up_the_irons: imagine you being able to run your own VMs within your primary VM
you could buy a big VM and make a few littler ones ballen: I'm afraid it will cause BSD to fall much to the wayside in the future as virt becomes ubiquitous
yea you can run ESX instead of a VM running in ESX or Workstation
inside*
using for testing up_the_irons: hehe
or virt support will get better in the BSDs ballen: yea and for god knows what reason NetBSD is leading the way with Xen support up_the_irons: yeah, it's funny that I got NetBSD working on Xen years ago ballen: should run a few Windows 7 vms
round out the offering up_the_irons: me? ballen: ya up_the_irons: no way
;) ballen: why not up_the_irons: against my religion ballen: oh come on Windows isn't that bad up_the_irons: although I do have 10 WinXP VMs running at DigiSynd
/kick ballen^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H
;)
I got asked for Windows VMs once ballen: lmao, just messin I haven't used a windows box in many years up_the_irons: licensing issues are kinda a pain ballen: yes up_the_irons: If I take on other OS's, the next would probably be OpenSolaris (after NetBSD) ballen: be fun to play with OS X Server though
OpenSolaris is a mess
all Solarises are up_the_irons: I manage a couple XServe's ballen: imho up_the_irons: OS X Server is nice in a way, not nice in others ballen: yea up_the_irons: if you have a problem, it is hard to google the solution ballen: typically do it apple's way up_the_irons: i had to call apple support one day
it was pretty good ballen: cool
never had to deal with their server support
also getting laptop parts replaces
always*
replaced*
bleh, typing bad need to sleep up_the_irons: hehe ballen: alright I'm off for the night, good luck with migrations up_the_irons: i want to be able to script a FreeBSD fs resize (my experiment for tonight)
ballen: tnx, g'night! ballen: if you figure out the resize, let me know
I'd be interested
anywho, night ***: ballen is now known as ballen|away up_the_irons: will do
who's alive in here?
Qsource: did you still need a linux VM for VPN testing? ***: [FBI] starts logging #arpnetworks at Fri Sep 18 03:28:53 2009
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oh man
OH MAN
my life is forever changed...
I just live migrated a VM!
122 packets transmitted, 122 received, 0% packet loss, time 121059ms
Not even a lost packet!
ballen|away: so good news / bad news -- turns out live migration works with my current kvm / qemu version, so it is not totally borked. Bad news is the VM i migrated was a Linux VM. So there must be something about the FreeBSD guest that is freaking it out. Nevertheless, something i'm sure an upgrade would fix
this is some f'in incredible shit i just witnessed... ***: mhoran has quit IRC (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) obsidieth: que ***: mhoran has joined #arpnetworks obsidieth: is all ipv6 bouncin
or just me up_the_irons: obsidieth: i bounced the router a couple times obsidieth: 10 4 up_the_irons: i'm done now, so no more outages obsidieth: its not an issue, just making sure i didnt have to check it out up_the_irons: roger
4:44AM PST... got a lot accomplished tonight, i think it is time to retire... obsidieth: :D nice
later
got someone else after a fbsd vps too, perhaps 'dean' will stop by.
i pointed him in your direction up_the_irons: ah sweet, thanks
:)
man, tired...
cd $bed baklava: aww
up_the_irons: any chance rDNS delegations are what you enjoy doing most after a long night's sleep? :) mhoran: Haha.
Everyone loves doing DNS when they wake up!
I think I'll do some DNS right now! obsidieth: partytime baklava: woohoo ***: vtoms has joined #arpnetworks
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jeev has joined #arpnetworks jeev: g4y ***: Limb has joined #arpnetworks Limb: Hello all, anyone rrom ARP support here?
