[01:07] *** LT has joined #arpnetworks [01:34] *** schmir has joined #arpnetworks [01:35] RandalSchwartz: this week was busy; I thought u might be in for another week? I never made it down to the data center [01:46] Hey, up_the_irons! [01:46] hey [01:47] What's up? [01:47] up_the_irons: o/ [01:47] nothing [01:47] setting up some orders actually [01:48] anyone in London here [01:49] i'm in the UK coobra if that helps [01:50] bob^^: :D [01:50] no [01:50] not realy [01:50] just wanted to know [01:50] ahh :) [01:50] i've got kit in london :) [01:51] coobra: Sweden [01:51] Doe that count? :P [01:51] Does* [01:52] kit ? [01:52] i suspect i'm nearer ;) [01:52] the robot "KIT" [01:52] equipment coobra - servers/routers etc :) [01:52] :D [01:52] ohhh [01:52] gimmi [01:52] no :) [01:53] dxtr: im from sweden im here on bett : http://www.bettshow.com/bett11/website/Home.aspx?refer=1 [01:54] wtf is bett? [01:54] schoole thingy [01:55] Mkay [01:55] Where in sweden are you from? [01:55] stockholm/Värmdö you ? [01:55] Norrköping [01:55] cool [01:56] Immensely :) [01:58] My girlfriend is going to londong on the 19th though :P [01:58] err [01:58] London [01:58] cool [01:58] london is great [01:58] i will be admin ower the wifi + local webdev servers @work [01:58] :D [01:59] junior mini admin [01:59] :D [01:59] bob^^: In fact I think the entire UK looks like hell on eartyh [01:59] earth* [01:59] So I will probably never go there [01:59] *** ideas1 has joined #arpnetworks [01:59] Especially London [02:00] really? [02:00] hey everyone [02:00] man :( [02:00] Yeah [02:00] you've been looking at the wrong parts [02:00] Mainly the personal integrity [02:01] I don't want cameras at me wherever I go ./ [02:01] well [02:01] cameras looking at me* [02:01] does anyone know if I can run centos with arpsnetwork? [02:01] ideas1: Should be possibe [02:01] possible* [02:01] Gah. Morning typos [02:01] i think its debian/ubntu ? [02:02] dxtr: don't believe everything you read :) [02:02] ideas1: Did you try googling? [02:02] not centos but i think it will be no probs [02:02] london might be like that, but the rest of the country isn't [02:02] yeah i googled it but nothing with this particular vps provider [02:02] bob^^: The rest of the country is rain and forests to me [02:02] i cant find reviews or anything [02:04] ideas1: try googling: centos km [02:04] err [02:04] centos kvm [02:04] dxtr: go look at Edinburgh [02:04] :) [02:04] derp derp [02:04] sorry [02:04] but yes, we have lots of rain - not much forest, just lots of countryside and nice little towns and villages :D [02:05] bob^^: Unfortunately I prefer civilization :) [02:06] http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a0/Edinburgh_from_Scott_Monument.jpg <- It looks green... And gray [02:06] wow that beautiful [02:07] thats* [02:07] Doesn't look very modern [02:07] it's one of the most beautiful cities in the world :) [02:07] it's not modern dude, that's the point! [02:07] I don't see it, ut sure [02:07] but* [02:07] it's all at least 200 years old i guess [02:07] Why don't they blow it up and start over? 200 years is quite old [02:08] I like it modern. Think central Tokyo or Seoul [02:09] and lose all the architectural beauty [02:09] i live in california and all those buildings look like boxes [02:09] exactly [02:09] i like modern too - but not all the time [02:09] I don't see the "architectural beauty" in old crap anyway. I throw away things when they beome too old [02:09] become [02:10] lol [02:10] :( [02:10] It's gray and dull [02:10] lol [02:10] you should open your mind :) [02:11] you should, i wish more things had history and told a story [02:11] everything looks like boxes here :( [02:11] I did. That's when I realized I prefer functionality before age [02:12] *** schmir has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection) [02:12] i drink in a bar (well, pub) that's over 500 years old [02:12] american tourists come in [02:12] can you get corona over there? [02:12] it's fun to point out the bar is older than the US [02:12] :) [02:12] yup [02:12] i like corona :) [02:12] mexican beers are good, any english beers you recommend? [02:12] It's a hell to maintain old buildings (Been there, done that), they look boring and usually you don't get the functionality you get with modern building [02:12] buildings [02:13] yeah ideas1 - have you had proper beer or just lager (like corona) ? [02:13] (this sort of