[00:01] *** ivan-kanis has joined #arpnetworks [00:28] *** jazz57 has left [00:59] *** LT has joined #arpnetworks [02:50] *** jk has quit IRC (Quit: leaving) [02:53] *** jk has joined #arpnetworks [02:54] *** jk has quit IRC (Client Quit) [02:56] *** tuv_ has joined #arpnetworks [02:58] *** jk has joined #arpnetworks [02:59] *** tuv has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [03:32] *** ivan-kanis has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [04:46] *** ivan-kanis has joined #arpnetworks [05:14] i never get awaken by the shuttle landing, and will never get the chance now :( [05:30] ? [05:39] one more [05:47] do you happen to know when the next one lands? [05:55] I'm sure you can use google. atlantis is its name. [06:10] *** dferris_ is now known as dferris [06:30] up_the_irons \o [06:31] up_the_irons: Really liked your service. Will be back one day, but right now I seriously can't afford it. [06:31] YES I'M THAT POOR! [06:32] Don't judge me! [07:12] *** jaja has joined #arpnetworks [07:24] *** DaCa has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [07:24] *** DaCa has joined #arpnetworks [07:52] *** nuke- has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) [07:54] *** nukefree has joined #arpnetworks [08:34] up_the_irons: what is your stance on running TOR exit nodes on your network? [08:46] reardencode: I can't pretend to speak on his behalf but what I've observed is there is a no tolerance policy for illegal stuff. excessive cpu and disk io tend to be frowned upon. [08:46] I see in the logs others are running tor bridges.. [08:47] toddf: tor is very gentle on both CPU and disk, hard on bandwidth [08:48] the legality is a very interesting question -- while others may use an exit node I run for illegal activities, the running of the exit node itself is legal and I would not use the TOR network for illegal activities [08:48] bandwidth is monitored so be prepared for that [08:49] toddf: of course -- I'll eithe rkeep it within my current 500 GB/mo or purchase more for TOR use [08:49] to get an official answer you might ask support@ directly. personally I understand the legal reasons for tor (i.e. wikileaks posting and such) [08:51] yah -- I ran an exit node on my previous ISP and it definitely did cause at least one misdirected legal complaint to their legal dept, which is why I'm curious on up_the_irons' stance [08:51] if he doesn't answer here I'll email support@ [08:57] 2009/11/06 ... [08:57] 155050 < Stellar> can i run torrent flux? [08:57] 155127 < Stellar> some hosting forbid running torrent [08:57] 155133 < Stellar> bot [08:57] 155135 < Stellar> ircd [08:57] 155137 <@up_the_irons> i don't block any ports, but if you serve anything illega [08:57] l, I personally have assisted the FBI in search warrants, so be afraid [08:57] 155139 <@up_the_irons> ;) [08:58] 2009/12/04 ... [08:58] 191000 < dja> I assume theres no restrictions on what can run on the server, I d [08:58] idnt see anything in the acceptable use policy anyway [08:58] 191021 <@up_the_irons> dja: no restrictions, just has to be legal [09:05] thats all I've got in my logs .. I'd honestly be interested in knowing the answer you get so please share it here if you dont get it here [09:15] toddf: do you have a direct link on cancelling an account, or do I just need to email support. I put a ticket in in the help desk... [09:16] niccos: if in doubt email support@. if you can't find it in the portal then email support@. if in doubt email support@. ;-) [09:16] lol [09:16] well, I did last time and never heard anything from them till I came here ;p [09:20] *** LT has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) [09:48] *** cubelogic has joined #arpnetworks [09:51] *** HighJinx has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) [09:56] *** ivan-kanis has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [10:02] *** fink has joined #arpnetworks [10:03] http://www.eff.org/torchallenge [10:06] fink: that's what got me thinking about it again [10:06] reardencode: i like the eff [10:06] they're good people [10:06] oh wait, you weren't here, I was asking up_the_irons about his stance on running exit nodes on arp [10:07] he hasn't answered yet [10:07] reardencode: what did he say [10:07] up_the_irons: +1 for internet freedom [10:07] seems that relays should be totally clear, but exit nodes are the more questionable area [10:25] *** HighJinx has joined #arpnetworks [10:25] The general stance has been: don't do something that will get up_the_irons in trouble. [10:27] that takes all the fun out of it [10:43] *** heavysixer has quit IRC (Quit: BAMPF!) [10:45] so i should take down my freemovies.eu torrent mirror? [10:51] mike-burns: yeah, which is why exit nodes are grey -- they are exceedingly unlikely to get him in actual trouble, but are moderately likely to cause him to get misdirected legal nasty letters [11:09] fink: if you've had it up for a while and no issues to date, I'd wait for an issue to crop up or an official request from arp before taking action like that [11:09] toddf: thanks [11:09] toddf: i was kidding, btw [11:12] I'm just glad I'm not the only one to fall for one of fink's *lies* :-P [11:13] heh [11:13] reardencode: when did i get you? [11:24] *** ivan-kanis has joined #arpnetworks [11:27] *** toddf has quit IRC (Quit: leaving) [11:28] *** toddf has joined #arpnetworks [11:28] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o toddf [11:31] fink: briefly had me believing ARP used SSDs [11:31] hahah oh yea [11:31] it's true! [11:35] hahaha [11:50] lol [12:32] *** ivan-kanis has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [13:30] *** fink has quit IRC (Quit: fink) [14:20] do up_the_irons is around? [14:21] jaja: if he is he will respond ;-) [14:21] I think :P [14:21] how you doing toddf? [14:26] busy as usual. do I know you? [14:29] not really, a costumer here since some month. I try to be polite by asking how you doing :P [14:43] haha. WELL THAT'LL TEACH YOU. ;) [14:54] heh [15:37] jaja: Are you swedish? [15:37] Or Scandinavian :P [15:52] *** heavysixer has joined #arpnetworks [15:52] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o heavysixer [17:05] dxtr: no worries, i'm getting that a lot now; american economy in the shitter, bringing world economy down too i suppose [17:08] reardencode: let's put it this way, if your vps causes me trouble or any other customer trouble, be prepared for an abrupt shutdown and termination ;) [17:09] up_the_irons: tricky, so you getting letters claiming your services are being used for things they aren't (like hosting copyrighted stuff that's really just being transmitted through TOR) might be such a case for abrupt termination? [17:13] reardencode: it's like this... say a customer pays $10 per month for a vps, and I get a some letter from some law firm, saying yada yada... what are the chances the $10 I make from that vps actually outweighs the cost of me opening the letter and dealing with the issue? considering i have hundreds of other vps' at $10, that *don't* cause me the same grief, what do i care if I remove that $10 [17:13] account to save myself hassle? So I hope that makes it more clear :) [17:13] up_the_irons: perfectly, thanks [17:14] up_the_irons: about what I expected, given that you aren't a giant megacorp host like my previous :) [17:14] Approach it using the Ostrich Algorithm (from Tanenbaum): if you ignore the problem, maybe it'll ignore you. [17:14] that's to say, if you don't bug me, i won't bug you ;) [17:14] reardencode: yep :) [17:15] yeah, sadly exit nodes tend to generate such letters, so I"ll just run a relay if anything. [17:15] ok [17:16] up_the_irons: you still around? [17:18] i used to run a colo company that had a big disproportion in the size of clients. So the small guys couldn't get away with much, but some clients paid like $5K or $10K per month, so if legal issues came up (like the call we got from the FBI one day, and subsequent search warrant [see paste by toddf above]), it was hard to say, "take your troubles elsewhere", cuz that would be a big revenue [17:18] hit. I now love only doing $10 and $20 accounts, cuz everyone is on the same playing field and one customer loss is not a big deal [17:18] niccos: just got a phone call, brb [17:18] ok [17:20] interesting perspective, thanks [17:24] up_the_irons: Where's the fun in cooperating with law enforcement? :D [17:25] Doesn't cost you anything to say "Come back with a court order, noobs!" [17:25] But if they already have a court order it's like "Oh well. I surrender!" [17:26] dxtr: 2 words [17:26] patriot act [17:27] Oh, yeah. I forgot you've got laws like that [17:27] yes, and they were voted in again [17:27] land of the free! [17:27] :D [17:28] dxtr: what tax farm do you hail from? [17:28] It's awesome that you guys are bringing your freedom here, niccos ;) [17:28] reardencode: Huh? [17:28] "tax farm" -> country [17:28] ≤Oh [17:28] he means what country [17:28] lol [17:28] Sweden [17:28] oh nice [17:28] and yeah, our money and freedom is there [17:28] :p [17:29] money = freedom [17:29] Ah, beautiful country, been to Stockholm once [17:29] reardencode: Me too! [17:29] too bad you're enslaved for > 50% of the year before your wages go to you ;) [17:29] niccos: We officially call ourselves your bitch nowadays [17:29] reardencode: Huh? [17:30] lol @ that [17:30] IIRC the tax burden in Sweden is ~55% on average where in the US it's ~40% [17:30] 55%? [17:30] well [17:30] I pay no problems paying taxes [17:30] I'm happy to be mistaken, maybe I"ll move :) [17:30] Oh, you mean income *AND* outcome tax? [17:30] as long as the money gets used, and not to line some fat politicians pocket [17:30] dxtr: yes [17:30] Yeah, that's close to 55% [17:30] up_the_irons, did you receive my mail about the payment? [17:31] ok, I should stop talking, my positions are far too controversial for a quiet technical room :) [17:31] reardencode: VAT is a bitch. But apparently that's *kind of* EU regulated [17:32] dxtr: yah, the EU is pretty evil -- but I thought Sweden was mostly independent of it by virtue of not being on the Euro? [17:32] I generally like taxes but nowadays I have no idea what the hell we are spending all the money on. [17:32] reardencode: haha. You'd be amazed [17:32] :( [17:33] well [17:33] dxtr: if you were in the us [17:33] We get bitch slapped all the time for having laws that care about privacy too much [17:33] And integrity and stuff [17:33] we like letting congress vote on stuff that has the most money [17:33] dxtr: yeah, I've seen some of that, very unfortunate [17:33] jaja: probably, i get a lot of email at the beginning of the month (about payment ;) [17:34] dxtr: i actually have no problem with law enforcement. i will not harbor criminals ;) [17:34] criminals make the world go round [17:34] ! [17:35] reardencode: Also, according to Wikileaks the US are threatening us if we don't implement their laws and stuff. The list goes on [17:35] up_the_irons: Because, as we know, law enforcements *ALWAYS* go after definitive criminals [17:35] And they never do wrong :) [17:35] dxtr: again, I've seen some of that sort of news, very unfortunate. Hopefully Sweden does more to stand up for itself than the states of the US have [17:36] up_the_irons: I'd agree with your stance there entirely if I could fathom the validity of crimes without victims (ie IP crimes or drug crimes) [17:36] reardencode: Thing is that all the good politicans are somehow passively forced to quit. It's either bullying or direct harassments from other politicians [17:36] (other politicians == politicians bribed by someone) [17:37] dxtr: the guy the FBI nabbed in the case I was involved in was a definite criminal ;) [17:37] dxtr: agreed, the only good politicians are the ones who don't want the job and unfortunately they're the easiest to push out of the business [17:38] *** niccos has quit IRC (Quit: brb) [17:38] reardencode: Also, some politicians make a political U-turn when they're about to vote for something. (Look up Fredrik Federley) [17:38] or Barrack Obama... [17:38] This Fredrik Federley actually went up to the podium i parliament and started crying. Live. Hoping people would feel sorry for him [17:39] And he was the most popular and promising politician for ages [17:39] That went out the window pretty fast [17:39] Oh boo-hoo I make several times the national average salary, get free medical insurance and a car service? [17:39] lol [17:39] Dear politician, please buy someone to care about your woes, kthnx. [17:40] pilgrimd: Kind of [17:40] up_the_irons, okey, t's was only to told you, you're able to take the payment now, I added found on the credits card, it's only for you don't suspend my server. Generally I add the money on my pre-pay credits card each 1th day of each month in the middle of morning. Sorry for the declined [17:40] up_the_irons: Lucky :P [17:41] up_the_irons: Might be a cultural thing or something. But here people generally don't like to cooperate with law enforcement without proof [17:41] Especially not lately [17:42] I think it started with Thepiratebay and PRQ [18:37] *** cubelogic has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) [18:39] jaja: no problem [18:40] dxtr: well, the FBI told us what the customer was doing, and then we checked it out ourselves, and were like "oh duh, why didn't we notice this before?" ;) it was mass scale software piracy [18:40] we didn't really need any proof, it was pretty obvious [18:43] * HighJinx can haz warez? [18:43] j/k [18:43] yeah - just don't do anything that gets the machines seized without up_the_irons getting involved [18:44] that's pretty damn annoying :) [18:44] i should get an arp box at some point, im still