[02:12] *** nuke^ has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection) [02:12] *** nuke^ has joined #arpnetworks [02:44] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o toddf [03:06] *** Thorgrim1 has quit IRC (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) [03:06] *** Thorgrimr has joined #arpnetworks [05:58] *** heavysixer has joined #arpnetworks [05:58] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o heavysixer [06:34] *** vtoms has joined #arpnetworks [08:01] *** Ta| has quit IRC (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) [08:28] Where, oh where has my server gone :( [08:45] who knows [08:46] http://bash.org/?5273 - ? [08:47] heh \ [09:03] lost a machine... man, I wouldn't want to have to clean *that* place [09:04] up_the_irons: perhaps we'll see another SSL security advisory soon: http://www.links.org/?p=780 [09:07] Nothing on FreeBSD advisories as yet. http://www.freebsd.org/security/advisories.html [09:13] TLS working group to submit a revised protocol http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/tls/current/msg03948.html [09:14] This man-in-the-middle attack vector is brought to you by new Diamond-shaped Shreddies. [09:25] *** vtoms has quit IRC ("Leaving.") [09:31] time to hack everyone! [09:38] *** ballen is now known as ballen|away [09:55] lets hack 3dnow to make it work on kvm [09:55] ;) [09:55] or kvm to work on 3dnow haha [09:58] charter bringing 60 megs to cali [09:58] but what's the point if you could only sustain 15megs [09:58] ;) [10:01] *** ballen|away is now known as ballen [10:13] oh apparently burbank/glendale is on docsis 3 [10:13] how much are they charging for that [10:14] 140 standalone, 130 bundled [10:14] for 60? [10:14] looks like arpnetworks will be hosted on charter soon! just kidding [10:14] yea, pointless. charter barely delivers 10 megs when you sub to 20 [10:14] i mean sometimes it's fast, most of the times it sucks [10:14] lame [10:15] they seem to have 3-6 month periods where they're decent, then 3-6 months where they suck [10:16] meh... shared bandwidth [10:16] I suppose all bandwidth is shared [10:16] its just at what level [10:17] I see qwest and AT&T are running fiber to the neighborhood, having a DSLAM in each neighborhood, then running short dsl runs to the house [10:17] yea, i have that now [10:18] uverse [10:18] cox in oklahoma city does good on what it promises, I pay for 15/1.5 and get every bit of it and more at times, supposedly going up to 50/25 soon, and I believe I'll get most of that too [10:18] ah right [10:18] nice [10:18] business class may make a small difference, dunno [10:18] too bad att is pathetic, too pathetic to just wire fiber to people [10:18] att wireless is suing verizon for their commercials [10:18] haha [10:18] the funny thing is the maps they put on the commercials are true. [10:20] too bad cox is pathetic with its fiber, I can get 256k/s fiber with unlimited IP's for $95/mo (multiply by four, gee, we have just shy of the cost of a t1), and 10mbit/mo for $2k/mo .. its truly pathetic given what their cable side is gonna do (but no unlimited ips *sigh*) [10:20] unlimited ips ? [10:20] if the sales person and rumors hold true, my $89/mo for home business and $114/mo for office space business are both gonna get 50/25 [10:20] what, ipv6 ? .loo [10:20] l [10:21] jeev: unlimited in that as long as I can justify it they keep them coming [10:21] that's always been untrue [10:21] trust me, I can justify a lot with my equipment [10:21] they just say that [10:21] they'd be stupid to give a hundred dollar customer something more than a /25 prob [10:21] something tells me their unlimited promises would be greater than 5 I've been given [10:21] even more than one ip! [10:21] crazy [10:22] *** ballen_ has joined #arpnetworks [10:22] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ballen_ [10:25] ballen [10:25] what was that blogging sutff you told me about last time [10:29] scanty-redis [11:11] *** ballen_ has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection) [11:11] *** ballen has quit IRC (Remote closed the connection) [11:15] scanty [11:15] sounds nasty [11:34] Thorgrimr: send me your SSH pub key and I'll give you access to our new management console, where you can soft restart, hard restart, boot, serial-over-IP, etc... your VM :) [11:49] sroute: interesting SSL stuff [11:51] up_the_irons: Enroute [11:51] Thorgrimr: tnx [11:51] Thorgrimr: you back up now? [11:52] Yessir, thank you [11:52] Trying the portupgrade again... not sure what the heck it did [11:54] toddf: apparently they haven't heard about IPv4 run-out ;) [12:00] Thorgrimr: see email for console instructions [12:01] cd $offie [12:02] danke [12:15] up_the_irons: some of them have, just that service