#arpnetworks 2012-12-24,Mon

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WhoWhatWhen
gluffiswell, merry x-mas everyone then ;) [00:28]
mercutioheh
it's been very quiet around here 		[00:28]
gluffishehe
everyone is asleep :P 		[00:29]
mercutioit's 9:30 pm here [00:29]
gluffishes :D
yes 		[00:29]
mercutiobut it's like 5 hours later than that in the US i think
well west US 		[00:29]
gluffisyep
most people inhere are from the US i assume 		[00:30]
mercutioyeah i think so [00:31]
gluffisgluffis is in CET timezone ;) [00:31]
mercutioit's been quiet for days though
cet? 		[00:32]
gluffisCentral Europeean Time [00:32]
mike-burnsI'm in CET, too! [00:32]
gluffishehe [00:32]
mercutiooh gmt+1 [00:32]
mike-burnsGood morning and merry Christmas! [00:32]
gluffisyes [00:32]
mercutioso like 9:30 am [00:32]
mike-burnsYup. [00:33]
gluffisyes
and it's snowing 		[00:33]
mercutiowow
i wish it snowed here for xmas 		[00:34]
mike-burnsgluffis: Where in CET are you? [00:34]
gluffissweden [00:34]
mike-burnsI'm in Stockholm. [00:34]
gluffishaha
small world 		[00:34]
mercutiooh both cold places [00:34]
mike-burnsHah, sure is. [00:34]
mercutioexplains the snow
isn't it like -6c there often? 		[00:35]
gluffiswinter wise [00:35]
mike-burnsIt's -3 today. [00:35]
mercutiowow
do people go outside? 		[00:35]
mike-burnsSure yeah, that's where the sun is. [00:35]
gluffishad -27 a couple of weeks ago ;) [00:35]
mercutiooh
is it warm in the sun? 		[00:36]
gluffishaha naah
cold as hell 		[00:36]
mercutioheh [00:36]
mike-burnsAnd I was kidding about the sun being outside. [00:36]
mercutioapparently in antarctica they go skinny dipping
i'm like wtf 		[00:36]
gluffiswell, people do that here aswell [00:37]
mercutioscary :) [00:37]
gluffisyes [00:37]
mike-burnshttp://howdepressingisit.in/Stockholm - a friend and I collaborated on a visual representation of the sunrise here (and elsewhere, perhaps). [00:37]
mercutiodo lots of people have car problems in winter?
like not starting? 		[00:38]
mike-burnscf. http://howdepressingisit.in/Sydney [00:38]
mercutioweird it's not loading
it just has white thing in middle of screen
same in palemoon as chrome
i'll rty ie 		[00:38]
mike-burnsThe white thing in Sydney should be large and in Stockholm should be small. [00:39]
mercutiosame diff
oh
that's what it's meant to show? :) 		[00:39]
mike-burnsWe're not actually artists. [00:39]
mercutiowell it looked like it wasn't loading right :)
it's bigger in chrome than ie heh 		[00:39]
mike-burnsHah! [00:40]
mercutiothe main page is nice
what
it's bigger in Auckland than Sydney
oh hangon
it moves to the right
62% versus 61% auckland versus sydney 		[00:40]
mike-burnsIt's bigger by 1% (you can mouse over to see some numbers). [00:41]
mercutioyeh it moves as well though [00:41]
mike-burnsSure, 5:59 vs 5:42. [00:41]
mercutioahh
that's why
We're depressed to tell you we don't know how depressing Antarctica is at the moment. 		[00:42]
mike-burnsYeah, the API we're using isn't very good. Can't find a lot of places. [00:43]
mercutioah [00:43]
CaZeThere are other details that you could add.
