wiki theme is nicer
cedwards: do you mind if I copy some of the stuff you wrote on arpwiki.com and put it on the official wiki? (the new http://wiki.arpnetworks.com)
specifically, I was eyeballing the Arch Linux stuff
quiet in here, almost TOO quiet...
57 people in here and it is 1:45 AM PST.  pretty good...  #growing
58
though most of them are asleep... the joys of irc
i'm awake :)
but then again, it's 10:15am here :)
there is that too... if you really want lots of people here in the early hours PST start offering VPS in europe
that would be great
something UK based ;)
oh man, to manage a presence that far away...
it's hard to imagine at the moment
still need to fill up LA
;)
I'd probably start with east coast US first...  I may get deal on space from CoreSite since I already buy a lot of space from them
i should say, "a lot"
i'm sure Activision (a cage neighbor) thinks it's small
it'd be eeeassyyy
send me some hardware and i'll do the rest for you :)
yeah... bob^^ would do it all for you... for free
well i can certainly provide the space, power and addressing... :)
sadly not for free, though :(
heh... at least you've got some power - that's trouble enough in london
yeah, it is a bit of a nightmare these days
i believe we've got a whole cab sitting idle in telehouse north atm
because they want crazy money for power
most of our stuff is in Manchester
:D
i have the addresses, but interestingly...  do i need to get RIPE addresses if I have a box in Europe?  or can I use my ARIN blocks?  I haven't had a reason to figure that one out yet..
you'd need something from RIPE
they are *seriously* difficult to work with
ugh
however as a 'new' player over here you'd probably get on fine
it's when you're requesting more addresses that they go all strict and make you justify everything you already have
...with graphs showing DHCP allocations, etc etc etc
it's ridiculous
haha, interesting.  it's the opposite with ARIN
first block is the hardest, then they are easy
yeah, i've heard that... you guys are lucky :)
i'm hoping to send another request in at the end of the year...  see what i can justify
we asked for an ipv6 allocation *just* for testing
they said no
and then the *next* time i'd qualify for another request, we'll be all out of Ipv4 anyway ;)
clearly they're worried they're going to run out ;/
hahhaha
i'll give you a /48 for testing...
;)
;D
 /48's are totally routable
although perhaps your upstreams would give you shit.. "where did THIS come from?!"
lol, probably
our main transit supplier doesn't seem all that bothered about implementing ipv6
that's just sad
they'll already be too late
in my experience, their attitude is pretty standard over here
but then when RIPE refuse you a testing allocation, it's not really a surprise
silly thing is if you hadn't mentioned it was for testing they'd probably have give you a /32
yeah
indeed
if you do ever decide you'd like some kit over here though just shout
am happy to help sort things out/be remote hands
bob^^: yeah sure thing, i'll definitely prefer working with someone i know than a random data center
indeed :)
as long as you avoid putting kit in london prices are pretty reasonable too
the biggest sting is likely to be transit costs, i think i've said before how much some providers expect you to pay
yeah
well, it'll just be cost of doing business; bandwidth prices will have to be higher for EU VPS's then
yup, indeed
to ZFS zealots, this needs some love: http://wiki.arpnetworks.com/wiki/ZFSonFreeBSD
heh, i'm not brave enough yet to try it ;)
:)
well, it's been a long day, time to get off this thing; perhaps when i wake up tomorrow i'll see a wiki article or two... </hint>
:)
Blargh
Good mornin
up_the_irons: take what you need from the wiki. that's what it is (was) there for.
was?
nesta: I had created a community wiki, which I see has now been replaced with a proper one.
ah okay
up_the_irons: can I get the FreeBSD 8.1 disc in my virtual drive really quick, I broke something trying to update to 8.1 and need the 8.1 cd to fix it
I just put in a ticket, but was wondering if you could just switch it quick if it doesn't take long due to the fact that all my stuff is currently down and people are not happy with me
:D
Fail
ppl are always unhappy
fuckem
:P
lol
for reference, do not use freebsd-update to go from 8.0 to 8.1 when booting from zfs
true story
anyone else try that?
ah well, just goes to show 'google everything first' is not a habit I should have broken
hehe
especially with ZFS!!!!?!?!?
ps. freebsd-update also sux
:P
but ZFS is so nice and shiny! how could ever fail me?
young grasshopper you have much to learn
always
same
:P
I don't use ZFS myself
have thought about giving it a go
I have been very happy with it other than the high memory requirements, but then I guess that pays off in the caching it does
well, and then this problem now, lol
mh hmmm
hehe
it is still a bit too 'beta' for me
snapshots are nice though, especially when combinied with jails
I dunno what that really means >_<
hehe
I use ezjail and default filesystem
well, the snapshots zfs lets you take, which are very fast and very cheap to do, are great for backing up the state of jails and they are very quick to restore as well
speaking of that, maybe I should just restore my snapshot in the time being
until I can fix this problem
morning
hello
You guys allow IRC and provide IPv6 allocation, yes?
yes they do :)
Cool
any SLA guarantee?
i wonder about that too bro
I do hear nice stuff about ArpNetworks, but SLA is important
maybe up_the_irons can answer this question
Ahmed: Why wouldn't a VPS provider allow IRC?
Sounds lame :P
dxtr: you would be surprised ☺
No IRC No IPv9
IPv6 even, heh
Never heard of
You haven't looked
...
FreeBSD VPS, this is something I've been missing too
yeah its really radical idea
❥ FreeBSD
Either that or I live in a country where the ISPs try to not limit what the customer is doing with their product ;)
heh
hit the voicemaol
Btw, I read on Twitter that OpenBSD supports wide chars now! Just waiting until they implement it in the mainstream release
That's just plain epic
is it?
