#arpnetworks 2011-01-18,Tue

toddf

standard deployment and security should dictate you are not concerned about malicous behavior, attracting a DOS or DDOS tends to require a special kind of questionable behavior anyway, other than that, should not worry

bharatak

point taken

jpalmer

jpalmer has always questioned the whole "hidden master" concept, anyway
I've literally tried, and have never found a practical reason you'd want the master hidden.

hahaha http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?site=AS:15169

bharatak

yeah - there's really no reason - i was concerned about the additional bandwidth usage, but it's minimal so far anyway

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[10:19]

toddf

[10:22]

RandalSchwartz

heh - google is one of the biggest sources of malware!

[10:26]

toddf

at least their tools that detect it accurately point fingers at themsleves as well. hahaha.

[10:27]

RandalSchwartz

that must be the source of the occasional hiccup where google tries to prevent you from going to google.com
I bet they have that hardcoded now

[10:30]

toddf

until the next new employee figures hardcoding is for wimps, lets make the logic right... ;-)

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[10:43]

jlgaddis

jpalmer: we use a hidden master, but it's mostly for convenience
it's local, we make changes there, they propagate to our secondaries, which are in other geographical locations
those secondaries are the ones visible when you lookup our ns rr's

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up_the_irons

RandalSchwartz: whoa, nice :)

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[12:35]

RandalSchwartz

yeah, keep that on your bookmark bar.

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mike-burns

http://www.daemonology.net/blog/2011-01-18-tarsnap-critical-security-bug.html - I know there's a couple of tarsnap users in here.

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[13:18]

mike-burns

(The person who reported that bug, Taylor Campbell, was someone I taught introductory programming to ten years ago. He's come a long way!)

[13:19]

jpalmer

mike-burns: if you want to teach me an introductory programming class, I'm in
heh

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[13:52]

vcs

lol

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phlux

mike-burns, where do you teach?

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jdoe

mike-burns: that's kinda impressive, cperciva(l) knows his stuff...
huh, that's a good write up and mea culpa from him too.

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[16:39]

ideas1

Ok, After spending the last four days reading on freebsd I really love a few things... documentation is very well organized, pf is sweet, and it does boot up way faster.

[16:40]

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[16:41]

jlgaddis

yes, yes, drink the kool-aid =)

[16:44]

merky

faster than what?

[16:44]

jlgaddis

grandma

[16:44]

ideas1

centos
lol

[16:45]

merky

oh centos seems realyl slow to boot for some reason
i find openbsd kind of slow to boot
compared to ubuntu
but it's the kernel that's slow.. checking floppy drives etc.. seems like there are in built delays
linux 2.0.36 used to be slow to boot
linux 2.2 speed up boot heaps..

[16:45]

ideas1

annoying was the naming of the devices, eth0 vs em0 rh1 etc etc
why is that?

[16:46]

merky

oh yeh eth0 etc is really annoying
linux is special you change kernels and your ethernet devices all reorder
2.2 changed ethernet order compared to 2.0
it's a long standing issue with linux
for some reason they thought it was sensible to bring up ethernet interfaces in the order the modules load

[16:46]

ideas1

im going to be honest freebsd reminded me of high school and my days with slackware

[16:47]

merky

which changes over time
linux has "new" fixes to it these days
they do all this shit in udev
but you change an ethernet interface .. just have 1 in a box
and it'll become eth1
when the old one was eth0
seriously, the eth0 way is broken
solaris/bsd/windows etc don't have generic ethernet device #

[16:48]

ideas1

i ordered two books absolute bsd and the pf book both 2nd ed

merky

acutally maybe windwos has a hoko for that
i haven' tuoched freebsd since ilke 2001 really

ideas1

drive letters annoy me in windows
lol

merky

i downloaded an iso recently, and it didn't boot in virtualbox
then i downloaded another one, can't remember where that got to
heh
drive letters in windows can be special just like linux

ideas1

lol oh come on

merky

oh, and linux has that horrible reordering of hard-disks
depending on module loading times too

ideas1

my linux sense is tingling

merky

used to be hell with a usb flash stick
i don'tknow, linux is fast and random

ideas1

merky you recommend openbsd?