Like the length of twilight, and such. 		[00:48]
mercutioabout 90 minutes isn't it? [00:48]
CaZeThat always screws me up. [00:49]
mike-burnsIs there an API that provides that? [00:49]
CaZeThe length of twilight varies according to the season. [00:49]
mercutioare you using redux?
oops 		[00:51]
CaZeAs well as latitude. [00:51]
up_the_ironsindeed, the holidays have kept things quiet around here [01:03]
mercutioup_the_irons: how's the new router going?
or are you taking holiday? 		[01:04]
up_the_ironsmercutio: yeah i'm not working on new stuff for the holidays, just doing support tickets and orders [01:05]
mercutioheh all good [01:06]
up_the_ironsmercutio: last thing I did was run some SMF between new router and original patch panel (for new carrier to be acquired in jan. not sure who it will be yet) [01:06]
mercutioahh so new provider will start on new router? [01:06]
up_the_ironsyep [01:09]
mercutioi suppose crossover will take a while of testing et
etc 		[01:10]
up_the_ironscrossover? [01:13]
mercutiomoving over to the other router
i'm assuming you'll be gradually moving stuff over to the new router setup 		[01:15]
up_the_ironsmercutio: oh, yeah, definitely. the design will allow each customer VLAN to be migrated individually, so I can take my time and do it gracefully [01:22]
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mercutioheh does vlan per customer scale?
well i suppose there's qinq etc
whichi is vlan inside vlan 		[01:45]
up_the_ironsmercutio: scales so far ;) it's only some extra bits on the header and pretty much all NICs offload the VLAN processing in hardware [01:47]
mercutioup_the_irons: yeh but you can only have 4096 customers
i suppose that's quite a few
it's just if you do hit that limit, then suddenly it's a pita :)
that said i iamgine some customers have multiple vm's sharing one vlan 		[01:48]
up_the_ironsmercutio: nah, that's when you just use a 2 layer solution. VLAN XX on router 1 feeds 4096 VLANs on router 2. So you can have 4K*4K customers if it ever comes down to that :) [01:50]
mercutioyeah
that's more like qinq
depends if you need to transport it layered or nto 		[01:51]
up_the_ironsno, qinq is more like vlan translation [01:51]
mercutioit doesn't have to translate
hmm
it is nice having isolation
it's better than having shit loads of arp requests evywehre 		[01:53]
up_the_ironsyep [01:54]
mercutiowhich doesn't scale
not with vm type work loads
cos invariable people port scan cloe ips
close
which tend to be o nthe same box
and then they all get woken up at once
for each arp request
wellit depends on arp caching etc
there's actually some new work on linux switching recently
with uhh vswitch or soemthing 		[01:55]
up_the_ironsnice [01:59]
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gluffisopenswitch
vswitch is VmWare 		[03:33]
plettOpen vSwitch. I've seen some good writeups of people doing clever things with it in combination with kvm, but haven't tried it myself. [03:34]
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toddfhow does 4K x 4K customers work if you have one router? it needs 4k vlans off one nic and 4k vlans off antoher nic? [08:51]
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jlgaddisyou can do up to 4094 vlans per switch (assuming your switch supports that many)
but yeah, you could have SW1 <--> R1 <--> SW2, with SW1 and SW2 connecting to different physical interfaces on the router 		[10:38]
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mercutiotoddf: layered i think?
plett: you don't happen to know if there's some nice overview of these clever things people have done? 		[11:17]
jlgaddis"layered"? [11:30]
mercutiovlan under a vlan
or err
like say you have a vlan for your switch
so swtich has vlan 1000 on master switch
then master switch has a whole lot of vlans under it
oops
i mean switch has a whole lot of vlans under it
really there sohuld be 32bit vlan support or something i reckon :)
the problems come when you want things like to be able to use the vlan on many differnt switches in different locations
then poeple usually say things like mpls
err vpls
hmm someone is doing vpls stuff in openbsd it seems
http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.os.openbsd.tech/29882

realyl open source router platforms are a bit behind in these areas 		[11:35]
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jlgaddisoh, you were referring to 802.1ad. gotcha. [12:31]
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