep
68040 | [17:14] | |
| mercutio | my amiga has 68030
it's so damn slow with some things and so damn fast with others | [17:25] | |
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| mnathani | @google what is node.js | [23:07] | |
| BryceBot | 3,580,000 total results returned for 'what is node.js', here's 3
What is Node.js? - O'Reilly Radar (http://radar.oreilly.com/2011/07/what-is-node.html) Jul 6, 2011 ... Node.js. It's the latest in a long line of “Are you cool enough to use me?” programming languages, APIs, and toolkits. In that sense, it lands ... javascript - What is Node.js? - Stack Overflow (http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1884724/what-is-node-js) I think the advantages are: Web development in a dynamic language (JavaScript) on a VM that is incredibly fast (V8). It is much faster than Ruby, ... | [23:07] | |
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