merky

it's ilke the loose girl that you know is easy
but you don't know what's lingering inside
idk.
i use ubuntu, opensolaris, and openbsd.

ideas1

root goodness

merky

they all have their benefits / drawbacks.

ideas1

i thought opensolaris is dead?

merky

i find opensolaris the most confusing to be honest.
i don'tknow, it hasn't crashed on me since oracle boughtthem out

ideas1

i tried it solaris 10 once and that was that

merky

does that mean it's dead?

jlgaddis

jlgaddis pats the ultra 10

merky

solaris 10 doesn't even come with zfs unless you udpate it
openbsd runs on sparcs.

ideas1

zfs works now?

merky

on solaris 10 yeh
you do updates
it may not work on root
oh yeh, ufs sucks.
i like zfs.

ideas1

all i ever use is fedora, rhel 5 and now 6 and centos, just tryung bsd

[16:53]

merky

i haven't played with in freebsd

[16:53]

ideas1

im confused about the roles in bsd's what makes open better than free
or why would i choose for apache server

[16:53]

jlgaddis

nothing
plus theo's an asshole

ideas1

theo?

jlgaddis

the guy who runs openbsd

ideas1

ohhh
i had a chat back and forth with the guy from tarsnap
security officer for freebsd

jlgaddis

yeah, colin

merky

gah
my car alternator's fucked

ideas1

nice guy bad ass support
not charging ?

merky

he's a geek
yeah not charging
i charged it overnight
so i cuold at least not tow it

ideas1

you did check the battery right?

merky

well it wouldn't jump star

ideas1

are you in the us?

merky

and even after charging overnight battery light stayed on
nah new zealand
japanese car

ideas1

auto parts places here in usa tes the alternator for free

merky

same here
generally

ideas1

it could be the battery though because i had a funny issue where my motorcyle wouldturn of and on

merky

it's still annoying

ideas1

yeah it is

merky

well thing is
last time
i jump started it they ran a test
and nothing was draining it
and the alternator was working fine
but i still had a flat battery
ran it for a while
and it was fine
then next time wanted to drive it woudln't sart
not even jump start

ideas1

seems more like the battery not holding charge
do you have a battery tester?
manual or auto?

[16:59]

merky

manual

[16:59]

ideas1

have you tried push starting it?

[16:59]

merky

nope
battery not holding charge would mean it would jump start
like

[17:00]

ideas1

true

merky

engine was conking out
as soon as other battery was disconnected

ideas1

hope not

merky

but hmm,

ideas1

check all the contacts make sure they clean

merky

i wonder if it's battery too
i dunno i took it to a mechanic
i wonder if it's draining randomly still though
thing is if it's alternator without battery draining

ideas1

checked fuses?

merky

oops if it's alternator why would the car stop workign?

ideas1

anything blown?

merky

after working
i dunno how to do that really
i'm a computer geek not an auto geek
i do software :/

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3d/5th-Toyota-Celica.jpg

ideas1

depends on the car some cars require more electrical power

[17:03]

merky

it's a celica, i don't think they're common thre?
there

[17:03]

ideas1

yeah i see them but not often

[17:03]

merky

ahh
they have worse engines in the US on them though

[17:04]

ideas1

yeah smog law

[17:04]

merky

ideas1

they are suppose to help but i think it might make them worse

merky

looks kind of like that
lower performance
i dunno new cars are all higher performance :/
moer efficient

ideas1

yeah my current car 2008 has a super charger lol

merky

i think 0-60mph is like 9 seconds

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEAT_Le%C3%B3n

ideas1

mine has 266 hp more like 5.9
american love the hp

[17:06]

merky

heh
5.9 that'd be quite nice

[17:07]

ideas1

yeah its nice but gas isnt
i get about 30miles per gallon but if i start stepping on pedal too much around 18