Yeah
does FreeBSD support that?
Yeah
ah okay
you use Open I take it?
nsyndaemon -K -d -i 1
Opps
Nope I dno't
don't
Because it doesn't (didn't) support wide chars ;)
To be fair I use it on my router
But I'm totally missing the wide char support
g'day
hey up_the_irons :)
lol, nice nick :)
Thanks sir :)
jlgaddis recommended you guys, I think I may just sign up :)
\o
nothing but good things to say here
had my VPS (freebsd 8) for a good few months now, no issues
That FreeBSD special is super tempting, though I may just try out one of the smaller plans for now. Decisions, decisions.
treat yourself :)
special or nothing!
haha fair enough
;P
im wondering how long it will take to setup, i tend to like instant gratification
even though, i assume if i was to order it when i was going to (last week) it would be up by now
ha
it depends how much free space there is
looks like there is actually free space at the moment, so i'd have thought you'd be up pretty quick
interesting
i had to wait for a slot, but mine was up within 48 hours
thats a long wait
IPv6Freely: just fyi I got the 15 dollar deal and it's fine for my needs. I even managed to fdisk it up with seperate partitions on a 10gb disk, / /tmp /var /usr /home
took some work hehe
is it not a standard partition scheme by default?
Nope
its all on / by default
you can do what you like after you get it though
o0
anyone want to try and help me with a zfs on root/boot problem that is likely my own fault?
you made /boot zfs?
j3m: try to catch RandalSchwartz if you see him
I did that when I first installed 8.0 from scratch I believe
nesta: thanks, I'll watch for him
nesta: huh... okay. So how would you do that? Do they have some sort of remote console you can use while reinstalling the OS?
yes, VNC over ssh tunnel
yes IPv6Freely ... it rocks
vnc application
hmm rad.
and you can boot from cd via it
it is v sexy
it is seriously cool actually :)
I tried to upgrade from 8.0 to 8.1 using freebsd-update
hehe yes
and useful when you break things :D
I _still_ have no gotten over it tbh
lol
not*
it's liek woah
I think its the vm stuff that arp uses it too.. its great
vnc to console?
yeah
i thought that was common withing vps providers
within*
Just signed up :)
most vps providers implementations seems to be broke as hell
from what I have seen and heard
ive only ever used another popular bsd vps provider that will remain nameless here
mainly because their cs sucks butt
something went wrong with that update, I have since read that others have had problems: http://forums.freebsd.org/showthread.php?t=15131
got to read UPDATING brah
I always have in the past, my brain didn't get out of bed this morning it seems
:-/
monday for ya :P
now I am in trouble and if someone familiar with zfs booting on freebsd could help I would be supremely in their dept
dept*
see, brain, can't think today
debt*
damn, wish i could help you man, but i dont have the experience with zfs to be any kind of help
hey don't you know the rule
Never update on Monday.
lol
good rule
or friday
I just made it up and tbh, it is a good one :)
although...
friday!
I updated earlier
lol
never do ANYTHING on a friday
is the rule we use ;)
^
yeh bob^^
hehehe
so tru, so damn tru
j3m: wish I had some idea buddy, hopefully RandalSchwartz will arrive with magical help soon
*paging* RandalSchwartz *paging* RandalSchwartz
lol
lol
he is very friendly he won't mind being paged I'm sure
>_<
does anyone know what happens if you run '
nothing?
or is that a trick question
'gpart bootcode -b /mnt2/boot/pmbr -p /mnt2/boot/gptzfsboot -i 1 ad0' on a mbr by accident as well, because, there is a slight chance I may have done that
sorry, erroneous enter
instead of rolling back my zfs to the working state, I tried to go forward with the update and ran that command, but there is a chance I didn't even use gpt on this box
which i realized after
but, maybe that is not the case, I need to find out now though, because booting gives 'Invalid partition table' now...
hm
however, zfs still intact and can read with zfs import from fixit shell
tried the "fixit" in sysinstall?
all data appears to be intact and I have rolled back the zfs to the pre-update snapshot I took
but ever since I ran the gpart command I am getting Invalid partition table
even after the rollback
I'm sorry to hijack the channel for this problem, I've never dug myself into hole quite like this though...
not sure if this would help, but check this out: http://romain.blogreen.org/Blog/2010/02/ZFS%3A_unsupported_ZFS_version_14_(should_be_13)
that shouldn't be a problem for me, I am pretty sure the pool is still version 13
from freebsd 8.0
or it wouldn't work from the fixit shell (I think)
yeah, just checked, is version 13
thanks though
I think my problem is now that I messed up my partitions with that command, it is likely that I was running an MBR based system and that command wrote GPT stuff to my disk and confused things...
hm, i wonder
if I am right, I need to find a way to recreate a working partition table without affecting the data on my ZFS partition
and dumb me can't find a record of the disklabel values
theres got to be some fbsd pros here
at the very least typing this stuff in is theraputic and helping me problem solve, lol
hope I am not bugging people here
not me dude
j3m: when people stop replying and its gets all uncomfortably silent.. thats usually when I stop
:)
lol
lol
that usually means no one knows
thanks :)
rofl
well, if anyone spots a freebsd expert and/or RandalSchwartz give me a shout
have you poked your head into #freebsd?
##freebsd
;)
see, that seems like great advice, and the kind you forget about when in the midst of the problem
also #freebsdhelp
j3m: us noobs gotta keep track of this stuff ok!?
hehe
thanks :)
the countdown to vps setup is on :)
:D
up_the_irons, around?
up_the_irons: I think I need the full 8.1 disc, the boot only disc you installed for me does not load into the fixit shell.