beer: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cask_ale ) [02:13] And if you dare to modernize an old building you'll get the rage from old people [02:14] both we have a ton of local breweries aka micro breweries [02:14] mmm, micro breweries :D [02:14] my favourite british beer is Purity UBU (http://www.puritybrewing.com/) - they are my local brewery [02:14] i even watch soccer lol [02:15] american beer - i love sierra nevada pale ale :) [02:15] actually, you guys have a lot of very nice good beer [02:15] sierra nevada isnt bad [02:16] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newcastle_Brown_Ale [02:16] *** schmir has joined #arpnetworks [02:16] that's known here as 'newcky brown' [02:17] it *used* to be nice - but now it is brewed by another company, and is not very good :( [02:17] pronounced "noo-key"? [02:17] yup :) [02:17] nice lol im calling it that from now on here [02:17] :D [02:18] ill act like i knew that all along lol [02:18] hahaha - it might even say it on the back of the bottle [02:18] at one point they changed the label here so it said that :) [02:18] ohhh you didnt know it was called newky brown, rookie!?! [02:18] because no one calls it by the full name hehe [02:18] :D [02:18] Hmm [02:19] My sleeping girlfriend have rotated 90 degrees in the bed [02:19] That's quite impressive [02:19] sleeping?! it's 10:25! ;) [02:19] do you guys get these http://www.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&tbs=isch:1&&sa=X&ei=fSQwTejROYS8sAPLmbSsBQ&ved=0CDMQvwUoAQ&q=corona+familiar&spell=1&biw=1680&bih=914 [02:20] ooo, no, we don't [02:20] bob^^: Yeah, she's been sleeping for three hours :p [02:20] 940ml of beer in one bottle [02:20] Okay, more like four [02:20] we just get these: http://www.crackedkettle.com/store/images/corona.jpg [02:20] :D [02:20] lol those are tiny [02:20] you do get some beers here in 1l bottles, but not too many [02:20] most of our beer comes as a pint - 568ml [02:21] or those sort of bottle, about 330ml :/ [02:21] cheap beers come in huge sizes here, but good bears caps at about 940 [02:21] bottles of good beer here are 500ml [02:21] which is really annoying [02:22] lol too big? [02:22] as you pour it into a pint (568ml) glass and it doesn't fill it... sigh [02:22] haha [02:22] sooo how was the moral about the english soccer team? [02:22] getting really expensive to drink here as well [02:22] did you guys fire your technical director? [02:22] bob^^: That's why you've got 50cl glass [02:22] dxtr: PINT! [02:23] Half a litre? [02:23] ideas1: i'm afraid i have no idea - i don't follow soccer/football at all :( [02:23] i'm a motorsport and rugby guy :) [02:23] cars or bikes? [02:23] pint = 568ml.. and we are very protective over our pint :) [02:23] cars ideas1 :D [02:23] single seaters mostly - f1, gp2 etc [02:23] nice [02:23] Half a litre = 50cl.. And we are very protective over our standardized metric system [02:23] a pint: http://www.darlocamra.org.uk/PintOnBar.jpg [02:24] stupid europeans [02:24] ;) [02:24] lol [02:24] are you guys freebsd users? [02:24] Yep [02:24] here in the UK we are quite 'traditional' over weights and measures [02:24] yeah [02:24] it's still entirely normal here for everything to be inches, feet, yards and miles [02:24] and to buy fruit/vegetables by the ounce or pound [02:25] and beer by the pint [02:25] bob^^: I hate when I watch TV shows from the UK and they weigh stuff in "stone". I'm like "Can't two stones weigh differently?" [02:25] even though none of those are allowed in europe :D [02:25] haha :D [02:25] stone = 14 pounds [02:25] And wtf is a pound? Isn't that a currency? [02:25] pound = 454g [02:25] easy :D [02:25] Ridiculous [02:25] yeah that stone thing caught me off guard when i was watching some cage fights... 13 stones i was like stones of what [02:25] i was expecting kilos [02:26] i'm sure ideas1 will agree that the pound is a very good measure for weight :) [02:26] no its stupid [02:26] google calculator to the rescue :D [02:26] kilos [02:26] What's wrong with kilos? [02:26] for science, sure [02:26] i like kilos [02:26] just doesn't fit for us here [02:26] Why not? [02:26] tradition i guess [02:26] its easy vs 16oz in 1 pound etc [02:26] Wtf is oz? [02:26] Isn't that a TV show? [02:26] see waht i mean [02:26] i would have nfi how heavy the average person is in kg, but i know in stone [02:26] oz = ounce [02:27] :D [02:27] My girlfriend got OZ tattoed on her chest [02:27] tattooed* [02:27] 