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linuxthefish: hi, what info do i need to give for SWIP request?
up_the_irons: name, address, w/e info you want to appear in the SWIP
linuxthefish: thanks!
up_the_irons: np :)
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mhoran: orks
m0unds: zoinks?
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mhoran: Weechat was faster than me!
<br> Speaking of, is anyone using weechat autojoin with keyed channels? I can't get it to work. It joins the keyed channel and nothing else.
staticsafe: <u>description</u>: comma separated list of channels to join when connected to server (example: "#chan1,#chan2,#chan3 key1,key2") (note: content is evaluated, see /help eval)
<br> note where the spaces are, those matter
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mercutio: ok, so i just found out that zsh supports shared history between shells but isn't enabled by default
<br> that's like been one of the things that have bugged me for ages
mhoran: <u>staticsafe</u>: Ah. all keys go at the end? That explains it.
<br> <u>mercutio</u>: Awesome! I need to enable that.
<br> I want shared search history but not up arrow.
mercutio: heh
<br> setopt inc_append_history
<br> setopt share_history
<br> in .zshrc
<br> i dunno why you wouldn't want up arrow
<br> it also enables timestamping
m0unds: zsh is awesome
<br> it's the shell for wizards
BryceBot: YER A WIZARD m0unds
m0unds: thanks, BryceBot
mercutio: i been using zsh for ages
<br> but i always knew there were advanced things i wasnt' doing/making use of
<br> but even without those it worked better than ksh etc
mike-burns: A prior student of mine introduced me to it, around 13 years ago. I thought he was just some clueless hipster.
<br> Turns out it's a great shell! And he's not clueless!
mercutio: <u>mike</u>: did you try it?
mike-burns: I eventually did. Took two years.
mercutio: i mean straight away
<br> ahh ok ;)
<br> it gets like that
<br> it's like how some people are still using screen
<br> lots of things i've been using for ages now
mike-burns: http://bit.ly/1chYnUF - the guy who fixed this bug (Taylor) is the student who introduced me to zsh.
BryceBot: http://bit.ly/1chYnUF -> http://www.daemonology.net/blog/2011-01-18-tarsnap-critical-security-bug.html
mercutio: mutt, vim, zsh,
<br> mike, cool :)
mike-burns: tmux is still hipster nonsense.
mercutio: well it's useful if you think your net might drop
<br> or you want to reboot where you're connecting from or such
mike-burns: I mean tmux instead of screen.
mercutio: have you seen screen's source code?
mike-burns: Hah.
mercutio: actually on that note have you ever looked at gnu source code?
mike-burns: Have you seen echo's source code?
<br> <u>mercutio</u>: I run this: http://bit.ly/1bdX1FS
mercutio: only the gnu one
BryceBot: http://bit.ly/1bdX1FS -> http://www.meetup.com/The-Classical-Code-Reading-Group-of-Stockholm/
mercutio: heh cool
mike-burns: We just did a group reading of pwd.c, and before that true.c . We also had a pilot (not listed) where we read echo.c .
mercutio: i've been writing my own implementation of curl
mike-burns: Awesome.
mercutio: been pretty slack about it
<br> but try ldd `which curl`
mike-burns: Heh.
<br> <u>zsh</u>: ldd =curl
mercutio: % ldd `which curl` | wc -l
<br> 38
mike-burns: On FreeBSD: 8.
mercutio: really
brycec: 28 on Debian7
mike-burns: 27 on my Debian.
mercutio: hmm i get 6 on freebsd
<br> wow
<br> and the binary size is smaller than ubuntu too
brycec: I got 15 on my FreeBSD
mercutio: weird
<br> this is freebsd 9.2
mike-burns: I wrote my own 'ls' two years back. Fun exercise. I did it in Haskell, though.
brycec: Same. Built from ports though.
mercutio: hmm
<br> i did a terminal emulator OS
<br> it booted from grub though
<br> but all you could do is use a terminal in it heh
mike-burns: With our powers combined we can re-write BSD!
mercutio: like serial terminal
mike-burns: Hah.
mercutio: the network stuff was being annoying
<br> it seems much simpler before you start working on it
<br> i had what i thought was an ideal environment too :/
<br> grub would network boot it
<br> and had a separate 386 to boot
<br> which booted pretty fast
<br> so could just make on the dev computer
mike-burns: I have long given up the idea that any programming problem is simple. Being a project manager will do that, though.