If it is going to take awhile just put be back on 8.0 for now until 8.1 is downloaded.
j3m: 8.0 is back.  i'm downloading 8.1 full dvd.  eta 30 mins
24 now
okay, thanks
np
up_the_irons, got a minute?
Ahmed: for?
sales talk.
trying to call the company # but no luck, always hitting voicemail.
https://s-hphotos-ash1.fbcdn.net/hs321.ash1/28193_1469077971411_1367449706_1286262_463159_n.jpg <- Nice picture of me and my girlfriend I just found
lol nice
:D
we can help with that
:o
up_the_irons: is there a way to snapshot my entire virtual disk, even if just until I find a way to fix my problem?
I have to fix my partitions, but my ZFS volume is intact
I don't want to break it any worse while trying to fix it...
If that makes any sense...
why not jsut not use ZFS ?
>_<
I have seen so many people in pain from it
hehe
and here he disappeares again
How am I going to get answeres ¬¬ heh
nesta: My ZFS isn't the broken part, I somehow messed up the boot/partitions part, outside the scope of ZFS itself
if you say so :)
*shrug*
lol
j3m: i made the snap, but still be careful; i can't easily rollback an LVS snapshot; it has to be copied and re-dd'ed (if that makes sense ;)  and at 60G it'll take a while
thanks a million up_the_irons, I'll be careful still, but I feel a lot better knowing I won't make it a whole world of worse trying to fix it
up_the_irons: Can you order me a pizza? I messed something up
:)
j3m: no problem
up_the_irons: I need a massage plz
dxtr: i'd like a pizza myself
up_the_irons: Awesome! Then get me one and you can watch me eat it
someone needs to add Humor to the wiki and put in some irc snapshots.  there was that dude a while ago that woke up to find 2 chicks in his bed, but the convo was too long....
I was thinking of doing one on how to run identd deamon as user and not root
might do
sweet
j3m: do a full shutdown then 'Boot' from Portal / SSH console, then you should see 8.1
okay, thanks, trying now
I can add a wiki entry on how to destroy a hundred thousand worth of stuff with a forklift truck, up_the_irons
It was hard - but I did it once
j3m: do you see 8.1 now?
dxtr: we'll put that under Humor
up_the_irons: yep, thanks again
i need to head out, be back in about an hour
j3m: great
ls
lol
switched windows wrong there...
better than typing your root password into irc ;x
hehe
someone did that recently
and it was the pass for their facebook, server
everything
lmao
bad news :S
lol
ive done that before, but a work, into our corporate irc server
at least it was just our prod root password
hehe
luckily even if I did accidentally put it on IRC no one would be able to use it really
the SA pro tip to me was to start your passwords with '/'
I don't use passwords haha
not for users anyway
keys?
yeah
love dem keyz
would it be a problem if I wanted a non-mainstream linux distro installed?
I'm currently reading: http://support.arpnetworks.com/faqs/vps/what-is-supported
I guess I would just ask support for help on that
mattx86: yes you can do that most likely. any iso you can get as far as I know.. your mileage may vary
I am quite sure any linux is supported
don't want to speak for an admin though ;)
Garry will be back in a half or so I think
cool, ok
actually, I gotta go for a few hours, but I'll stay logged in
bbl
mattx86: i generally don't do Red Hat based (e.g. CentOS, RHEL, etc...) linux distros because they leave everything and the sun open by default and get hacked
sup up_the_irons
i think we've spoken on twitter in the past
IPv6Freely: i was gonna ask if you were a former customer or beta tester, cuz your nick sounds familiar
so yeah, twitter :)
indeed. Though im now a customer, I just signed up a couple hours ago
IPv6Freely: yeah i saw that, welcome :)
thanks!
you do the initial setups dont you?
yup
Any chance you could give me the default FreeBSD partition scheme, rather than having everthing in / ?
nope
;)
http://support.arpnetworks.com/faqs/vps/custom-partitions
but you can do it yourself
okay. only asked because it hadnt been setup yet ;)
up_the_irons just clones an install... he's not actually going through the steps.
so it's more work to do a custom install, work that you can do anyway
oh right, duh
self slap: 5
monkey beShocked
IPv6Freely: yeah, what RandalSchwartz said :)
:)
no worries
I've installed ZFS GPT Root on ARPnetworks so many times, I could probably do it in my sleep now :)
i dont have any idea what that is :)
ZFS for Root?
yarr
it's all the rage!  It's what all the cool kids use!
oh oh oh can i be cool too then?
in that case, you *do* want one fat partition
and you can easily add subpartitions and put quotas on them
it's far better than hard partitions
hehe
follow this - insightcruisesconcierge@gmail.com
oops not that.
damn copybuffer
=]
... http://wiki.freebsd.org/RootOnZFS/GPTZFSBoot/
better
those instructions followed literally work great
don't deviate
except on this line: echo 'ifconfig_re0="DHCP"' >> /etc/rc.conf
first, it's em0, not re0
second, you need to use the fix IP info given to you
since your box does not get a DHCP
I have "defaultrouter=NNN.NNN.NNN.NNN"
and "ipv4_addrs_em0=NNN.NNN.NNN.LOW-HIGH/28"
that does it for me
adjust /28 as you need
it's either 28 or 29 or 30
does that help?
indeed
so... F12 during boot, boot the cd, choose fixit, and you should be at a prompt
then follow those instructions
then reboot, and you should be live on your new machine
might as well try it... if i break it i can just do it again
it takes about 15-20 minutes if you type fast
the bad news is that you can't copy-paste from that text
you have to literally type it. :(
why cant ya?
the page contains some utf-8 characters for the computer-printout stuff
it pastes wrong
and at especially bad places
hmm
probably can just paste into notepad or whatever and make sure its all correct and then give er
you could first test-paste, I presume
yeah
uh... notepad!?
hahah
TextEdit then. sheesh
emacs rox
any eta on new setups?