from* jeev: he should be on Limb: I'm assuming that'd be up_the_irons? jeev: yea bobbyw: someone said dude was still sleeping when I asked jeev: he was up
oh yea he slept at 5 am ***: ballen is now known as ballen|away
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ballen|away is now known as ballen up_the_irons: Limb: welcome to #arpnetworks
bobbyw: welcome to #arpnetworks ballen: up_the_irons: congrats on getting migrations working
even if it was just a linux vm up_the_irons: ballen: yeah, at least i know the basic setup is correct ballen: yea jeev: OH MY GOD
http://idle.slashdot.org/story/09/09/18/1548259/Burglar-Logs-Into-Facebook-On-Victims-Computer?art_pos=2 bobbyw: up_the_irons: hey, thanks jeev: hahahahahahahah up_the_irons: jeev: hahahhahaha jeev: yet-another-lobbyist writes to mention that Facebook addiction has finally caused real world consequences, at least for one would-be burglar. It seems that 19-year-old Jonathan Parker couldn't stay away from the popular social networking site, even long enough to rob a house. Parker not only stopped mid-robbery to check his Facebook status on the victim's computer, but left it logged in to his account when he left. -: up_the_irons facepalms jeev: i wonder if he could sue saying that he didn't check the "remember me next time" cookie shit
even though i dont use ffacebook up_the_irons: heh ***: ballen is now known as ballen|away
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ballen|away is now known as ballen ballen: lattes are so good at 9PM jeev: you're the coffee adict eh up_the_irons: even better at 11PM Nat_UB: Keep you from sleeping... :) ballen: jeev: yes jeev: i drink coffee for the taste ballen: Nat_UB: thats the idea jeev: when i put the creamer
cffee doesn't keep me up Nat_UB: I love coffee...but gotta get my beauty sleep... ballen: makes my brain capable of writting more on this horrid paper up_the_irons: ballen: your thesis? ballen: indeed up_the_irons: how long is it so far? ballen: 60 some odd pages up_the_irons: wow
what are you aiming for? ballen: shrug, not page limit up_the_irons: gotcha ballen: just till I have the content up_the_irons: yeah ballen: I'd say it'll be another 30 pages +
if I'm lucky and concise
with all the screen caps I need to add it'll add another 10 pages on top of that
oh btw no need for the FreeBSD 8 Beta VM anymore ended up just setting it up at work
however when you're getting read to test 8 let me know
ready*
I must say though Latex is the best thing ever to write big papers in up_the_irons: roger on FreeBSD 8
heck yeah, LaTeX is da bomb
i did all my papers in school with it ballen: yea same up_the_irons: esp. physics and math papers mike-burns: The best part of LaTeX is the editor. ballen: I just use TextMate mike-burns: Oh you're missing out. ballen: somehow I doubt this mike-burns: ... you're missing out on vim! ballen: meh mike-burns: But that was kinda my point: writing papers with LaTeX is better than with e.g. AbiWord because you get to use any editor you want. ballen: aaah
thought there was some bundled LaTex Editor -: up_the_irons scratches head up_the_irons: yeah
i was like.. mike-burns: There's LyX, but I don't see the point. up_the_irons: "what LaTeX editor?"
LyX is actually quite good
I used it heavily ballen: love using the word Hereunder mike-burns: Next time I have to write a paper I'll probably try LyX. up_the_irons: i had hot keys for writing complex math formulas DOWN
so I could bust out really nice formulas fast.. i would look at the generated LaTeX, and it was way complicated to do that by hand ;) ballen: yea
its wicked nice up_the_irons: I had a professor at UCLA.. went to his office, he had a HUGE office.. took "Computer Systems Modeling" with him. Noticed him writing a paper in vim, on his Sun workstation, writing LaTeX markup
i thought that was pretty hard core ballen: heh jeev: that's disgusting mhoran: Nah man, that's how it's done. mike-burns: vim has a sweet LaTeX package. Billions of aliases and whatnot. up_the_irons: mike-burns: o'rly? nice
jeev: yeah man, *that's* *how* *it's* *done" ;) mhoran: Speaking of vim awesomeness, I gave my boss enough of a hard time that he's using macvim or whatever the native app is. up_the_irons: nice mhoran: Now to get the Emacs users switched over ... mike-burns: Ha, good luck switching them! mhoran: I was asked to install Emacs on aa production server today, and had to comply. :(
I don't want X on my production box! mike-burns: I really want to try emacs, but I really don't want to install it. up_the_irons: mhoran: there was no emacs-nox11 package? mhoran: They wanted the X package.
So they can click around.
Ugh. ballen: emacs is lame up_the_irons: mhoran: and if it's a FreeBSD box, I think it let's you pick the non X11 version if you install from ports
mhoran: oh oh
they *WANTED* it that way mhoran: No FreeBSD. :( up_the_irons: fuck them mhoran: Yup. up_the_irons: so many vim users here, this is awesome -: ballen hates that one of his developers insists on using it ***: heavysixer has quit IRC () mike-burns: We have one emacs guy at my job, but at least it's a programmable editor. It's not TextMate or RedMine or whatever. mhoran: The thing that made my boss want to use TextMate was Cyberduck integration -- but I guess this Cocoa port of vim has Cyberduck support as well. ballen: someone needs to write a grammar checker that has more knowledge of the english language then a human mhoran: The Emacs X-forward thing is awful, though. ballen: I'll give you a little cyberduck integration mhoran: ballen: How do you get a human with more knowledge of the English language than a human to write a grammar checker with more knowledge of the English language than a human?
I think it'd be easier to solve the halting problem. ballen: have two humans do it mike-burns: Bam.
