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[04:16] <up_the_irons> islandfox: using your links, I was able to track down the specific QEMU upstream commit that had the uart fix; applied it to kvm-84 package of Jaunty, did the build package dance, installed it, and...  i think this describes it best: http://twitter.com/up_the_irons/status/6494527918
[04:54] <islandfox> up_the_irons: :) nice, glad it worked
[06:09] <mhoran> What's this?
[06:10] * mhoran reads the backlog.
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[09:36] <jeev> anyone know a safe and secure free lvie chat
[09:36] <jeev> live
[09:36] <mick_laptop> define "safe and secure"
[09:36] <jeev> seriously ?
[09:36] <mick_laptop> you can use it over https
[09:37] <jeev> heh
[09:37] <jeev> somethnig not hackable
[09:37] <jeev> sure
[09:37] <mick_laptop> anything is "hackable" -- but I'd have it on it's own server and just isolate it from everything else chroot'ed apache (or using a bsd jail...)
[09:38] <jeev> got a name? :)
[09:38] <mick_laptop> there are a few open source ones which are pretty good
[09:38] <mick_laptop> i forget :)
[09:40] <jeev> mick_laptop, you think you can maybe see which one
[09:40] <jeev> ones
[09:40] <jeev> i'm getting really nervous here
[09:40] <jeev> i've had 20 targetted visitors, all have left at order page
[09:45] <mick_laptop> can't find it
[09:45] <mick_laptop> :-/
[09:45] <mick_laptop> there is something better than: http://www.craftysyntax.com/
[09:45] <mick_laptop> i just haven't found it
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[09:54] <dbgi-> midbit
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[11:09] <mick_laptop> jeev: sorry that it took so long, i found it
[11:09] <mick_laptop> http://mibew.org/
[11:12] <mick_laptop> simple, intuitive and doesn't suck
[11:12] <mick_laptop> jeev: you were looking for something like a "live help" thing, right?
[11:12] <toddf> up_the_irons: wrt the uart fix thing, does that remove the necessary 'disable mpbios' for OpenBSD or does that fix something else?
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[12:14] <up_the_irons> toddf: something else completely; "fix" a small issue with qemu serial emulation that caused a problem with FreeBSD's new uart(4) driver
[12:23] <toddf> ah
[12:24] <up_the_irons> toddf: although if there is a specific commit (or two or three...) in QEMU upstream or KVM that you think will fix the mpbios issue, I can cherry-pick it now and rebuild
[12:25] <toddf> I wish I could help, but until qemu current upstream runs on OpenBSD without SEGV'ing .. ;-(
[12:26] <toddf> it would be an easy test, just boot your qemu template for OpenBSD w/out the 'disable mpbios' fix in current qemu and that should either work or hang, if it works, there's a cherry-picking to look for, if it doesn't, they still suck
[12:27] <up_the_irons> yeah true
[12:29] <toddf> while qemu - kvm isn't slow slow, booting a kernel for testing doesn't take forever either, it hangs at the 'setting tty flags' line, which is when serial ports are probed, which is why my ears perked up when speaking of serial port issues being resolved, but somehow I suspect you're right and this won't fix things for OpenbSD
[12:30] <toddf> s/probed/first frobbed from userland/
[12:32] <up_the_irons> toddf: ah, serial port probe.. i can certainly give it a try
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[16:22] <rtjmay> Can someone give me some more info on the BSD VPS plans?
[16:30] <jeev> what would you like to know
[16:35] <rtjmay> what level of management is offered?
[16:35] <jeev> great question, i was under the impression that it was unmanaged, i'm not sure what the website said but that would be a question to ask up_the_irons
[16:35] <jeev> you're looking for management?
[16:36] <rtjmay> not necessarily, I just want to know what to expect
[16:36] <jeev> i'd say it's unmanaged but dont take my word for i
[16:36] <jeev> t
[16:36] <jeev> no questions about stability and stuff? :) i dont remember the last second of downtime i had.
[16:37] <jeev> infact, i've never ;D
[16:37] <rtjmay> what level of access is provided? Just a terminal or web-based?