1 ounces = 28.3495231 grams [02:27] i guess one thing about the UK is that we... like to be different :) [02:27] lol [02:27] bob^^: Also who cares how heavy the average person is? :P [02:27] :D [02:27] I'm 55kg \o [02:27] * bob^^ shrugs [02:27] 14 stone [02:27] :D [02:28] It could be more like 20 stone though [02:28] Depending on how much the stones weigh [02:28] lol [02:28] im 13.2142857 stone [02:28] i had to convert it in google lol [02:28] Are we talking gravel or mountains? [02:28] :D [02:28] :) [02:29] ideas1: YOu're around my weight then, if we use the same stones [02:29] \ [02:29] \o [02:29] 185lbs [02:29] lbs? [02:29] 83kg [02:30] Oh nevermind then [02:30] bob^^ confused me :P [02:30] I thought he weighed my 55kg in stones [02:30] :( [02:31] Another thing that bothers me is measuring stuff in feet [02:31] I mean, feet are of different sizes [02:31] yeah feet is a nightmare....12inchs in a foot [02:31] lol [02:31] Also inch bothers me [02:31] 3 feet in a yeard [02:31] yard [02:31] etc etc etc [02:31] nightmare [02:31] imperial measurements are easy [02:31] :D [02:31] They're retarded [02:31] yes [02:32] When people give me those measurement I automatically say "yes" [02:32] why do freebsd guys get all mad at the linux guys? [02:32] we do? :( [02:32] Because the Linux guys thinks they know stuff while the FreeBSD guys actually knows stuff :p [02:32] that's probably true [02:32] HAHAHAHA [02:33] im feelings are hurt [02:33] you get a lot of people these days who think they're UNIX GODS because they've installed ubuntu [02:33] i hate ubuntu [02:33] I actually like Ubuntu [02:33] ubuntu is pretty good i think [02:33] Didn't like it a couple of versions ago. Now it's pretty good [02:33] for desktops, ideal [02:33] for servers, use freebsd :) [02:34] I'm gonna try PC-BSD someday [02:34] Never tried it [02:34] Parallels to the rescue! [02:34] i use linux all day at work, but i do want to try freebsd for a webhosting [02:34] freebsd jails <3 [02:34] is jails like suphp? [02:35] uhm, no [02:35] https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/FreeBSD_jail [02:35] jails are brilliant [02:35] :O what the FUCK!!!! [02:36] THAT IS GENIUS [02:36] freebsd has had that for at least 10 years [02:36] it's why us freebsd guys are so smug :) [02:36] 10 years <3 [02:36] so i could create a sandbox for each user? [02:36] Yeah [02:37] basically, yup [02:37] or each service you run [02:37] or whatever you want, really :D [02:38] I think I should go buy some cigarettes [02:38] son of a bitch [02:38] Huh? :( [02:39] expression not calling anyone names [02:39] thats a pretty impressive feature [02:40] Yes it is [02:40] I have fapped numerous times to that feature [02:40] In fact my ex dumped me because I had an affair with jails [02:40] haha [02:41] thats love an passion right there [02:41] Yeah [02:41] But I found a new girlfriend who likes me for who I am and says it's okay that I sometimes get passionate with jails [02:42] lol i dont blame you [02:42] Also she said that it's okay, and in fact pushes me, to be passionate with my male friends. That is kind of awkward when I think about it [02:42] lol [02:43] its only gay if you make eye contact [02:43] That's what she says [02:43] But she's bi so she'll never understand [02:43] it's only gay if you push back [02:43] whats the best freebsd version to start with, i want to do some test [02:43] ideas1: The latest? [02:43] 8 [02:44] * up_the_irons thinks he should start making CentOS base templates [02:44] well, it's 8.1-RELEASE atm [02:44] i have my rhce test coming up maybe this will help lol [02:44] grab that, then update it using freebsd-update [02:45] ideas1: you can run cent, but you have to do the install yourself: http://support.arpnetworks.com/kb/vps/re-install-or-change-os [02:45] sounds good, i do want to try bsd but ill be honest ill be a bit scared lol [02:46] ports <3 [02:46] i ventured into solaris one time and came back running [02:47] so ssh and iptables that all the same stuff? [02:47] init scripts same basic idea? [02:47] no iptables [02:48] :S whats the freebsd firewall [02:48] ipfw or pf [02:48] googling [02:48] If you come from openbsd pf is sweet. Otherwise I've gotten the feeling ipfw is recommended. But that's just a feeling and not an expert opinion :P [02:49] IPFW seems easy [02:49] but your right lots of pf vs ipfw discussion [02:50] kinda reminds me of ufw in ubuntu [02:50] Well, I never touch