"new setups"?
in general, they get processed in 24-48 hours
at least from what I've seen here recently
disclaimer - I'm just a customer
not sure what else a "new setup" would imply :)
RandalSchwartz: Do you know how to get info about the start and length of an intact ZFS volume when the partition table is broke?
`nh: i actually thought you meant new beta servers
no - I'd just be staring at the output of geom
not sure how you got beta servers from new setups
and if that's broke, nope
RandalSchwartz: thanks, that is all I've been able to do
I thought by "setup" you meant "server". Who cares
there might be a backup partition somewhere
Now I'm going to have to zfs send to another disk with a working partition table
if somehow i am not speaking correct english, or code words, i care :)
gpt right?
`nh: relax.
or something with gpart?
?
i think youre the edgy one here.
yeah, somehow I lost the partition table it seems, I think it was a command I entered when trying to fix a failed freebsd-update to 8.1
eww
but it still mounts?
I should have just rolled back my snapshot to 8.0....
yes
`nh: No. You're the one that got all upset because we misunderstood your vague question.
weird
the data is fine
I don't have time for this, I'm not a babysitter. bbl.
IPv6Freely: not remembering anyone asking you anything...
zfs mounts it under fixit just fine
I apologize, I must have missed where to specified one particular channel member with your initial query.
you*
not sure why "just some guy" would answer a question directed at staff, but ok :)
there's probably info in the cache file then
I didn't see a question directed at staff, it appeared to be a general question to the entire channel. I don't know why you're making such a big deal out of this. Settle down.
nerd rage ^
same^
agreed^
lol
must be sensitive, i dont see anywhere that I raged. but sure kids :)
Must be one of those "has to have the last word" people.
IPv6Freely: is that not you mr. bbl...
I rest my case.
just dont be hypocritical
And he's STILL going!
RandalSchwartz: what was your reason for switchign to ZFS
quit raging bro
no one was even talking to you to begin with :)
Why are you still going?
because im at work and have some free time, you?
I'm a member of this channel, and you asked the channel a question. I answered. Relax.
I don't know why this is such a big deal.
Calm down, have a beer.
quit talking :)
stop the creepy smiles
:/
stop lurking?
it's what I do
a horse walks into a bar.  bartender asks, "why the long face?"
then lurk more and shush :)
I chat when I like
hehe RandalSchwartz .. old
So whats new, nesta ?
:P
playing with ACL stuff, IPv6Freely
Right on, on which platform?
FreeBSD
Ah.
FreeBSD rox my sox
Word.
must be ex ubuntu user
NESTA
HI SBP
did u switch back to freebsd?
:D
yuh, I never left actually
haha
changed mny mind
last minute
hehe nice
is your box up?
that's a pretty personal question :)
yeah, no user accounts though. rm'ed all
lol RandalSchwartz
ah ok
we are irish brothers, we have shells on each others servers
I let go of all my shells hehe
ah you dont use them anymore?
no sir
michael fitzpatrick, and patrick fitzmichael? :)
yes, but there is one big difference between us
nesta rides a pink bike
seriously
o/~ put your shell... on my serr---r-rrrver o/~
lolz
it's true
now it all makes sense :)
pipe down player hater
go hate elsewhere with your passive aggressive smily faces
play with my acl?
...   :)
etc
*yawn*
troll is obvious troll
IGNORED
if waiting for vps setup is troll, then yes i am
....
dunno man, im in the channel waiting for my vps and i get verbally attacked by thugs on pink bikes
and "players"
dont pay any mind to him, he just gets mad when i bring it up
:(
must of brought it up earlier, hes been in a stinky mood all day
im not sure whats more retarded, ignoring someone on irc, or just pretending you did...
sbp do you know when Estella is flying out?
yes
I forgot
tommarow
I think she gone already
ah ok
I hope she gets it
yah i do also
she will be the best support @ awknet imho
yuh
she allready had a netbook shiped to the d/c
haha nice
i think afraid she will break it on that whole hour long flight
redy for actuon!
i mean her good one
action
awknet?
yah
competitors to sednet? :)
lol
how about grepnet?
a good friend got a 2 week trial there as an employee
what is sednet and grepnet?
come on sbp_
well - what is awknet?
snap snap!
oh i gotcha
sed grep awk
:D
lol
YAY
i thought maybe there was some awesome dd0s protected place i never heard of for a sec
was excited
:D
hehe
grepnet sounds like grape nuts :)
so is awk in awknet like awk?
or some other meaning?
i really dont know, its been around for a pretty good while tho
... http://www.awknet.com/ ?
yah
they are known for there ddos protection mainly
how is "IRC" a "high risk service"?
depends on your network :)
I'm trying to figure out what these guys are actually doing
it smells a bit
like doing something marginal
they are a service provider, RandalSchwartz
yeah - spam hosters are "service providers" too
cool
A lot of hosting providers see IRC as a high risk service because IRC servers get DOS'd a lot.
I'm just trying to figure out if awknet is a good guy, bad guy, or claiming-to-be-neutral guy but allowing bad-guy customers
er, DoS'd.
Also, they can sometimes play host to botnets.
