[01:07] Wheee look at those NTT hops [01:08] ...there are more hops to Google over v6 than over v4 :( [01:08] 12 vs 7 [01:17] brycec: I'll see if ASN 11799 can peer with us over IPv6; that's how we're getting 7 hops in v4 [01:17] I really need to get on this v6 bandwagon. [01:17] i just sent 'em an email about it [01:18] Cool [01:18] *** mike-bur1 is now known as mike-burns [01:19] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mike-burns [02:29] *** LT has joined #arpnetworks [04:39] the route to google looks fine [04:39] ignore the hops [04:40] it's ~ 10 msec [04:40] well to www.google.com [04:43] oh and < 1 msec by ipv4 [04:43] i see why you care :) [05:01] *** LT has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) [05:49] *** mike-bur1 has joined #arpnetworks [05:49] *** pjs_ has joined #arpnetworks [05:49] *** mhoran2 has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [05:49] *** pjs has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [05:49] *** milki has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [05:49] *** milki has joined #arpnetworks [05:49] *** mhoran2 has joined #arpnetworks [05:49] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mhoran2 [05:50] *** eryc has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [05:50] *** mike-burns has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [05:50] *** mjp has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) [05:50] *** mnathani has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [05:51] *** eryc has joined #arpnetworks [05:51] *** eryc has quit IRC (Changing host) [05:51] *** eryc has joined #arpnetworks [05:51] *** mnathani has joined #arpnetworks [06:23] *** mike-bur1 is now known as mike-burns [06:23] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o mike-burns [07:11] *** pjs_ is now known as pjs [07:14] *** NiTeMaRe has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [08:03] *** NiTeMaRe has joined #arpnetworks [08:06] heh I didn't even pay attention to the latency... I was just curious about the new path taken was all [08:07] Also yeah I see those same numbers, 11ms over v6, .7ms over v4 [08:07] kinda trivial latency-wise [08:07] but less hops is moar bettar i guess [08:07] fewer [08:34] *** mhoran2 is now known as mhoran [08:49] Also *more and *better ... [08:49] nah [08:49] intentional [08:49] Hah. [09:06] is anybody having networking issues at arp at the moment? I'm discovering my vps'en are hard down, no networking between any of them let alone to the gateways [09:08] MOAR BETTAR [09:08] ? [09:08] toddf: reference to something earlier. [09:08] toddf: And I'm not seeing any issues with my lone VPS. [09:19] whether it is new or I'm blind and just noticed, I'm very glad that portal.arpnetworks.com links to support.arpnetworks.com with the login to portal and I can view and create tickets that way. mail is down for me as a result of the vps issues mentioned above .. ;-( [09:21] Heh, so it does. Neat [09:23] that sucks - i had a blip early this morning that dropped ipv4 connectivity to a couple places and triggered monitoring notifications [12:39] *** medum has joined #arpnetworks [12:56] *** mjp has joined #arpnetworks [14:10] it seems routing via any2ix/coresite is half-working now [14:10] i don't rememer as11799.net appearing before [14:24] seeing a lot more NTT in v6 routes to ARP now :) [14:24] oh ntt has better routing too i think [14:24] oh ntt are japanese aren't they [14:25] yep [14:25] so japanese destinaions aren't good tests :) [14:26] struggling to find ipv6 sites now [14:26] facebook, kame, .. [14:26] asininetech.com [14:26] google [14:26] dundeadly.org [14:26] vps[13].cobryce.com [14:26] i did google yesterday [14:27] asinetech.com is via he.net [14:27] (spelt correctly) [14:27] (as is vps1. vps3 is on ARP) [14:27] bryce: that won't help [14:27] i was seeing what goes over ntt :/ [14:27] oh what [14:28] you are on tunnel [14:28] huh? [14:28] it goes via he.net to you too bryce [14:28] mercutio: to which, vps1? I already said it's on he.net. [14:28] (vps3 is native on ARP.) [14:28] oh right [14:28] vps1 [14:28] <-- creative VPS naming [14:28] i thought you said vps 1 to 3 are on arp [14:28] yeh ok [14:28] yeh i know right [14:29] you should see my old naming [14:29] i had sj.meh.net.nz, la.meh.net.nz, chi.meh.net.z, da.meh.net.nz, uk.meh.net.nz, am.meh.net.nz [14:29] etc [14:29] but then what