[17:07]

merky

Capacity 2.0 litres Normally Aspirated, Power 158 bhp @ 6600 rpm, Torque140 ftlb @ 2800 rpm, 0-60 7.9 seconds, Top Speed 137 mph, Fuel Economy 28.5 mpg, Fuel Capacity 60 litres, Wheel Size14" (205/60 Tyres)
that fuel economy is non-city
and i think that 0-60 time is on the ideal side

[17:09]

ideas1

yeah

[17:10]

merky

so your car is like over 50% more hp
thing is turbo only works above 3000 rpm if you get the turbo model
which means you have to drive at high revs if you want to make use of the turbo

[17:10]

ideas1

turbo is a little diff then super charger

[17:11]

merky

yaeh
how does super charger work
celicas are meant to be high revving anyway though.. 7.2k red line
but i still don't really push above 3000 revs that much

[17:11]

ideas1

yeah most japanes cars like acura, honda and toyota make high compression engiens

[17:12]

merky

well petrol engines in general rean't so great at low revs

[17:13]

ideas1

do you guys have those german cars LEON

[17:14]

merky

don't think so?
we have lots of bmws
esp where i live
apparently we have lost of skylines too
nissan that is

[17:14]

ideas1

[17:14]

merky

and in other parts of the world they're not usually allwoed
cos too high performance stock
nah never see them

[17:15]

ideas1

me either

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[17:15]

merky

lots of subaru's too

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:UgceHKYfXjK1NM:http://www.subaru.smartcarreview.net/images/subaru-wrx.jpg&t=1

like those things

[17:16]

ideas1

suburu are nice especially the 4x4

[17:16]

merky

we hardly have any us cars
most subarus are 4x4
err 4wd

[17:16]

ideas1

lol
us cars eat a ton of gas
and they are huge

[17:17]

merky

yeah
well your car doesn't?
is it US?

[17:17]

ideas1

yeah

[17:17]

merky

i think in general cars use less gas now

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Whiteturbocobalt.png

ideas1

merky

i used to use quite a lot of gas
cos i reved a lot :/

ideas1

lol

merky

i think it's gone down a bi
i'm worse when i haven't driven in a while :/
it's like just want to get to the feeling
is yours white?

ideas1

red

[17:19]

merky

ahh
white is ugly on cars i reckon

[17:19]

ideas1

well here in the us many goverment cars are white
not all but many

[17:19]

merky

oh weird i still had that celica picture open it looks weird
it doesn't have a spoiler?

[17:20]

ideas1

nope
i had that removed other wise its identical

[17:20]

merky

it's weird when you find picutres on net
oh celica did't i mean
oh you had your spoiler removed, why?

[17:20]

ideas1

it was too big
and it looks liek i want to have a racer car but dint quite make it
lol

[17:21]

merky

haha
yaeh
my car loosk slightly racy
for a cheap car
but like it's not lowered, has standard wheels

[17:22]

ideas1

once you take it off, it just looks like a sport sedan

[17:22]

merky

no big bore exhaust

ideas1

yeah but the suspension is super nice
no i hage big bore
the quiter the btter

merky

heh

ideas1

lol if i was 18

merky

you like big bore?

ideas1

nope

merky

oh you hate?

ideas1

yes a lot, its annoying

merky

they kind of rumble
yaeh

ideas1

rrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr rrrrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

merky

it's loud enough without

ideas1

rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
see

merky

heh

ideas1

lol

merky

do people all do hat pod filter thing there?

ideas1

not sure what you mean

merky

oh it's this weird air filter thing
that doesn't accomplish much
but looks wierd

ideas1

ohhh cold air intakes
some do
mine came with it

merky

and blow off valves

ideas1

yeah

merky

so you can hear hem changing gears a mile away

ideas1

no, i get the speed not the sound
mine is from chevy not aftermarket

merky

heh

[17:26]

ideas1

you have a motorcycle?