RandalSchwartz: claiming neutral imho
they have quite a history
from gigenet on up to present
so this company openly permits botnets?
and foonet
and you guys work with them or for them?
uh. no
wrong all over
well - then, first, what's the reference to awknet
... <sbp_> she will be the best support @ awknet imho
we know someone who has a job interview coming up there
so you associate with people who provide services to bad guys?
my friend provides services to bad guys?
new to me, RandalSchwartz
but you seem to know a lot
so, fill me in a bit more please
lol
... <nesta> RandalSchwartz: claiming neutral imho
yep
if you were choosing my third option
thats the compant
y
nothing to do with her as a person
that means they service bad guys
if she is interviewing there, it does
she needs a job, is broke... AND that was my _opinion_
I am quite certain she would not agree
that they are bad
nope
those are your words
then why would someone need those specific services?
no one elses
what *legit* reasons are there for that kind of provision?
you invented stuff and pinned it on them
I just google'd awknet.  They are in 530 W. 6th St.  'nuff said
and are asking people to explin it
lol
If you've ever seen that place, you'll know what I mean
up_the_irons - known spam hosting?
or just cut-rate creepy?
i dont know much about them, besides they have heavy ddos protection
yes - why would someone need ddos to protect IRC?
RandalSchwartz: 530 W. 6th St., now "Telecom Center", but was the Douglas Oil Building, is the crappiest building in LA for an ISP.  shit is held together by duct tape.  people who align themselves with that kind of work are usually up to no good
sounds like botnets to me
because people on efnet ddos randon people for fun
dang up_the_irons
some people even
sucks for my friend :(
that still doesn't explain why awknet would deliberately promote robust "IRC" networks
hopefully she will hate it and get a better spot
most IRC is just casual chat
soemwhere else
hardly mission critical
unless you're a botnet operator
"Blocks all DDoS", hrm
youve never suffered from a huge ddos attack have you
randal
awknet can take more then staminus
I generally don't do things that trigger that.
again - wondering who these customers might be
different worlds.. thats all
:D
yep
that need strong DDoS protection for their (again jawdrop) *IRC* networks
smells to high heaven of spam botnets
what *other* realm needs it
heh
give me ONE example, and I'll shut up
go msg haddem on efnet
from an ipv4
and you will find out
:)
or ipv6
why you may need ddos protection
some people like to pick fights on IRC, RandalSchwartz... as lame as it be it happens .. and these guys host lots of them
hes from brazil, wont understand you, unless you know protuguese, and will down you like no other
they are not necessarily involved in spam, most are not smart enough
they have botnets but they are IRC channel bots
so other than turf kiddies, what's the legit business motivation?
and they like to have tons of them
and fight for channels
and dumb stuff like that
now that's an example for you
alot of game clans need it also, or big web sites
No - that's not a business
they made one out of it
they keep saying "IRC"
whether you believe it or not
i mean google.com probablly takes hits all day long
why does IRC need that kind of protection
becasuse people DDOS each other
is that not obvious?
you still haven't said how IRC is mission critical enough to buy special resources
its not
but if you dont want your shit nulled or down
you need some sort of ddos protection
becasue people don't want their channel bots dropped
up_the_irons: I have a new plan, check the ticket when you get a chance.
or their servers dropped
etc
I keep hearing the same thing.  it's about kiddies, or about things you don't want to talk about
lol
to me, that's still spam botnets
you are from the services realm
arent oyu
you asked for an example and you got one
that's the only IRC that makes money
nickserv chnaserv etc
is there some *other* IRC that makes money?
these people that pay awknet for hosting get their money from parents a lot of the time, RandalSchwartz
they are not smart enough to have spam bots... not to say thata awknet does not also host that
but if you are asking me or sbp_ we are telling you our experience
you mean parents put up money so kids can play turf wars?
yes
what silliness have we gotten to?
I am dead serious
thats why nesta has that pink bike
he has awknet server
I am talaking tons of servers, shells, bots, etc ... all legal
cant get car
I do not have any business with them
don't associate me please
lol
i know
:D
i make it up
anyway, as a bona fide certified spam fighter white hat, the mere existence of places like these makes me a bit sick.
except for my MASSIVE SPAM NET
but I've said my piece.  and thanks up_the_irons for that additional intel.
sorry for us making you aware of reality
:-/
well - I'm just trying to sort out if you're friends-of-friends-of-spammers or not
looking for the white or black het
hat even
het doesn't make sense :)
right
is there any forum where explain how to setup ipv6 on our vps
it's in the FAQ I do believe
and it depends on what you've been told
the default route may differ, for example
for example, I have ipv6_defaultrouter=fe80::5054:ff:fe27:9007%em0
but I'm told that was simplified after I did that
... http://support.arpnetworks.com/faqs/main/how-to-configure-ipv6-on-freebsd
but I think that's beeen superceded
the routing on the "upstream link" no longer consumes ::1 and ::2
up_the_irons?
mine was partially setup on ordering i believe
I think he sets it up now so that both ends use fe80::1 and fe80::2
which doesn't consume any part of your /48 (or /64)
ipv6_enable="YES"
ipv6_defaultrouter="2607:f2f8:a100::1"
ipv6_ifconfig_em0="2607:f2f8:a100::2 prefixlen 64"
ipv6_ifconfig_em0_alias0="2607:f2f8:a100::3 prefixlen 64"
is in my rc.conf if that helps you
Yeah - that looks oldschool
he experimented with me recently to get it more finely tuned
I use debian so abit differant then fbsd the setup i think
sbp_'s rc.conf is correct
if you use link-local addresses (fe80::) you can keep from eating up part of your /48 just for the link
Oh really?  you went back to the XXX::1 and XXX::2 ?