iptables [02:50] It's crap that shouldn't have been created in the first place [02:50] You know a firewall is crap when you need special tools to manage it [02:53] ipfw is good - but pf is what you should use now [02:53] if you get a box up ideas1 , do 'man hier' when you first log in [02:54] it explains the system hierarchy very well - where you can find scripts, where things are installed etc [02:54] http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=hier&apropos=0&sektion=0&manpath=FreeBSD+8.1-RELEASE&format=html [02:54] whats the default shell [02:54] sh [02:55] bash? [02:55] no [02:55] sh [02:55] like the OG shell [02:55] though during install you can adjust that - csh comes with it [02:55] Rookies... Aren't they cute? :D [02:55] (it's csh but a bit more like tcsh really) [02:55] you can install bash if you want to [02:55] I prefer zsh [02:55] well i have a bunch of backup shell scripts [02:55] the advice is to leave sh (or csh) as the root shell though [02:56] that id hate to lose lol [02:56] as any installed shell won't be mountable if something goes wrong with the filesystem [02:56] i use csh but i can still run bash scripts :) [02:56] cron and all that also works? [02:57] yes :) [02:57] cron isn't a part of bash though [02:57] yeah i know [02:57] bob^^: Isn't csh pretty... lightweight? [02:57] I remember I smash my keyboard everytime I'm forced to use it [02:57] does everything i want with a bit of tweaking in .cshrc [02:57] i find bash frustrating [02:58] How do you enable tab completion and stuff in it? [02:58] uh, it just does it [02:58] It does? [02:58] yup [02:58] So what is it that I always smash my keyboard for? [02:58] :P [02:58] not a clue [02:58] http://www.amazon.com/Absolute-FreeBSD-Complete-Guide-2nd/dp/1593271514/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1295003013&sr=8-1 [02:58] http://www.amazon.com/Building-Server-FreeBSD-Bryan-Hong/dp/159327145X/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1295003066&sr=8-3 [02:58] it does tab complete, command repetition, history etc [02:58] everything you need really [02:59] I might try it out then [02:59] :D [02:59] if it's in linux, it's probably also in freebsd - freebsd is a lot more closely related to a 'proper' unix [02:59] Will have to port my .zshrc though [03:00] the differences you find are likely to be that linux is a SysV style system (semaphores, runlevels etc) and BSD doesn't have that [03:00] but then [03:00] these days linux tends to hide that stuff anyways so *shrug* [03:00] oh, ideas1... another feature you might like [03:00] if you want to run software that *only* works on linux [03:00] then freebsd can emulate linux and run linux binaries [03:01] (sometimes faster than they actually run on a proper linux box, too) [03:01] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreeBSD#Linux_compatibility [03:01] nice [03:01] i only really use linux for server [03:01] for example i have a few www.kerio.com servers [03:01] however 99% of stuff you probably run on linux can be built on freebsd (or exists as a package) that won't need emulation :) [03:01] kerio connect runing on RHEL 5 (with subscription servers) [03:02] this is worth a read too: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreeBSD_Ports [03:02] ports are one of the biggest 'cool features' of freebsd [03:02] bob^^: So what's the difference between cshrc and tcshrc? [03:02] Just curious :) [03:03] one's for csh and the other for tcsh? :) [03:03] iirc tcsh also reads .cshrc when you log in [03:03] i tend to just use the standard csh that comes with freebsd, and my own .cshrc [03:03] Aw man [03:03] Ofcourse I mean csh an tcsh [03:04] Silly me :p [03:04] the difference between free and open? is the paranoid level? [03:04] freebsd's licence is very different to that of a linux distro [03:04] ideas1: Free = Do whatever you want with it, open = view the source [03:04] Kind of [03:04] with a BSD licence you can take the code, adjust it, even sell it commercially as part of another product without returning anything to the project [03:05] with GPL, you can't commercially sell it without providing source, etc, and changes have to be commited back to the original project etc etc [03:05] this is why parts of FreeBSD can be found inside Windows and Mac [03:05] *Mac OSX [03:06] not sure how true it is these days, but back in Win2000 the IP stack was lifted straight from FreeBSD then modified slightly [03:06]