[16:37] <jeev> you get ssh console access, mrtg if you want and the obvious, ssh into your server if you want
[16:37] <jeev> if you isntall that actually but i think you get ssh console access in the beginning
[16:39] <rtjmay> I've seen good reviews about service and uptime, but not a lot of information on what is provided?
[16:39] <jeev> yea, i think other than what's on the website.. i know he's working on adding stuff round the clock
[16:39] <jeev> but it's just like getting a dedicated server
[16:39] <rtjmay> what BSDs are offered?
[16:39] <jeev> i think open and free
[16:40] <jeev> i know free, i think open.. toddf is an openbsd developer
[16:41] <rtjmay> what verui
[16:41] <rtjmay> versions?
[16:41] <jeev> as far as freebsd 7.2. i think 8.0 is going into beta soon, although some people may have upgraded themselves
[16:41] <jeev> openbsd, i have no idea.
[16:42] <rtjmay> what are you running?
[16:42] <jeev> 7.2
[16:42] <rtjmay> are vm's provisioned for you or is it self-serve?
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[16:44] <jeev> as in do you just get a console and install it yoursefl ?
[16:44] <rtjmay> yes
[16:44] <jeev> they're provisioned, im not sure about the install it yourself, i'm sure if you asked.. you'd get
[16:45] <jeev> i think they're also looking into giving a single slice of / which i'd prefer, rather than the default slices
[16:45] <rtjmay> thanks, I think I'll pick up a basic plan
[16:45] <jeev> you should probably request the slices if you want / or default..
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[16:45] <jeev> cool, good luck
[16:45] <jeev> you deal with any other companies before ?
[16:46] <DaCa> for openbsd, when I ordered 4.6 was not available yet on the order form, apparently now it is
[16:46] <jeev> yea i just noticed openbsd written on the site
[16:46] <DaCa> but anyway, it's easy to upgrade, I am running a recent snapshot at the moment
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[16:46] <jeev> ahh
[16:46] <jeev> how you like openbsd? i dont recall ever trying it
[16:47] <DaCa> and you have have both vnc and serial console in addition to regular ssh
[16:47] <DaCa> so when you mess things up, you can recover
[16:49] <DaCa> jeev: well, I have been running openbsd for years, it's my favourite :)
[16:50] <jeev> ahh
[16:54] <toddf> especially with the cdrom .. one thing I wish (qemu) could set at the monitor propmt was the media it boots from, unless I missed it, you have to reboot to choose a different boot disk..
[16:57] <toddf> but yeah, soon as I got console access I re-installed my openbsd kvm from 4.5 to 4.6-current
[16:57] <DaCa> toddf: I have the 4.5 cdrom attached, which is completely useless, I just fetch a bsd.rd and install over the net
[16:58] <jeev> huh toddf
[16:58] <toddf> well, its not useless if the hard drive is hozed, can recover easily
[16:58] <jeev> you can run qemu-kvm and maake it mount a cd
[16:58] <toddf> jeev: at arpnetworks I can select cdrom vs disk boot?
[16:58] <toddf> jeev: I mean q/out exiting qmeu
[17:00] <jeev> ahh
[17:00] <sroute> rtjmay: I believe Garry is putting up a minimal install of your OS of choice; you can always change that once it is up. I take a bare minimum FreeBSD and then trick it outmyself. Like Xen you can make and install your own world and kernel
[17:01] <DaCa> toddf: btw, which mirror do you use? I noticed that the one proposed by the installer is very slow, I found that obsd.isc.org (aka ftp5.usa) has about lowest latency, but is actually still a lot slower than alberta
[17:02] <schmir> I thought people were running openbsd only on firewalls. why do you use it? I've used FreeBSD some years ago..and can understand why one chooses that (instead of say linux). but why openbsd?
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[17:20] <toddf> DaCa: I use ftp5.usa.openbsd.org not because of speed but because of v6
[17:20] <toddf> the installer provides a guess at a mirror, its not providing a guranteed good and fast one, but one that will work
[17:21] <toddf> schmir: uh, security is not limited to firewalls
[17:22] <toddf> I use OpenBSD on my desktop and all my systems, openafs servers, hosting, etc.