RandalSchwartz: i use link-local only when requested by customer; link-local requires a bit of knowledge most people aren't used to yet
it's just mine that's weird? :)
Yeah 1 and 2 are easier to describe
RandalSchwartz: keep the defaults easy and reserve the more advanced setup for those who want it
or are crazy enough to request it :)
i personally just want to be able to ping6 out and irc from it
some people want to play around with IPv6 routing, so they request it.  mainly for VPN stuff
otherwise could care less about v6
at this point
heh from my side, first time I play with ipv6 so abit lost
ipv6 rocks
I have it on my laptop all the time via miredo
and I have a v6 tunnel at home from tunnelbroker.net
(free service)
so all my machines at home have a globally routed address
i have a vpn setup so i can ping6 at home, otherwisse my router wont even pass protocol
I would be in the sbp boat hehe, I just use it for silly hostname
i like ipv6 in how i can auto-allocate blocks to customers.  i don't need to analyze the "remaining" subnets and decide where "this" should fit
yeah.  everyone gets a /48
heck, I have *3* /48's :)
5 counting insightcruises
up_the_irons, do you have any Debian how to for ipv6 setup?
I can enumerate 3 * 1152921504606846976 machines :)
interesting site RandalSchwartz
as in, I can nearly assign an IP address to each grain of sand that fills the earth. :)
rVn_-: just put this in your /etc/network/interfaces:
iface eth1 inet6 static
        address $IPV6_PREFIX::$IPV6_IP
        gateway $IPV6_PREFIX::1
        netmask 64
$IPV6_PREFIX -- use your prefix
$IPV6_IP -- any IP you want (I use 2)
replace eth1 with your interface
I use 0. :)
host -t aaaa red.stonehenge.com
RandalSchwartz is too cool to school
8for
*for
nothing special about 0.  I like that.
does /whois RandalSchwartz show my v6 connection here?
or is it masked?
... -wolfe.freenode.net- RandalSchwartz is connecting from *@red.stonehenge.com    2607:f2f8:3080::
RandalSchwartz: masked
well - that's what it shows me
connecting from red on v6
doesn't show that for me
whats so special about that
u can do what you want inbetween and after the ::
unless im missing it
just saying my host is .... ::0
not ... ::2 as up_the_irons said
which means I don't need to say xxxx:xxxx:xxxx::2
ah yah u can do that anywhere even tunnelbroker
just xxxx:xxxx:xxx::
I have two tunnels from tunnelbroker
one for home
the other for my laptop
so my laptop has a /48 :)
:P
I'm just *waiting* for the day they open a voting website that blocks duplicate IPs but also permits V6. :)
"here... allow me to submit my 1152921504606846976 votes"
i just wish my home router would pass protocol without a custom firmware
sup smokey!!!!
sup
up_the_irons: I updated and reopened my ticket, I have a new plan, could you take a look when you get a chance, I still need to solve this problem asap..
The more I use SLES the more I love it. Too bad it's not free :(  Otherwise I'd use it on my vps
SLES?
ahh - first hit makes sense
http://i.imgur.com/tffa8.jpg
j3m: replied
up_the_irons: thanks for the quick response again, sounds good :)
j3m: :)
anyone feel like a chuckle?
http://i.imgur.com/umcFD.gif
LOL
i feel like one
paste your youtube vid
:P
no way!
peep that gif, sbp_ ^
hehe
looks like a lab/pit mix or something
anyone know the answer to this: Postfix docs say "When a restriction list (example: client) evaluates to REJECT or DEFER the other restriction lists (example: helo, sender, etc.) are skipped.", but what about if the evaluation was "OK" (like in a white list), or other restrictions skipped as well?
i have a whitelist in "smtpd_client_restrictions", but i wonder if it is affected by the following rbl checks in "smtpd_recipient_restrictions"
I think once you have a solid yes or no, further checks are skipped
I have a few rules that have a lot of DUNNO
but that may be for a different reason
hey sbp_ pm
i c
I could be wrong
i'll research more
I hope to get Weitse on a future FLOSS Weekly
I spent a weekend with him at a cottage back in 02
well, him and 120 otherws :)
i just did a test; it appears it *does* keep on checking further restriction lists.  all restrictions must pass it
othere ya go
but a single reject and it is toast
ok there ya go even. :)
that strategy does sound familiar
up_the_irons: btw, that's cool.  the distro I'm currently eye-balling is "Alpine Linux", which is supposed to be secure, but in any case, I'm usually quick to lock a vps down and turn off unnecessary services.  :)
ugh linux :)
if you want real secure, don't use linux
most root kits exploit windows and linux, not BSD
yep
even if bsd isn't actually more secure, the odds of penetration are far less
well, I kind of want to do FreeBSD, but I'm more used to linux in recent years
that can be fixed. :)
come on over :)
plus I'm kind of in a time crunch
or I feel like it
freebsd is pretty friendly
you'll enjoy /etc/rc.conf
all your local vars in one place
one thing that kinda bugs me is the layout of apache's config files on freebsd
how so?
btw, I asked in ##freebsd, but didn't really get an answer:
ie. is it in /usr/local ?
do most freebsd users install from ports into /usr/local ?
it has to be, it's a port
if so that's a common Linux users complaint but it's really just a small issue
yes
ports = /usr/local
that's the way it is
plsu it makes sense when you think of it
plus*
as in /usr/local is owned by ports
keeps things tidy :)
I know, but when you're used to "/etc/apache2/conf.d/..." or some such :)
and ports always use /usr/local
you can be used to many things
that are wrong :)
jsut add a /usr/local
and bob's ur uncle
not our bob^^ here but..