mercutio: but writing tcp/ip stack and network driver is kind of more complicated than i thought it would be
<br> this was years back though
<br> maybe i should try again :/
mike-burns: It's only more complex now.
mercutio: but this time as a xen virtual machine
<br> nah it's simpler if you just rely on virtio :/
mike-burns: OK let me know how it goes.
mercutio: i was reading about people doing micro OS stuff with xen
<br> where you compiile a program to run as a virtual mcahine
<br> which includes everything it needs
<br> and everything runs as ring 0 or such
<br> (is it still ring 0 if it's a virtual machine?)
<br> anyway kernel and user space is one
mike-burns: This gets you lower memory usage?
mercutio: and less context switches
<br> and more separation
mike-burns: Smart.
mercutio: i thought it was a nifty idea
<br> they were using some werid programming language though
<br> really it's file system stuff that is probably the most complex
<br> i can't find it now
<br> ahh it was erlang they were using
mike-burns: That's not a weird language.
mercutio: http://erlangonxen.org/
mike-burns: Though, I'm biased: it's one of the most popular languages in my city.
mercutio: curious
<br> are you in a hipster town
<br> i actually know very little about erlang
mike-burns: I'm in the town that invented it, so ... I guess that's cheating.
mercutio: pcase_word =
<br> fun(X) ->
<br> lists:map(Upcase, X)
<br> end.
<br> err U on the front
<br> ahh
<br> well i dunon that looks weird to me=
mike-burns: Looks like Erlang to me.
mercutio: yes looking for code examples
<br> but i keep finding short blurbs
mike-burns: http://bit.ly/1chZOCH - here's an actual thing.
BryceBot: http://bit.ly/1chZOCH -> https://github.com/klarna/jesse
mike-burns: http://bit.ly/1be080P - this one's complex, too.
BryceBot: http://bit.ly/1be080P -> https://github.com/klarna/meshup
mercutio: actually it doesn't look too bad
mike-burns: If you want it to look prettier, I recommend Elixir.
mercutio: is that a drug?
<br> http://erlangonxen.org/
mike-burns: Yes, but it's also a programming language.
mercutio: go there
<br> and press escape
mike-burns: Hah.
<br> Yup, definitely Erl nerds.
mercutio: heh
<br> well i reckon the idea is noverl
<br> novel
jpalmer: most of the software we write at work, is erlang
mercutio: and me just wanting to play with C minimal OS on Xen is not really novel
<br> but hey :)
<br> i'm boring.
mike-burns: <u>jpalmer</u>: What do you work on?
jpalmer: mike-burns: we have a communications platform for use in hospitals.
mike-burns: Seems like a good use case for erl.
jpalmer: we're rewriting it from the ground up for the next version (still in erlang) the CTO for grandcentral/google voice joined us and is leading the rewrite.
mike-burns: Every time I hear about a big erl project, I also hear about a rewrite.
jpalmer: well, this rewrite isn't due to erl. it's due to.. growing pains. As we were developing it, our developers wanted to do stuff the right way. our executive team wanted them to meet unrealistic deadlines the sales team had made for customers. so features were rushed, and shortsighted, etc
<br> that whole saga
mike-burns: Yup, I hear ya.
mercutio: i think things should always be rewritten
<br> but then i hate maintaining legacy code
<br> but the philosophy of a rough draft, then a rewrite sits well with me
<br> mike-burns: have you considered rewriting classic utilities in your group?
<br> i seem to find i understand things better when i reimplement
<br> than when i read
brycec: I love rewriting code! I hate rewriting and/or rediscovering bugs.
mnathani: Is there a way to determine at which hop a file transfer slows down, ie whats the bottleneck. Say the transfer is going from Amsterdam, Europe to Los Angeles, CA. I can perform tests on both ends
mercutio: not really
<br> not unless you can try from the individual hosts in the path
mnathani: Don't really have access to the hosts in the path
mercutio: you can figure out if it's sending or receiving of traffic being problematic
<br> yeah
<br> most people don't
<br> you can "guess"
<br> but yeah you can't really tell
mnathani: Internet routing is best effort once it leaves my network..
mercutio: i love the term best effort
<br> what's your route like?
mnathani: ntt / Level3
mercutio: well i have a ntt each way test
<br> and it's fine
<br> so i'm tempted to blame level3 :/
<br> well 20megabit}
<br> +
<br> which is fine to me
mnathani: I am presently getting 6 megabits on an scp transfer
mercutio: in which direction?
mnathani: its actually from chicage to ARP/ lAx
mercutio: you're not using dropbear are you?