happens if you have more than one in la :/ [14:29] so i have arp.meh.net.nz now :) [14:30] the old la.meh.net.nz was on budgetvm, who had heaps of ddos issues [14:30] lol I thought you were using meh.net.nz as a dummy [14:30] now i should really cull it from dns [14:30] haha [14:30] (but then I looked it up) [14:30] i have the.net.net too [14:30] oops [14:30] the.net.nz [14:31] but i'm not using it for much atm [14:31] argh that reminds me i have to update my nameservers :/ [14:32] is anyone following the debian upstart vs systemd debate? [14:32] is there a ML I should look on to see this? [14:33] Either way I'll be annoyed; I just want BSD's init. [14:33] I value my sanity... That's why I listened to the Bill Nye/Ken Ham "creationism" "debate". [14:33] there's many mailing lists i think [14:33] but you shouldn't [14:33] it's been going on for months [14:33] it's like watching politics on tv :/ [14:33] srsly [14:33] you may be able to do it, but it's much easier if someone else watches it for you and gives you an overview [14:33] unless you like watching grown men bickering between each other [14:33] Well, what's the overview? [14:34] well they've had months of debate, and have finally voted on... further discussion [14:34] http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTU5NDk [14:35] i pasted some url to a humurous video outlining various things in it though [14:35] http://aceattorney.sparklin.org/jeu.php?id_proces=57684 [14:35] which at least helped me understand in more deatil [14:35] i hope they go with systemd myself [14:35] same [14:35] i don't really like systemd [14:36] but i'd much rather see something that everyone uses [14:36] It looks like the upstart license is incompatible? [14:36] mike-burns: but there are upstart people on the board [14:36] the upstart license is .. complicated. [14:36] https://wiki.debian.org/Debate/initsystem/upstart - the con is confusing. [14:36] I agree with3 mercutio [14:36] but it's like the fsf license i think [14:36] where you have to assign copyright or something [14:37] Does anyone use Debian/BSD? [14:37] GNU userland and FreeBSD kernel, I guess? [14:37] nope [14:37] lol nope! [14:37] That's what I thought. [14:37] i grew to like systemd when i messed with arch [14:37] i have tried ferebsd 10 now [14:38] m0unds: how do you do /etc/rc.local? [14:38] eh? [14:38] Never really understood that... If you want the FreeBSD kernel, just run FreeBSD. If you're soooo attached to Debian-isms, you have personal issues :p [14:38] to have some local stuff executed after all the systemd crap :/ [14:38] oh, no idea. i used just 100% systemd crap [14:38] i lvoe how much faster pacman in arch is than apt-get in debian/ubuntu [14:38] mercutio: Write a systemd service :p [14:39] yea, it's super fast [14:39] I never understood GNU userland+FreeBSD kernel: the Linux kernel has tons more hardware support, and GNU userland is awful. [14:39] systemd is really fast to init too [14:39] i'm using arch now :) [14:39] i don't really like the system journal vs discrete logs [14:39] mike-burns: except when it comes to very specific things, like ZFS :p [14:39] but it doesn't bother me /that/ much [14:39] i'm using ssd [14:39] but yeah it boots pretty quick [14:39] brycec: Right, true; and then I'd just use FreeBSD. [14:39] I hear that, m0unds [14:39] mike-burns: which is precisely what I'm doing too :p [14:39] I would, however, use Linux + BSD userland. [14:39] for some reason freebsd is insanely slow to boot [14:40] -ENOTENOUGHRICERS [14:40] i have it on an awful little amd netbook (arch) and it boots in ~15 sec w/a 5400rpm disk [14:40] but really ther'es not a huge diff between ubuntu and arch boot times [14:40] but freebsd seems to take about 10 times as long to boot [14:40] i imagine it's not doing enough parallel starting etc [14:41] how did you time it m0unds? [14:41] not sure how long it takes to start freebsd; i don't really reboot the systems i have that run it [14:41] I think that during the migration, Arch had a systemd service that just executed /etc/rc.local too. Easy enough to do. 14:36:50 < mercutio> m0unds: how do you do /etc/rc.local? [14:41] ah, ok - i tested arch after it was already in use [14:41] i'm not a linux desktop person [14:41] And you could always just use cron + @reboot [14:41] i timed it after post completed - post is 3 seconds [14:42] ok [14:42] i'm about 1 second to