zactly
ya
it's just PREFIX=/usr/local
no freaking out :)
when directory paths get pretty big, I kinda go >_<
get over it
ln -s /usr/local /ul :)
haha ^
there ya go
lol
plus RandalSchwartz can make your ipv6 for ya easy on FreeBSD.. he has the magic commands
:P
heh, I did think about making simple bash scripts similar to rhel/fedora's "service" command, just I wouldn't have to type /usr/local/etc/rc.d/apache22 restart or such ;)
just make them alias
"webup"
"webdown"
"webreload"
mh /etc/profile is nice in FreeBSD too
:D
IMHO though, nothing I've found for server use just yet, is as simple and down to earth as archlinux's /etc/rc.conf and ports-like system
arch linux just wants ot be FreeBSD
I know, I have used it quite a bit
it's kernel will always be Leeeenux
:P
it's an arch rival
no makefiles, spec files, just simple, sensible variable names and it gets down to business
lol RandalSchwartz
duh dum tsh!
heh
I do have a few problems with arch though
hi mattx86, me and RandalSchwartz like FreeBSD. nice to you meet you
lol
it's not i586, so I can't install it on my soekris net5501 without some fiddling, and there's not a lot of server-ish packages available, and some are broken or don't provide all the features you'd like - without doing some more fiddling around
whereas, FreeBSD is BSD, so its awesome and documented, and there are tons of server packages available
come on over :)
so I do want to get into FreeBSD.. unless I can find something else perhaps ;)
me and RandalSchwartz have vetted all possible suitors for you already, mattx86
my freebsd excuses aren't very good, I know  ;)
we have FreeBSD to be the most suitable
found*
I am still trying to determine if I want ZFS
hehe
ZFS rocks
is it NetBSD that has pf or ipf rather?
freebsd has pf, ipfw, and something else
I prefer pf
I use pf
I think I used ipf on NetBSD, IIRC
but over the past few years, I've learned iptables on linux
that was a feat, I thought  hehe
yes.  the firewall without a conf file
seemed strage to me at the time
heh yeah
some distros actually "wrap" iptables with an rc script at boot/shutdown, to provide a sort of configuration file for it
that another thing I hate, distros that try to wrap everything up with a neat bow  heh
bow and not stern?
meh, lets just throw the anchor at it :)
hrm..would you guys mind answering a few questions about apache on freebsd?
I attempted to install www/apache22 from ports like: make WITH_MPM=itk install
make config (tick the box) is what I would do
I think it gave me an error actually, saying its already installed, but upon doing 'make deinstall' and then redoing my make command (above) gave the same error
or try anyway, duno if thats in the option s
ah, make config
let me see
I just say "portinstall apache22" :)
what does "WITH_MPM=..." give you?
er, well, its supposed to compile in the 'itk' MPM for apache, but I can't tell that it's doing it
and what does that do for you?
I don't know what "itk" is
oh, well its used to run vhosts as a specific uid/gid, instead of www/www for instance, for every vhost on the server
ahh.  evil.
:P
so, one vhost might be owned by bob:bob, and another by jane:jane
this way bob can't read jane's php configuration files and get her mysql password for instance  :)
I knew "PHP" would be mentioned in the explanation. I just knew it.
:)
Yeah. PHP ... generally evil.
I have been meaning to try RoR and/or python though
I'm a bit burnt out on web development at the moment
all equally evil :)
changes every time you turn around, for one thing
The Web is lame. Do server or mobile development.
Smalltalk Seaside
Intra-hit debugging
nothing else has it
Intra-hit debugging?
Is that the name of that feature where when the user encounters an error they get a Web UI with a debugger?
hit a page... something breaks... up comes a debugger.  poke around, fix the code, hit "proceed". browser refreshes with the hit that *would* have been had you done the right code initially
so you are debugging in the *middle* of a web hit
I don't see the real world use of that.
seriously?
Not sure if I ever even look at Web pages that I develop anymore.
how many times do you noodle on your site, only to hit a problem?
Never?
OK - you just lost cred there.
I don't actively use the Web, and I basically never use a site I've built.
Yeah, this isn't for you then
too smart for you
Too "integration test? What's that?" for me.
in spite of all tests, s**t happens
Yeah, and when it does you write a test.
seaside helps you undo that crap
Shit happens to the user, not to me.
right - figure out the test when you can't remember how you got there
as in, all you know is you have a divide by 0 RIGHT NOW
and you want it to NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN
Was I in the middle of something else? I'd probably want to make a ticket/story/whatever for that so I can get back to it later.
Seaside gives you a chance to fix that
mike-burns - again, seriouslY?
ah, www.seaside.st right?  interesting.. I'd never heard of this
you can always remember all the buttons you hit to get to a problem?
you are like... Data from star trek
not human
I never can, no, but if a 500 happens in a Rails or other CGI-based app it's usually because of the input sent in.
I'm talking to the rest of the channel, made of humans
So I make a ticket with the backtrace and the environment and go back to it later.
mike-burns in my experienece, it's rarely the single hit that made it blwo up
it's some sort of state that my server side got into
you're insane if you think that every web hit is independent
Ah, I don't see that much. Sometimes, maybe once a month or so, the DB gets into a weird state, but that's not the majority of what I see.
At this point, I'm writing you off as naive.
I think mutation and state is imporant and the #1 cause of errors, but I don't see how giving the end user a debugger helps anyone.
so for the rest of the channel, yes, Seaside rocks
no, not end user
just in dev
You actively use a Web site while developing it?