[17:26]

merky

nope
i'd like to one day

[17:27]

ideas1

i have a small one
800cc
does anyone know of a good dns host?
i used to host with zoneedit
but its starting to becoming a nightmore with there new "gui"

[17:27]

merky

he.net?
for secondary? or primary?

[17:29]

ideas1

primary

[17:29]

merky

i just use dbdns
djbdns
which is a dns sever
server
low memory use
you just scp the database around
doesn't give you a gui

[17:29]

ideas1

i was hoping to to host it but i think that may be the only solution

merky

you just have lines like: =arp.meh.net.nz:174.136.111.234:300

ideas1

unless i want to pay 15.00 per domian

merky

where last number is ttl
= means it does forward and reverse
not that reverse dns is sent to me or anything
i just set it as a default generally
+ is forward only
i dunno i find it simple enough

ideas1

seems simple enough

[17:32]

merky

@meh.net.nz:202.49.71.57:a::180
then that's how you do mail
where you can have a, b, c, etc to set precedence
err i'm not sure if that sets precendce acutally
i'm only running 1 mail
then nameservers are like:
.meh.net.nz:202.49.71.57:a:259200
.meh.net.nz:202.36.174.57:b:259200
etc etc
i have 7 on that domain at the moment

[17:32]

ideas1

does it also handle ipv6
?

[17:34]

merky

kind of
:ipv6.uk.meh.net.nz:28:040001004160037010022022000000000000000000000002:3600
there's a record creator on the net

[17:34]

ideas1

interesting

[17:34]

merky

but yeah it's a bit annoying for ipv6
ilke i can't read that
i thought it couldn't do ipv6 at first

[17:35]

ideas1

ill have to read up on it

[17:35]

merky

do you have more than one ip to host on though?
basically i just have an update script i rnu
which uses ssh keys and scp's data.cdb
http://cr.yp.to/djbdns.html
that's the authors website
he gives his opinions freely
You don't have to set up two DNS servers. Your DNS servers don't have to be more highly replicated than your web servers, mail servers, etc. As an extreme, if you have just one computer for your web server, mail server, and DNS server, then setting up a second DNS server is silly. (Third-party DNS servers are almost always a bad idea.) However, if you're running a large site with many services, you should set up two DNS servers.
which kind of holds true
no use in having dns redundant if can't even access your web site / mail

[17:35]

ideas1

yeah

[17:38]

merky

but you usually need two name servers to get a domain setup these days
even if it's just two ips on the same box
some people use nsd too
i haven't checked it out myself, been using tinydns for 10 years

[17:38]

ideas1

now on freebsd is it he same drill as in linux, firewalll, secure ssh, install configure apache,mysql, and php then run websites?

[17:40]

merky

yaeh
i'm glad you're thinking of firewalling first :)

[17:41]

ideas1

well that usually what i do first

[17:41]

merky

freebsd has pf now
pf is cool :")

ideas1

yeah i fell it love it
over iptables

merky

heh
i like it how you can reload your config
and if there's an error it won't load anything
rather than running through al ist of iptables rulse

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merky

and it has a problem executing one of them
and the syntax makes more sense

ideas1

does freebsd have runlevel like linux?

merky

not sure
you use runlevels?

ideas1

yeah mainly when i am troubshooting

merky

looks like multi/single
that's all

ideas1

you can reboot it and depending on the runlevel some servceis wont boot up

merky

single probably won't start services up

ideas1

ok
seems straight forward

merky

as it should be :)

ideas1

im not going to lie i feel like a traitor for using freebsd

merky

instead of openbsd?