grub [14:42] something like that anyway [14:42] about 5 seconds booting [14:42] i just booted my other pc [14:42] it's uefi [14:42] my win8 box is to the login screen in 5-8 seconds [14:43] ssd, uefi [14:43] yeah this is ssd/uefi [14:43] * brycec remembers when... [14:43] dual boot windows/linux [14:43] i also don't boot into X :/ [14:43] yeah, i have arch on a second disk in that box, but arch is on a platter drive [14:43] i just login and type startx [14:43] * brycec too [14:43] yeah, same w/the little laptop i have [14:43] i hate lightdm [14:43] desktop arch install boots to x because i don't care [14:43] rarely ever boot it anyway [14:44] i reckoen if soemthingshould be optimised it's video card [14:44] uhh getting the resolution thingy [14:44] [drm:drm_edid_block_valid] *ERROR* EDID checksum is invalid, remainder is 128 [14:44] like crap like that in dmesg [14:44] yuck [14:45] ikr [14:45] but it seems to get the data ok [14:45] it just seems to slow it down [14:45] huh. [14:45] radeon 0000:01:00.0: DVI-I-1: Ignoring invalid EDID block 1. [14:45] my mbp takes ~20 seconds to boot from power button w/an SSD [14:45] i think it's cos i only using one monitor [14:46] m0unds: wow [14:46] my hackinstosh boots faster than that :/ [14:46] are you using mavericks? [14:46] Ooh burn [14:46] yep, mavericks [14:46] has lots of issues [14:46] weird [14:46] windows 8 definitely boots faster than macos though [14:47] my wife's mba boots in about the same time, but she's still on mountain lion [14:47] 2013 gen (haswell) mba [14:47] oh [14:47] i didn't know they did haswell on lion [14:47] i don't hate macos [14:47] i just prefer linux and ion [14:48] i like it, there's just lots of improvements they could make to ux [14:48] i like that it installs zsh by default [14:48] i had to teach myself to use expose instead of cmd tab [14:48] and ssh [14:48] because i kept minimizing windows and it's annoying to go to the window menu to find what i'm trying to switch back to [14:49] yea, that was why i went with a macbook - better specs than an ultrabook, lots of tools i use on a regular basis baked in [14:50] 2.9GHz i7, 8gb ram, 200-someodd gb ssd [14:51] SSDs sure are great [14:51] yea, price/gig is coming down a lot too [14:51] i got one for my desktop [14:51] you think that now [14:51] wait until they get 1/10th of the latency [14:51] 256GB Samsung 840 EVO [14:52] there's some room for improvement [14:52] i think the first improvements are coming with parallel requests and more direct access [14:52] the only thing that sucks about ssds is having to use machines that don't have one [14:52] bringing latency down [14:52] m0unds: haha yeh [14:52] best part is no noise tbh [14:52] taht's why i like the idea of these hybrids [14:52] but would never want to use one myself [14:52] mechanical drives get noisy [14:53] yeah i dunno why some drives are much noisier than others [14:53] but i kept wanting to have raid at home [14:53] but having nowhere to stick it [14:53] yea, my env at work isn't quiet enough to notice disks [14:53] it's pretty easy to noitce 3 or 4 disks [14:53] yep [14:53] i used to use 4 disk raid at home, it's kind of annoying/intrusive [14:53] but it was pretty fast [14:53] so now i'm doing raid on ssd with small disks [14:54] and just not storing too much at home [14:54] with one backup hard-disk [14:54] so at least my important data can be on raid [14:54] one cool thing about ssd's is it's easier to do backups [14:55] because it forces people not to store too much data in one place [14:55] heh true [14:55] yeah, makes it a lot easier to use time machine [14:55] hahaha [14:55] and i have some files i access remotely [14:56] and they're on hdd raid far away from me [14:57] other thing i noticed is 2.5" hard-disks tend to be quieter [14:57] indeed [14:57] so i was thinking about raiding 2.5" hard-disks [14:57] like sas disks? [14:57] nah [14:57] or like notebook disks [14:57] like 7.2k laptop hard-disks [14:58] they also have high latency often though [14:58] and higher than avg failure rates [14:58] yeah [14:58] if they're on 24/7 [14:58] hence i only thought about it [14:58] yeah, haha [14:58] you can get 7mm ones [14:58] the same size as ssd's [14:58] it's insane when you think about it [14:58] sas disks aren't normally that thin [14:58] all that mechanical stuff in that small of a chassis [14:59] pretty wacky [14:59] ssd's are