on dh for ease hehe [18:45] so - my offsite snapshotting project is mostly working well [18:45] HighJinx: why yes, u should ;) [18:45] except when it breaks... zfs can leave a snapshot lying around with a '%' in the name [18:45] and then doesn't know how to delete it [18:45] so it has required manual intervention every few days [18:46] RandalSchwartz: rm -i * ;) just hit "no" until it gets to the file you want [18:46] can run a cron to check filenames and delete [18:46] zxfer has mostly been painless though [18:46] it's not a filename - it's a snapshot [18:46] visible only to zdb :( [18:46] ah ok [18:46] ah [18:47] when you "zfs recv" an incremental, it has to create a temporary snapshot for the incoming data [18:47] and if that aborts somehow, the temporary one isn't deleted [18:47] but the next "zfs recv" aborts, because it tries to delete the proper name, not the temp name [18:48] otherwise, the idea of using "zfs send -i zroot@then zroot@now | ssh remotehost zfs recv" works pretty well [18:48] that's essentially what zxfer is doing [18:48] so I have precisely the same snapshots in texas that I do in LA now [18:48] within a 15 minute window [18:49] up_the_irons - this is the service I said you should offer when we talked about this a year go [18:49] first - mirror the data remotely [18:49] second - make it "ready to go" on a DNS switch [18:49] third - make it "ready to go" via some load balancer [18:49] multiple levels of spare-ish-ness [18:50] just need to get zxfer aware of the '%'-named temp clones [18:50] the nice thing about mirroring a snapshot is that the psql will come up very clean [18:51] since the files are all snapped in a moment-in-time [18:51] might lose current transactions but no more [18:52] * up_the_irons takes a walk, brb [18:53] *** HighJinx has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) [18:57] *** mig5 has joined #arpnetworks [19:04] up_the_irons: Did this customer do all this unencrypted? [19:04] That's kind of retarded :P [19:07] it can happen [19:07] people are stupid everywhere [19:08] I was copying files to my new vps, and was marginally surprised to find my backups on the old box were actually working :x [19:08] I thought I disabled it (was daily backups of a minecraft server, so I wasn't really going to die if I lost it) [19:21] *** EhtyarWRK has joined #arpnetworks [20:00] *** heavysixer has quit IRC (Quit: heavysixer) [20:04] "minecraft server" [20:05] Well, the backend for the multiplayer variant, if you'd prefer that [20:06] I haven't even had it running in months, but cron dutifuly ran the backup script I made [20:06] +daily [20:07] Looks like the "delete files older than seven days" part didn't work, though [20:14] 'like taxes'. unless you work for the irs I can't understand that position. [20:18] taxes on income enable the government to continue to bloat out of control. I wish for the old days when even sales tax was a bad thing and ones own income was ones own, not the government's business. *sigh*. [20:18] [20:19] hey todd [20:19] * toddf waves [20:19] that console server stuff is gonna happen soon. we're building a fab^H^H^Hbasement in a few weeks [20:20] niice [20:20] guess I should bump the todo to get the website back up again. *sigh*. got some time critical work on my plate and an early morning so not in the next 12hrs for sure. [20:20] maybe if we send one to up_the_irons we can get a free month haha [20:20] i'll host it dude [20:21] I'd not want to send anyone a rev 0.0 hardware thing and expect compensation in that manner [20:21] i'll be sure to mark it 0.1 so you can sleep well [20:21] =) [20:22] *grin* [20:23] $ whois bsdhw.org [20:23] NOT FOUND [20:23] $ whois 2clausehardware.org [20:23] NOT FOUND [20:23] $ whois twoclausehardware.org [20:23] NOT FOUND [20:23] take your pick heh [20:27] I like shorter domains, but that's my own personal preference :) /random input [20:28] yeah - bsdhw.org seems good [20:28] * RandalSchwartz registers it out of spit [20:28] spite [20:29] Quite a talent if you can register things with your spit [20:29] as an Old Guy on the Internet, I'm granted such privs. :) [20:30] as in "I've been shipping IP packets longer than you've been alive" is almost aalways true :) [20:32] *** EhtyarWRK has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [20:35] speaking of being old, it's my bedtime [20:40] * RandalSchwartz spits, and registers five new domains [20:41] *** HighJinx has joined #arpnetworks [20:43] * gamarco has prior art! [20:44] * RandalSchwartz has useless art [21:36] *** EhtyarWRK has joined #arpnetworks