ideas1

linux lol

merky

oh
no-one cares if you use linux or not

ideas1

my buddies do lol

merky

it's what distribution you use
just tell them it's another version of linux
but more free

ideas1

haha

merky

i dunno i had a buddy who used to think it was cool i used openbsd
but he wouldn't run it himself
coz blah. id on't even remember his reasoning

ideas1

all my buddies are redhat guuys

merky

heh

ideas1

two of them are rhce

merky

gay

ideas1

haha

merky

that's like mcse

ideas1

i dont know about that

merky

it doeesn't prove competence
it proves ability to jump through hoops

ideas1

lol

merky

some of the stupidest ideas i've heard have come from mcse-certified people :/

ideas1

yeah me too

merky

and generally speaking the more people learn from educational places
the mre "ideas" they have

ideas1

rhce does carry some weight though way more than mcse

merky

that aren't based in the real world

jlgaddis

jlgaddis hides his mcse

ideas1

concepts are the real knowlege

merky

heh
ccne holds more wait

ideas1

lol jlgaddis

merky

ccie hols more wait still

ideas1

oh by far

merky

weight
you cold probably get a linux job with cisco certification

ideas1

but ccie is sleep breathing and eating cisco for a couple of years

merky

easier than with redhat certificatin

ideas1

i have a linux job lol

merky

even though cisco doesn't do linux shit

jlgaddis

i'm not to ccie yet

merky

i have a linux/openbsd/opensolaris job

jlgaddis

not dedicated enough

ideas1

yeah me neither

merky

i think ccie is reserved for arrogant cock suckers myself

ideas1

jlgaddis: are you working on the ccie?

merky

cos really you don't need that to be able to learn what's realyl necessary to know
it's more to be able to say i can do this and this and this and this and this

ideas1

you would be suprised how many tech dont know tcp/ip

merky

and i'm really smart
and like to flaunt it

ideas1

lol

merky

i always forget netmasks myself
i use this command called netmask

jlgaddis

ideas1: i was, i kinda gave up on it though

merky

i'm like 240/30 .. what's the start/end address?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jlgaddis/4226147456/

jlgaddis

ideas1

why?

merky

# netmask -r 192.168.255.240/30
192.168.255.240-192.168.255.243 (4)

jlgaddis

ideas1: other things i'd rather do with my free time than study 24/7
so the ccnp is probably gonna be it. ccip, if i ever get around to finishing that.

ideas1

that a nice rack...no pun intended

merky

god old cisco siwtches are ugly

ideas1

i have my rhce coming up in may

merky

those are 48 port 10/100 right?

jlgaddis

yeah

ideas1

i like procurve
thats all i really use here

jlgaddis

oh god
don't say that word.

ideas1

lol
there 1000gbt are nice
and not too pricey

merky

1000 gigabit?

ideas1

yeah

merky

i didn't know such existed

jlgaddis

i left an "I <3 JUNOS" sticker in their executive briefing center in roseville

merky

10 gigabit is expensive enough

ideas1

jlgaddis: really? why the hate?
anythign 10 giga is pricy

jlgaddis

because they cause me more trouble than anything else?

merky

well that's just tempting anyway
surely you mean 1000mbit?

ideas1

im sorry yes

merky

cool :)
when's 10 gigabit coming down in price anyway
i can't download my porn fast enough

jlgaddis

heh, 63 results from google for "hate hp" on my web site

merky

jlg: haha

ideas1

haha

merky

so you love hp?
what do you think of hp computers
err servers

ideas1

lenovo

[17:56]

jlgaddis

they're okay, it's mostly the procurve's i hate

[17:56]

ideas1

procurves just the switches
we have cisco routers

[17:56]

merky

what made you choose cisco over juniper?

[17:57]

ideas1

service contracts
cisco can get me parts in 4hrs

[17:57]

merky

oh right
cos it's ok to be offline for 4 hours?

[17:57]

ideas1

lol

merky

i dunno i use openbsd as routers

jlgaddis

switching to juniper would cost us a lot in retraining

merky

it's probably less reliable
jlg: heh i never even thought of that

jlgaddis

besides, as soon as you mentioned the j-word, cisco starts throwing more discounts at you

merky

oh cool

ideas1

lol

merky

hey cisco let's have a joint

jlgaddis

wrong j-word =)

merky

damn
should call it a j