<br> oh
<br> i got 100 megabit from chicago before
mnathani: chicago provider is liquidweb
mercutio: this was from steadfast
<br> my other chicago host is congent
<br> cogent
<br> ick
<br> but seems to dl fast
<br> abbout 4 megabytes/sec
<br> are they using openvz?
<br> with chicago it shouldn't be window size issues
<br> even with 64k window size it should be faster than that
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m0unds: cogent is really inconsistent
mnathani: <u>mercutio</u>: Its a dedicated server in either Chicago, or somewhere in Illinois
m0unds: i thought liquidweb was in detroit?
<br> or near
mnathani: My mistake, its in Lansing, MI
<br> halfway between chicago and detroit pretty much
m0unds: they're a good provider
mnathani: Yup
<br> Who is a really great hosted email provider? (please don't say office 365 or google apps)
m0unds: haha
<br> office365 is
<br> intermedia is another
<br> despite you asking not to say office365, it's a good service :)
mnathani: Doesnt have to be hosted exchange
m0unds: i've used it since launch for my stuff. i resold intermedia for a number of years, their platform is really reliable and good
<br> well, hosted exchange is all i work with for hte most part
<br> i've heard fastmail is ok
<br> luxsci is good
<br> but expensive
mnathani: k
staticsafe: Fastmail++
mjp: any reason to pay for hosted webmail/pop/imap these days? (I can understand exchange)
staticsafe: <u>mjp</u>: as opposed to?
mjp: free stuff
staticsafe: <u>mjp</u>: a certain saying comes to mind
mjp: strength in numbers? :)
m0unds: haha
<br> i stopped managing my own MTAs and stuff because tuning SA and stuff was such a chore
staticsafe: <u>mjp</u>: I'm currently using Fastmail and much prefer if over Gmail/Google Apps
mnathani: does fastmail support a catchall mailbox
staticsafe: i do not know actually
mnathani: Google Apps does, but Office365 does not
m0unds: such a spam hole
staticsafe: i don't like catchalls
<br> spammers love them though
m0unds: yeah, it's not a great practice because it just sort of guarantees higher spam delivery rates
<br> <u>staticsafe</u>: do you use fastmail's web interface or a client?
staticsafe: <u>m0unds</u>: web interface
<br> which btw is very much superior to Google's offering
mnathani: how about alias, so you dont waste mailboxes for sales@, info@, contactus@ etc
staticsafe: <u>mnathani</u>: ofc
<br> i use a separate alias for most stuff
<br> like arpnetworks@example.com
m0unds: yeah, same
<br> either alias or mailnull
<br> username.alias@mailnull.com >> your address
<br> mostly use that for forum signups and public stuff
mnathani: what about filters or rules for categorizing mail
staticsafe: i recently found out the specific alias I use paypal has been sold out
<br> got spam on it
<br> <u>mnathani</u>: their backend uses Sieve
<br> you can write your own rules by hand
<br> or edit the webui thingy
<br> Sieve is so much <3
<br> also the people behind IMAP know their shit when it comes to e-mail hosting
<br> s/IMAP/Fastmail
BryceBot: <staticsafe> also the people behind Fastmail know their shit when it comes to e-mail hosting
m0unds: hahaha
staticsafe: i suppose the people behind IMAP too :P
mnathani: Is there calendar support
staticsafe: <u>mnathani</u>: nope
m0unds: oh, boo.
<br> oh boy, sharknado is on amazon vod
mjp: fair enough then :)
mnathani: Is fastmail by opera?
staticsafe: not anymore
<br> its a company on its own now
mnathani: What can you use the SMS included on a Premier account for?
staticsafe: no idea, I have the "Enhanced" level
mnathani: <u>staticsafe</u>: would you like to pm me your username to put in for referrer at fastmail
staticsafe: sent.
mnathani: thanks
mike-burns: Another vote for Fastmail here.