Also, I approve of any sentence about grammar that uses poor grammar. mhoran: Huh. That was easy. ballen: hah
seems like someone should start a startup that tackles the grammar check problem
and truely solve it
or at least improve it
we need to source some english profs mike-burns: Knowing grammar isn't the problem; parsing natural languages is. ballen: indeed mike-burns: English profs are pretty mediocre at programming. ballen: indeed
however they are good at english
think of the profits to be had
if there was a program that could perfectly correct a paper mike-burns: Ah that's too subjective. ballen: the school children would rejoice
english grammar lessons would become outdated overnight mike-burns: Please no. ballen: hah
see thats step one
step two after everyone can't talk
is to be able to parse voice
and playback the correct sentance
its gold I tell you mike-burns: In the future all conversation will sound like Jerkcity. mhoran: HUGLAGHALGHALGHAL mike-burns: The future is here. ballen: it may be the downfall of society as we know but when has that stopped someone from making money up_the_irons: LOL ballen: maybe we should just go with the mechnical turk approach, hire a shit load of minimum wage people to correct papers
actually
a combination
do that for a year or so
gather data
go from there up_the_irons: LOL ballen: wonder if could source K-12 schools
copies of papers before and after corrections
it would seem after some point you'd have enough data
to catalog every single error and correction
possible in the lang
quick, someone recommend a techno artist
anyone, anyone?
rap?
any music what so ever Thorgrimr: Didn't realize you were looking for music selections based on the requests :) ballen: ya
just need something new, getting bored of my library mike-burns: The problem isn't knowing grammar, just to state the obvious. ballen: of course
its knowing how people fuck up grammar mike-burns: Yeah, in a sense. It's parsing non-grammatical sentences. ballen: yep mike-burns: There are ambiguities in grammatical sentences; parsing non-grammatical ones is basically impossible. ballen: wonder if anyone has looked at the fesability of playing a shuffle game with the words in a sentence. Looks for sentances that match known grammar rules.
the brute force method ***: bobbyw has joined #arpnetworks mike-burns: Huh, that's a fun idea. ballen: then go go worth and start substituting similar words
wow
retarded sentance
then go further and... mike-burns: Doesn't scan. ballen: with more and more comuting power at the desktop
computing* mike-burns: Sure, all we need are a bunch of FreeBSD VPSes.
Oh i have to go to a bar now. ballen: mmk
have fun
get drunk, don't drive
suggestions for diagraming software? ***: bobbyw has quit IRC ("Leaving.") up_the_irons: ballen: i always used xfig for freehand, and graphviz otherwise ballen: bleh up_the_irons: haha ballen: OmniGraffle is what I've used in the past
but its somewhat slow
at least on my mac
up_the_irons: questions on live migrations, can you live migrate to a VM that has more RAM or larger HD?
cause that'd be the hotness
somehow I doubt the live RAM part is possible jeev: i just spent 14 hours trying to get simcopter working
and it finally is but crashes often mhoran: ballen: Memory "ballooning" is a feature of Xen. I'm not sure if the same exists in Xen.
The HD upgrade is certainly possible, however I think there would have to be some downtime due to the fact that the FS has to be modified.
However that process is quite simple. ballen: yea maybe hotplug an additional drive mhoran: The memory balloning requires some client support, however.
Yeah. You couldn't resize an existing drive, but you could certainly hotplug.
Same with CPUs. ballen: any idea if KVM supports it mhoran: Memory is more complicated, hence why the Xen implementation is complicated.
Not sure.
up_the_irons had to restart my VM to add an extra disk.
So I'm guessing, not at this point. ballen: I know ESX has all that fun stuff
with a wicked expensive license add-on mhoran: Yeah. Their licensing is ridiculous. ballen: schema for key/value db's is a pain
just thought it'd be cool to be able to scale a VM vertically on the fly mhoran: Yeah.
For sure.
We're getting there!
KVM has certainly come a long way. ballen: that it has, I'm really quite impressed with it mhoran: I can't wait to dump Xen at work. But by the time I finally get the chance to do that, maybe Xen will become stable again. :/
I'd love live migrations, though.
But, not working.
Bunch of hacks. ballen: yea, live migrations is so freakin cool
that feature alone makes virtulization so much better than bare metal installs mhoran: Yeah. ballen: if you had it hooked up to BGP you could move a VM into another datacenter, across the world, etc mhoran: That's actually something I'm working on. ballen: nice mhoran: But since live migrations don't work, :(
But hopefully BGP.
Our DR setup right now is pretty sweet, though. ballen: cool mhoran: Coming from a company where we ran on bare minimum of everything, this is a big change for me, heh.
We actually have backups! Haha. ballen: thats always a nice change
lmao backups are good mhoran: However, they don't test their software. >:o ballen: hah mhoran: Which means, it breaks in the middle of the night and I get the call. ballen: neither do I mhoran: tsk, tsk ballen: I'm a sysadm not a dev mhoran: It's easy!
Write the tests and the code writes itself. ballen: yaaaa