offerings today don't reflect that; supposedly client side v6 will come within a year or so, but I will hold my breath till it arrives [12:20] whereis ballen damnit [12:21] this scanty or redis thing doesn't work [12:21] or shall i see, the ruby thingy [12:21] did a make buildkernel on a somewhat utilized fbsd server [12:21] got 14 minutes [12:21] arp took 18 minutes [12:22] If you just want a blog engine and don't care about the underlying technology, Wordpress is the way to go. [12:22] i think that providers need to offer vps's with 200-250 gig raid 1 storage [12:22] and it'll be really good [12:22] mike-burns, i dunno man i never liked wordpress [12:22] i want something secure and nice [12:24] whatcha think mike-burns? [12:24] i need security mainly, thinking about launching a blog on ahmadinejad.org [12:24] I don't know of any secure blogs. [12:24] that makes fun of right wing politics and half the american population for being idiots [12:24] bah [12:25] Wordpress is the most popular, so there's that. [12:26] yea [12:27] anyway, this scanty issue is probably due to my ignorance of ruby [12:27] it's giving some errors [12:31] someone want to point out `secure' blog software? I'll host it ;-) [12:31] heh [12:31] the most secure one [12:31] vi index.html! [12:34] vi indeed is a secure blog [12:35] damnit [12:35] maybe i should try putting scanty on linux first [12:39] What's the problem? [12:39] probably missing some deps [12:42] i'm so glad i nistalled xen on a slack box and installed slack guests ;) [12:42] non vt hardware, that's what's so fun [12:44] /usr/lib64/ruby/site_ruby/1.8/rubygems/custom_require.rb:31:in `gem_original_require': no such file to load -- blankslate (LoadError) [12:44] same on freebsd/slack [12:44] some stuff below too but still [12:44] sudo gem install blankslate [12:45] i tried, maybe i didn't with gem [12:45] ERROR: could not find gem blankslate locally or in a repository [12:46] sudo gem install JackDanger-blankslate -s http://gems.github.com/ [12:46] http://github.com/masover/blankslate [12:46] yea [12:47] that's not working by the way [12:47] i dont know how github or gem install works but maybe it's [12:47] masover-blankslate ? [12:47] yea, masover worekd [12:49] now, missing iconv [12:50] cd /usr/ports/converters/ruby-iconv && sudo make install clean [12:51] jeebus, i hate this [12:51] Relax, it's fine. [12:51] ruby is cool though, no ? [12:51] is that what is to be learned nowadays ? [12:52] No idea. [12:52] It was pretty hot five years ago. I think Scala or Erlang or something is big today. [12:52] yay, works [12:52] five years? damn [12:53] Maybe six or seven. Whenever I started in Ruby, it was hot. [12:54] crazy [12:55] so its' running but i dunno what to do now [12:55] maybe i'm just an idiot, i should really consider reading things [12:55] So you have a server running somewhere, I guess? [12:55] Maybe port 3000, maybe elsewhere. Probably a config file. [13:01] [2009-11-05 13:01:43] INFO WEBrick::HTTPServer#start: pid=73374 port=4567 [13:01] ohhhhhhhhhhh [13:01] so i just launch that on 80 or something [13:02] Yeah but don't use Webrick. [13:02] This is a Rails app, I assume? [13:03] yea [13:03] If you're using Apache, look into Phusion Passenger. If you're using nginx then you care about things like memory and speed a little too much and should look into Thin. [13:05] na [13:05] just nothing really [13:05] but webrick is bad ? [13:06] WEBrick is the easiest Rails/etc. Web server to get running, since you basically do nothing for it. It's perfect for developing a Rails site on your laptop, but it can't handle too much traffic. [13:06] Another easy route is Mongrel. You can just 'sudo gem install mongrel' and script/server will use Mongrel instead of WEBRick. [13:07] But you may want mongrel_cluster instead, since that can handle more traffic. [13:08] how much is regular traffic [13:08] like a meg or two is too much ? [13:09] Two concurrent clients is too much for straight-up WEBRick or Mongrel. [13:09] jeebus [13:09] maybe i should plug it into apache [13:09] That's not a fault of Mongrel, mind you; Mongrel isn't meant to be a full Web server. It's an application server for handling exactly one client really well. [13:10] gem install passenger;passenger-install-apache2-module [13:10] You will need either Apache or nginx. [13:10] * sroute resists talking about Python [13:10] Sure, Python is irrelevant to setting up scanty-reddis. [13:11] oh for sure... I'm just interested in web server/app interfaces having been there done that over the years in python land [13:13] my piece: if you're gonna run Rails or Rack apps, use Passenger. It is SO MUCH BETTER than managing Mongrels with nginx / thin / w/e... [13:13] it is the way web app deployment *should* be [13:13] Yeah. [13:13] I have rails apps and sinatra apps sitting together on the same server, and Passenger serves them without me thinking about it [13:13] hmm brb [13:14] it is a joy [13:14] so i got passenger, set up apache for it [13:14] but ruby hurts my eyes so I'm not likely to dive deep into Mongrel et al. Highest performance interface I've typically seen is either a) mod_proxy or any web server proxy module (which is applicable to Ruby apps and Python) or mod_wsgi (apache, python only); or mod_scgi I find works extremely well and have used it for years (some ruby folks use this too) [13:14] how do i attach it [13:14] * sroute heads off to read and understand Passenger [13:15] Passenger is Rack's mod_wsgi. [13:15] i like python, but I can't stand that whitespace is significant; it is just a philosophical thing I don't agree with [13:15] you guys ever seen the language "whitespace" ? [13:15] I never noticed the syntactic difference between Python and Ruby. [13:15] incidentally, an arpnetworks vm running my framework of choice, returning a fairly simple html page with a couple of trivial db lookups -- I can churn out 900+ req/second [13:15] if not, this is truly a good read: http://compsoc.dur.ac.uk/whitespace/ [13:15] not bad. [13:15] up_the_irons: That's a SKI-combinator language using space and tab, right? [13:16] mike-burns: yup [13:16] re whitespace, likewise, I can't stand the use of "end" everywhere (ruby) or "{};" (many others [13:16] SO HILARIOUS [13:16] anyway, whatever fits our brains better is what we should use. [13:17] sroute: but given the choice, I'd take "end" or "}" or ")" over whitespace significance. It is simply more explicit. Did you use a space instead of a tab in your Makefile, anyone? ;) [13:18] ah, but I write a lot more code than Makefiles ;) [13:18] just an example, DON'T CHANGE THE SUBJECT ;) [13:18] Haskell has whitespace-significance. Luckily they made it such that the language is hard to learn regardless of syntax. [13:18] the one advantage though, that I do like, is: it forces all code to be indented consistently [13:18] configuration files the world over have their own idiosynchracies... [13:18] mike-burns: LOL [13:19] that's one of the main reasons I like Python... reading even bad code is easier, although I try to avoid having to do that. [13:19] yeah [13:19] agreed re Haskell; played a bit with it but... ugh. [13:19] I'm a really big Haskell fan. [13:20] part of my dislike for haskell probably stems from how long it takes to build the sucker! (half-kidding0 [13:21] Ha, ghc is a pain. They sped it up for the latest release. [13:22] i run xmonad, and indeed it took a long time to build haskell [13:22] *** vtoms has joined #arpnetworks [13:22] having said that, I have been meaning to force myself to actually learn a new language; from mainframes in the 80's to now I've had to work with a few but stopped in 2003 with Python; time to expand my brain again. [13:22] Well I suggest Haskell. [13:23] up_the_irons: indeed I recently wanted to play with xmonad which is why I started playing with haskell briefly. Never got round to messing about with xmonad. I run a slightly hacked version of dwm here, which i quite like [13:24] tiling wm's are where it's at for me at least. [13:24] mike-burns: is there a decent web framework for Haskell? It might be more interesting for me and keep my attention if I can build a few toy solutions [13:25] There is no decent Web framework for Haskell. [13:25] sad. [13:25] The most popular is HappStack. [13:25] I use Haskell for GUIs and daemons, mostly. [13:25] In python popular != decent necessarily [13:26] what gui platform? [13:26] GTK [13:26] are there nice bindings? cross platform (win and *nix)? [13:26] They're just the standard GTK bindings. [13:27] There are also really nice bindings but they're not as well-maintained. [13:27] There's some functional-reactive GTK binding (grapefruit-gtk, I think) that looks really hot. [13:28] sroute: yeah, i like xmonad. i was using wmii before that, which i also liked, but xmonad is nicer [13:31] oh I remember wmii too, hung out on their channel for awhile. dwm I prefer as it is simpler and my needs required a minor patch early on; recent versions obliterated the need for that. About the only thing that picked me was having to write a little routine for a decent status bar so I have a python daemon that does that now, using xlib to update the root window name area [13:33] mike-burns: is there a "simple" web framework for haskell? wouldn't mind looking at something deliberately slim first, just as an intro. Alternatively I could think of a daemon or two I've been meaning to write, including a policy server for postfix [13:35] sroute: There's a Rack-like (WSGI-like) framework called