actually in oversized cases atm [14:59] even when they 7mm ;/ [14:59] yea, they're tiny [14:59] if you see pictures of people who have opened them up [15:00] those little msata ones are funny [15:00] yeah [15:00] http://ts2.mm.bing.net/th?id=H.4733093869193817&pid=1.7 [15:00] err [15:00] wasn't sure if that link would work but it does [15:01] it said bing [15:01] i assumed it was a mistaake [15:01] haha [15:01] haha yeh [15:02] was that mastaa [15:02] http://cdn.pcper.com/files/imagecache/article_max_width/review/2013-07-25/130721-132916-7.65.jpg [15:02] ahh yeh it is [15:02] but see even the normal ssd's you buy are smalleer than the case [15:02] shit man, that's 1TB... [15:03] yep [15:03] yeah they're hell expensive [15:03] but out there [15:03] i'd go for 3x500gb in raid 5 [15:03] over 1tb [15:03] i'm doing 3x120 in raid10 and raidz [15:04] mercutio: I'd just thought "gee, look at all that room if they wanted to stuff it with more flash, make it a 1TB... oh, it already is" [15:06] haha [15:07] i think 500gb is more popular [15:07] * m0unds doesn't use google :P [15:07] typically use duckduckgo, but image searching goes to bing via !bimages bang syntax @ ddg [15:07] duckduckgo? [15:08] https://duckduckgo.com [15:08] https://duckduckgo.com/goodies [15:08] it's on amazon [15:08] i wouldn't count on it not being tracked [15:09] i wouldn't suggest that it being on ec2 means it's being tracked [15:09] it may be [15:09] i doubt it [15:09] it's shared storage [15:09] by a company that is into tracking [15:09] at any rate [15:09] not why i use it [15:09] ahh ok [15:14] https://duck.co/help/company/architecture [15:14] http://highscalability.com/blog/2013/1/28/duckduckgo-architecture-1-million-deep-searches-a-day-and-gr.html if you're curious [15:19] that is interetsing [15:19] dunno why they use amazon though :/ [15:20] why wouldn't they? [15:20] low network speeds [15:20] bad routing [15:20] high cost [15:20] low performance [15:20] hasn't been my experience at all with aws [15:21] well architected stuff will run well on aws [15:21] maybe network speeds are good for you, but id on't get good speeds to amazon singapore, amazon east coast, amazon ireland? [15:21] for some reason lots of stuff is on amazon east coast, and lots of ti tends to be slow [15:22] that's the default region, iirc [15:22] and benchmarks clearly show the performance is worse than real machines [15:22] but, like i said: 16:20:01 m0unds | well architected stuff will run well on aws [15:22] if you have global reach, architect like you have global reach [15:22] not like you have users in the US and nowhere else [15:22] i had a friend with amazon, and his disk performance and cpu performance were shocking [15:22] was he using ebs? [15:22] they throttle disk i/o apparently [15:22] no idea [15:22] he had a local hard-disk [15:22] and ubuntu [15:22] if io sucked, it was probably ebs [15:23] and ssh was sluggish [15:23] ebs isn't intended to be used like that, but lots of people treat ec2 compute instances like VPS' [15:23] oh ok [15:23] yeah he was treating it like a vps [15:23] EBS is like network storage [15:23] it's not actually in the host [15:24] so IOPS are generally pretty awful [15:24] he did get some boost by upgrading to higher plan [15:24] i told him he should just get vps :/ [15:25] yea, if your app isn't gonna need to scale a ton, it makes more sense to get some semblence of dedicated resources [15:25] lots of people that want to use amazon dont' seme to consider other options [15:25] yea, they have a lot of mindshare [15:26] http://docs.aws.amazon.com/AWSEC2/latest/UserGuide/AmazonEBS.html [15:26] *** hive-mind has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [15:26] With Amazon EBS provisioned IOPS (input/output operations per second) volumes, you can provision a specific level of I/O performance, up to 4000 IOPS per volume. [15:26] he was way under 4000 iops [15:26] i'd estimate more like 20 to 30 [15:26] micro instance maybe? [15:27] dunno [15:27] yeah i think it was micro [15:27] at any rate, the point is that storage is independent of the compute instance [15:27] and he went to small [15:27] it was unsable for casual use [15:27] it had 768mb of ram i think [15:27] ah [15:27] and he went to 1.7gb? [15:27] *** hive-mind has joined #arpnetworks [15:27] not sure on numbers exact, but it was werid numbers :/ [15:28] that said i'm on 768mb