Is it like, write some code, hit reload, write some code, hit reload, over and over?
something to that effect, that's been my experience in PHP  ;)
no - but eventually, you dink around on the site to make sure everything is good
or you are demoing it to your client
and that's exactly when problems happen
and you WANT to get to the source quickly
I honestly haven't had anything crop up since we've started doing integration-level test-driven development.
yeah, that'll find 80% of it
The problems we face these days are more like scaling issues or other giant things.
I'm talking about the other 20%
Or JavaScript.
Seriously, dude.  You've never dinked around on your site and said "oh, that's not right"
ever ever ever
I'm sure I have, but I didn't need a debugger to know what to fix.
ok... hello mr. IQ of 250
I just wrote a test to repeat what I just did, then made the test pass.
This isn't something brilliant, it's just programming.
and sites that don't have a lot of serial state
Yeah it's a nice luxury.
If we had lots of serial state I'd have to use something like Seaside. It has a great debugger for that.
sir - I've been programming for 40 years.  I *do* speak from some experience.
either you aren't doing anything complicated, or you are glossing over something.
there's no third option.
I don't do anything complicated.
Yeah, therein lies the rub then
Or if I do, it's very complicated. We push back on anything in between.
Well I uh.
Was it something I said?
er :o
no, mike-burns I do not think so
er , in wrong place
lol
from what I've seen in here tonight
Anyway, Seaside is neat and something like it is a great abstraction layer for serial state.
I'm suspicious of any continuation-based Web server after working on the PLT Scheme one, though.
just sounds like an improved version of php sessions
Heh, it can sound like that.
hm.. so what all web languages do you use, mike-burns?
I do Rails all day.
what's your rails development environment like?
not textmate, I take it :)
Ha, vim. All vim, all day.
er w/e its called for osx :)
ah
I actually co-teach a Vim for Rails course.
I've been a PHP man myself, ever since about 2001.
That's a long time in one language!
I've been using Komodo IDE for it here lately
yeah, probably explains why I'm burnt out ;P
I try to change languages every three years or so.
that'd be a good idea, atleast to see whats out there
vim though, seriously?
Sure, why not?
I learned the basic usage for vi/vim, but its not as straight-forward as gnu nano or a gui editor
imo
I love vi
of course, I grew up with windows and notepad  :)
"Intuitive" just refers to what you're used to.
yeah, I suppose it does
so, how might you maneuver around in vi/vim on a regular basis?
I just go into insert mode, hit escape, type :wq and hit enter, myself  ;)
Well I mean, basically half the keyboard is dedicated to maneuvering around vim.
I am a total noob with it so I use arrow keys >_<
but I love it as an editor
I can't use nano anymore
I tend not to be in insert mode.
of course, other than insert mode being 'simple', how else do you enter text?
if I'm not mistaken
Like, I don't enter a lot of text. It's mostly navigating around the file, jumping to definitions of methods, maybe generating some code, refactoring, etc.
do you use rails' scaffolding alot?
Never.
course, what I do know of rails is just from the 10-minute blog videos and the like  heh
but how else do you generate code?
So I'll write the code to migrate the database (add a table, delete a column, etc), then have vim generate the inverse migration (delete a table, add a column, etc).
Or I'll split a view into some partials and vim fills in the right function calls in the old view.
I didn't know vim could do all of that
It's basically a giant programming language.
ah
Anyway, I gotta run.
alrighty
later man
is it possible to have my freebsd vps i386 instead of amd64 ?
oops, forgot i had a bnc here.
lol
id much rather i386.
brb
k
anyway
id rather my vps be i386 instead of amd64, is that a huge problem or no?
twiggz: i can mount the i386 version of w/e ISO you like and you can then do a re-install on your own.  i don't have any pre-made i386 images
hehe
major catastrophe
MAC just bit me in the butt I think
to much work.
was just wondering if it was a big problem to do it....for me...it is...
i should have specified in my notes that i wanted i386 freebsd
but so far, amd64 is not causing any problems....
so far, i am pleased.
:D
mac bites everyone in the ass at one time or another...
nesta: ^
yeah damn
it's got me good right now
lol
i have an old 800mhz ibook that i had to install OSX on with a fucking IPOD
I HATE IPODS
no
I mean
ACL's
Mandatory Access Controls
etc
Im talking about Macintosh.
yeah I know
hehe
I ain't :'(
I actually borrowed a friends ipod..because i wont own one of those dinky pieces of shit to intall OSX on the 800mhz ibook with like 700 and change ram ...
ran like shit compared to zenwalk or slackware or freebsd on a 500mhz compaq armada m300
lol.
twiggz: just fyi. http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/mac.html
I use a mac at home, I love OSX myself :P
i hate it.
its a fat whore thats pretty.
:/
(is that possible?)
I guess fat whores can be pretty..i dontknow.
I dont know any fat whores.
sup doodz
hehe
had this conversation with somebody earlier today... im a network engineer, so for me, i just have zero interest in spending my time making my OS work when i could be spending my time making my routers work.
so say what you want about osx, call me computer illiterate, i dont care - it just works, and thats my #1 concern.
10 years ago i would have enjoyed playing with linux or freebsd on my desktop, but at this point in my career, i just dont have time for it.
I like it because it's like a pretty version of FreeBSD, I spent years with FreeBSD and various linux on laptops and now I have a Mac and I think it's great. freeBSD on my vps ... all set :)
But at the same time, I also completely understand that there are PLENTY of people who DO like messing with their OS.
yeah I got tired of it eventually
I prefer to have a server to twiddle with
life is too consuming to be working on your damn laptop all the time