[17:22] <jeev> crazy
[17:22] <schmir> :)
[17:23] <toddf> then there's the (IMHO) superior package management framework, and the 'it just works' mentra plus the 'secure by default' mentra ..
[17:25] <jeev> how do you remind someone something if they promised it to you
[17:25] <jeev> passively
[17:26] <jeev> i prefer a way i could inject it in their brain while they're asleep
[17:26] <toddf> I've never installed another os where the only twiddling one has to do is to enable what one wants, instead of frantically racing against the internet people to disable all the blasted default stuff enabled ..
[17:26] <jeev> toddf, screen shot of your desktop ;D
[17:28] <toddf> http://todd.fries.net/pub/screenshot.jpg
[17:28] <schmir> toddf: I'll probably try it someday. archlinux behaves pretty similar here.
[17:29] <jeev> hmm
[17:29] <jeev> i'd kill myself if i had to look at that all day
[17:30] <toddf> hah
[17:30] <toddf> some people are gui whores
[17:30] <jeev> :>
[17:30] <toddf> I'm a minimalist
[17:30] <DaCa> toddf: cwm? :)
[17:30] <schmir> I'd kill myself if I had to use cvs
[17:30] <toddf> right on
[17:30] <jeev> i can't wait to get a ssd so i could dump vista and get win 7
[17:30] <jeev> i already have an ssd but for my desktop i need a good one
[17:30] <jeev> hey, wouldn't that be cool if arps was the first to have ssd
[17:30] <toddf> I can't stand anything proprietary os wize
[17:30] <jeev> arp was first to have ssd
[17:31] <jeev> i for one would pay a dollar a month more for 10 gigs on ssd!
[17:31] <jeev> haha
[17:31] <toddf> jeev: to .. not use it still?
[17:31] <jeev> raid 10 on ssd, how much
[17:31] <toddf> or have you started using your kvm instance yet?
[17:31] <jeev> i dont use it much, i mirror helio's evoke thingy for bsd
[17:31] <jeev> google evoke google code
[17:32] <jeev> http://code.google.com/p/evoke/ evoke is really cool
[17:32] <jeev> i've used it to wipe dedicated's clean before i cancel
[17:32] <jeev> so i make sure they dont go recover shit
[17:32] <jeev> but of course.. openbsd can probably do it by default.
[17:32] <toddf> if all you want to do is wipe the hd
[17:33] <toddf> http://code.freedaemon.com/p/secwipe
[17:33] <toddf> runnable from any openbsd bsd.rd
[17:33] <jeev> heh
[17:33] <jeev> but i assume it has to be unmounted
[17:33] <toddf> in bsd.rd its in ram so the real hd of course is not mounted
[17:34] <jeev> crazy
[17:34] <jeev> i'ev got to give openbsd a try one day
[17:35] <jeev> toddf, does bsd.rd have the ability to inject something into someone's mind while they're sleeping so they can remember it ?!?
[17:35] <toddf> only if you add /dev/head to it before booting
[17:35] <jeev> hmm, too much work..
[17:38] <jeev> i guess i have to wait for him to remember it, i am very annoyed.. i was perfectly happy
[17:39] <toddf> I've never seen fuming work over a misremembered promise, I'd recommend you outright remind the person
[17:40] <toddf> s/promise/promise work/
[17:42] <jeev> that's why i dont want to remind ;D
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[17:53] <toddf> so you can get a good fume out?
[17:53] <jeev> mick_laptop, thanks but i think i'm gonna get this hosted one instead cause it lets me pop into their screen
[17:54] <jeev> huh todd
[17:54] <toddf> me: I dont see fuming work, I recommend you outright remind..
[17:54] <toddf> you: thats why i dont want to remind
[17:55] <jeev> oh
[17:55] <jeev> well if it was that big of a deal, you'd still remind ?
[17:55] <toddf> I like the simple reality. either remind or forget, not stress my life away, regardless the size of the deal. deal and move on, I say.
[17:59] <jeev> yea, im gonna try to forget.
[17:59] <jeev> i sort of reminded once
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[18:10] <jeev> is arpnetworks gonna have a float at the rose parade?
[18:13] <jeev> OH MY GOD did anyone see those two hot teachers naked in a new york school ?????????????????????