on arp [15:28] 1.7 seems to beee small [15:28] where's micro [15:28] oh 0.615gb [15:35] so I hope this is not too far off topic, but I think its worth mentioning .. arpnetworks is the best vps hosting provider I've encountered to date. yet, anybody who aims to be highly available knows you can't put all your eggs in one basket. thus, I've found https://my.iniz.com/aff.php?aff=289 as another basket to put some eggs in. (yes thats a referral link). can't beat roughly $20 USD/year for 256mb/250gb xfer/10gb disk kvm vps ... [15:35] ... .. but they've no serial console, no secure vnc option, no ssh menu option, no /48 of IPv6 (you get 1 address). fwiw. [15:36] solusvm? [15:36] I've seen that term. what exactly does it mean? [15:36] vps management thingie [15:36] it's a control panel with security issues [15:36] and haphazard development [15:37] most vps providers that aren't doing custom stuff are using it [15:37] it can only assign multiple single ipv6 addrs rather than contiguous blocks, iirc [15:37] it's vnc is exposed to the world as well [15:37] and they use centos [15:37] and they've had actual security issues befeore [15:37] and their mysql database is messy [15:38] but it's like $10/month per server [15:38] so it's "cheap" for the provider [15:38] like i imagine up_the_irons has put MANY hours into doing his control panel [15:38] heh. like I said 'best'. there are many security things at arpnetworks I'm happy with. [15:39] one switch taking out all my vps systems for the better part of today makes me want _something_ to show signs of life elsewhere. [15:39] yeah i just recommend to stay away from solusvm if you can if you care about your data etc [15:39] toddf: yeah, gotcha [15:39] you seem to have more network problems than most toddf [15:39] i don't run any critical stuff anymore, just personal crap mostly [15:39] mercutio: I am on the test 1gbps ports, granted [15:40] maybe you should shift back :) [15:40] I consider it a kick in the pants that all eggs in one basket is bad period. [15:40] toddf: did you get your net stuff from earlier sorted out? [15:40] m0unds: yes, up_the_irons kicked the switch that had all the 1gbps ports and it booted up fine [15:41] mercutio: 'if I care about my data' aka .. solusvm is like putting a bitcoin wallet on a windows server on the net, expect it to be r00ted soon? ;-) [15:41] kind of [15:41] haha, windows is reasonably secure if you're not a dummy [15:41] i'm not aware of anything happeniing yet [15:41] not since the last big exploit thing last year? [15:42] but basically it's reasonably likely that in the not too distant future someone will find an exploit for solusvm that gives them root [15:42] and can go into all servers, or put trojans in servers automatically [15:42] and reboot :/ [15:42] but the same as any problem [15:42] if you're not a normal target, then you'll probably find them just trying to doos or irc fromy our host if they get into it [15:44] mercutio: I'm planning on having 2ndary dns and perhaps some mx traffic but .. humm .. if only secure vnc or spice were possible so I could have secure access to console I'd just setup cryptoraid and require me to enter the password everytime I rebooted [15:44] hmm [15:45] why don't you just run backup at home? [15:45] I'm trying to get servers away from my home office. at least temporarily. need to re-org and redo. [15:45] ahh [15:45] well it up to you :) [15:45] i'm hestitant about dns [15:46] well, I have home business, but if any of my 3 public ip systems reboots, I have to reboot the cablemodem and ping a v4 address for them all to have internet access. [15:46] that's not reliable for hosting ;-( [15:46] beacues if someone exploits your dns [15:46] then they can put huge stupid long ttl''sgoing to wrong locations [15:46] yea, that's been happening more and more [15:46] but again if you're not a target that is unlikely to happen [15:46] maybe i just paranoid :) [15:46] well, what sucks is that it's hard to know whether you're gonna be a big target or not [15:46] I think you've made some very valid points. [15:47] like that dude who had a short twitter id - personally, no one cared about him or his blogs or work or whatever [15:47] yeah i just think people should know the risks [15:47] it's ok to know the risks and still take risks [15:47] I'll just not put my bitcoin exchange reflector on the iniz vps then .. ;-) [15:47]