Hack. [13:36] http://github.com/nfjinjing/hack [13:36] There's also a Haskell Web server named Hyena that you'll see referenced. IT's very minimal but gets the job done. [13:41] thanks, having a look at some code... helpful to see something I deal with every day. [14:42] hrmf [14:43] so i've gotta understand this [14:43] passenger thing [14:46] how do i get this to work! [14:46] is it lack of documentation or lack of caring [14:46] Lack of caring. [14:47] So you gem install it (which you did) and you run the Apache installer (which you did) and you set up a vhost. [14:47] What's not working? [14:48] yea [14:48] when i point the virtualhost [14:49] documentroot and what not, what's supposed to happen? how is it supposed to actually execute, there aren't any php or html files [14:50] i mean i have to 'ruby main.rb' for it to listen on it's port [14:50] how does passenger happen to start it.. and do it by itself [14:50] It runs public/dispatch.rb, approximately. [14:51] It was once the case that public/dispatch.rb was the entrance-point to a Rails app; I assume it still is. [14:52] But Passenger takes care of that; you just point DocumentRoot at the public/ dir and hit the vhost over HTTP. [14:52] i've only got main.css in public [14:52] Ah, this is not a Rails app. [14:53] I hadn't looked at scanty-redis until just now. [14:53] :< [14:53] Oh this is Sinatra? [14:54] yes [14:54] http://www.modrails.com/documentation/Users%20guide.html#_sinatra - there's this. [14:54] I've never deployed a Sinatra app. [14:55] You need a config.ru in the root of your app with that code in it. [14:55] http://vinnyt.org/2009/03/13/deploy-sinatra-app-with-phusion-passengerapacherack/ [14:55] http://gist.github.com/98297 [14:57] hmm [14:57] public [15:02] works, weird [15:02] the config.ru that had come with it was fine [15:02] *** vtoms has quit IRC ("Leaving.") [15:03] Oh cool. [15:08] i wonder how it works to restart it [15:08] tmp remove ? eh [15:09] You're supposed to be able to touch tmp/restart.txt and that will restart it. [15:09] This worked for me for a bit, then stopped; these days I just restart apache. [15:16] yea [15:16] i dont have a tmp [15:16] but lets see [15:16] worked here [15:16] so touch and remove it eh [15:17] cool, thanks for your help [15:17] i've gotta make this look sexy [15:17] Any time. [15:25] when i get some comfortable time, i'll try doing some cool stuff [15:25] had you heard about scanty before? [15:25] i think earlier you said you hadn't [15:26] I hadn't, no. [15:29] ahh [15:29] seems simple [15:47] cool [15:47] it looks good, i img src'd an image, looks very simple [16:25] *** heavysixer has quit IRC () [16:39] *** cablehead has quit IRC ("Leaving.") [16:41] *** dbgi2IAm is now known as dbgi [16:50] *** cablehead has joined #arpnetworks [16:50] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o cablehead [17:01] *** heavysixer has joined #arpnetworks [17:01] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o heavysixer [17:06] *** ballen has joined #arpnetworks [17:06] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o ballen [17:33] *** heavysixer has quit IRC () [17:54] *** heavysixer has joined #arpnetworks [17:54] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o heavysixer [18:07] *** heavysixer has quit IRC () [18:29] anyone ever ship a car before? [18:32] my friend has [18:32] oversea's [18:34] bbl [19:01] That sounds like fun. [19:13] jeev: you want 200-250 GB RAID 1 storage? (from earlier) And how much you think providers should charge for that? [19:15] They should pay me for it! [19:15] same [19:19] jeev: when your sinatra stuff is up, let us know [19:19] LOL [19:50] *** ballen has quit IRC () [22:56] it is [22:56] been up [22:56] up_the_irons, im saying like [22:56] if people want to save power, save space and stuff [22:56] i built kernel in 14 min on a dedi from krypt.com, basic core 2 duo i'd say [22:57] people should be willing to pay a little premium for that space [22:57] the hard drive space [23:04] jeev: that space would probably cost more, i'm sure [23:05] yea [23:05] jeev: what is your site url? [23:05] even if not raid 1 [23:05] the sinatra one [23:05] www.jeev.net [23:05] hehe, nice [23:05] you had one, no ? [23:05] one what? [23:05] running this scanty stuff [23:06] no, i think ballen does [23:06] ahh [23:06] anyway [23:06] if people wanna go 'green' [23:06] they should get a vps like this [23:06] with a bigger drive [23:06] if that's what they need, you know [23:06] save the space [23:08] you gonna get 60 meg charter? [23:13] no [23:13] i'm not in a charter area [23:13] i'm in el-sucko land [23:13] down_the_irons [23:13] lol [23:15] who's el-sucko [23:18] earthlink ? [23:18] heh [23:18] that's the only e i know for isp [23:33] jeev: time warner