[18:14] <jeev> holy
[18:14] <jeev> sorry
[18:14] <jeev> http://www.popfi.com/wp-content/uploads/alini-brito-and-cindy-mauro.jpg
[18:14] <jeev> i'd hit the left one
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[18:48] <jeev> wow man livechat is the greatest thing for a website
[18:49] <toddf> snarfed a customer via conversion?
[18:49] <toddf> I wish it supported postgresql
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[18:49] <ballen> up_the_irons what kvm patch did to pull from uptream?
[18:49] <jeev> earlier
[18:49] <jeev> now, thy just ask questions or ignore it
[18:49] <jeev> another cool thing is when i write a message to them
[18:50] <jeev> i know if they close the site
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[18:50] <jeev> it's ok, they'll be back
[18:50] <ballen> mmk
[19:16] <up_the_irons> ballen: this one:
[19:16] <up_the_irons> commit 2d6ee8e7e17227d5eb8c6e9a054dd88d5b37c5ae
[19:16] <up_the_irons> Author: Juergen Lock <nox@jelal.kn-bremen.de>
[19:16] <up_the_irons> Date:   Sat Sep 12 18:52:22 2009 +0200
[19:16] <up_the_irons>     qemu serial: lost tx irqs (affecting FreeBSD's new uart(4) driver)
[19:16] <up_the_irons> ballen: it's from QEMU and I applied it to KVMmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[19:16] <up_the_irons> lol
[19:16] <ballen> lol
[19:16] <up_the_irons> *KV
[19:16] <ballen> oh I see
[19:16] <up_the_irons> *KVM
[19:16] <ballen> what its actually a big deal
[19:16] <ballen> why*
[19:17] <ballen> guessing you were running into an issue with FreeBSD somewhere?
[19:17] <up_the_irons> ballen: I didn't have the ability to connect to the serial console of FreeBSD 8 guests, only 7.2 and prior.  That patch fixed it right up
[19:17] <ballen> ah right on
[19:17] <ballen> well done
[19:18] <up_the_irons> thanks, I went bonkers when I saw it all work
[19:18] <up_the_irons> cuz it is not just the patch, it is also rebuilding the kvm package of Ubuntu (makeing the .deb), then applying it as an upgrade
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[19:19] <ballen> yea
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[19:20] <up_the_irons> and for the record, sometimes keys stick on  my keyboard, hence the million m's above ;)
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[19:28] <ballen> ahhh
[19:28] <ballen> fair enough
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[19:35] <jeev> bastards
[19:49] <ballen> indeed
[20:01] <jeev> wow toddf
[20:02] <jeev> well im glad.. but i dont think im gonna get it after all
[20:15] <mick_laptop> jeev: did you end up using the link that i sent you?
[20:18] <jeev> it was cool, thanks
[20:19] <jeev> but i'm gonna use a paid one.. that one doesn't let me pop into people's screens
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[20:20] <sroute> morning. I mean evening.
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[20:23] <sroute> toddf: your desktop looks familiar; what are you using as a wm?
[20:24] <sroute> I'm gui-less myself, although I must admit I'm too lazy to size windows so I let dwm do it for mw. Probabliy not jeev's cuppa tea. Oh, speaking of tea, I think I'll go make a pot before I settle in for the night shift.
[20:27] <jeev> heh
[20:27] <jeev> i'm drinking tea now
[21:30] <toddf> sroute: cwm
[21:37] <coil> hi i just ordered!
[21:37] <sroute> Ah; I've not had the pleasure. I once had a quick gander at evilwm but ended up with wmii, which was burdened with too much Plan 9 religion, but dwm which arose from it is nice and small. Can't be bothered to switch to anything else now, and frankly when you spend all day long in terminal windows your needs are pretty small aren't they...
[21:37] <sroute> coil welcome to the family.
[21:38] <sroute> Now that you are here coil, it is only fair that you be warned. you can check out anytime you like, but you can never leave...
[21:39] <coil> haha whats that from
[21:39] <sroute> sorry, had an Eagles song stuck in my head
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[21:52] <toddf> sroute: small needs indeed, 'boarderwidth 1' so one pixel boarders on all apps, about all I need
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