[00:01] brycec: i hate it when people comment saying what something does when it's obvious, and then leave out the complicated stuff. [00:02] you know like "apt-get install tmux vim" etc "# install useful packages [00:03] Or "Create database ___, setup replication with server Q over the ssh tunnel" [00:04] is there a ssh tunnel implementation that'll recreate a ssh session persistently without breaking a pipe if ssh dies? [00:04] replication over ssh is inherently unstable.. [00:05] i can see the use case. [00:09] heh [00:09] Maybe using ssh's tunnel implementation? Depends if ssh tears down the tun0... [00:10] But in this case, the ssh connection is automatically restarted and the database reconnects [00:11] (and by automatically, I mean it's wrapped in a while() loop. Not idea... and soon to be replaced with a vpn) [00:11] how are you replicating? [00:11] like, just scp or rsync over ssh or ... ? [00:12] portforward of the other server over ssh, and then whatever replication utilities it has [00:14] oh, i missed where you were referring to db replication [00:14] That's what she said!! [00:15] BryceBot: no [00:15] Oh, okay... I'm sorry. 'oh, i missed where you were referring to db replication' [00:15] heh [00:15] (and I can't get into details) [00:39] mercutio: I just do 'git init' in /etc and put in files that i feel are relevant to the box. I don't add every file like etckeeper does [00:50] up_the_irons: just to keep it short? [00:51] ahh are you using git locally rather than remotely? [00:51] (git is inherently local in the first place :p) [00:52] heh [00:52] that's actually pretty easy to start doing i suppose [00:53] oh but then .git is world readable [00:54] * mercutio wonders if chmod o-rx will break anything [00:56] It's just file-level stuff, so as long as your user (root) has permissions to modify/create/delete/lick/sniff/kick/etc files in .git, you're good. chmod away. [00:56] yeah it seems fine so far. [01:04] C++ was not meant to be compiled on a sparc64. :/ [01:04] i hope you're not using gcc [01:05] Sadly, this app does [01:05] gcc isn't very optimised for sparc. [01:05] if it's self-compiled it'll be even worse i imagine. [01:05] then again, gcc is what openbsd uses anyways [01:05] but big, ugly c++ project... so many includes [01:05] either you don't care about performance of the compiled code, so use clang which is faster at compiling and gives better error messsages, or use the solaris c compiler. [01:06] I don't see how I could run the solaris compiler on openbsd :p [01:06] oh. [01:06] (also, not my project/application) [01:06] yeah openbsd on sparc was hell slow when i tried it [01:06] mind you it was a slow sparc. [01:06] heh [01:07] actually aren't all sparcs slow? [01:07] That's what she said!! [01:07] this is 650MHz which is decent. But it is an old IDE drive too. [01:07] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_Blade_(workstation) Sun Blade 150 [01:07] Sun Blade (workstation) :: The Sun Blade series was a computer workstation line developed and sold by Sun Microsystems from 2000 to 2006. The Sun Blade architecture was based on the UltraSPARC microprocessor family. The range replaced the earlier Sun Ultra workstation series. The 1500/2500 series came in two variants, the earlier "red" series, and the later "silver" series. The "silver" series were enhanced versions of the "red" series - a faste [01:08] yeah so still ancient [01:08] probably 1/10th or less of the speed of a modern pc. [01:08] At least it's this side of the century [01:09] what are you doing with it? [01:09] Mostly, nothing. [01:09] I just have a thing for "retro" hardware [01:09] and openbsd [01:09] heh so do i [01:10] It works out pretty well [01:10] Just need me a vax... >.> [01:10] oh god you want to see slow, try an amiga :) [01:10] <.< [01:10] i have an amiga ... with 68030 @ 50 mhz... and mmu .. [01:11] openbsd was discontinued on amiga, but you can run older versions [01:11] i think netbsd still supports amiga [01:11] i can't even remember what i have on it, but i had one :) [01:11] That's not to far from my old PowerMac 7100 and 7200, 65 and 90MHz resp. [01:11] That's what she said!! [01:11] i just need to reorganise my room to make spaec for it [01:11] (both old ppc601's) [01:12] that's way faster than 68030 [01:12] 68040 is way faster than 68030 [01:12] basically instruction/data cache stuff went up heaps [01:12] which really helped "unoptimised" code. [01:12] heh [01:12] or repetitve code. [01:12] you can get pretty good performance out of 68030 if you try [01:13] but no-one tries much anymore :) [01:13] but yeah, that's basically when people started switching from optimised assembler to c [01:14] and from lookup tables to real time calculation [01:17] now linux patches to save 16k of ram as kernel option are being rejected.. [01:19] speaking of retro hardware, the biggest problem seems to be things like going from scsi to something recent. [01:20] so you're stuck with old noisy hard-disks etc unless you want to spead heaps on convertors. [01:20] ide at least you have some options. [01:20] my amiga is using compact flash. [01:23] s/spead/spend/ [01:23] so you're stuck with old noisy hard-disks etc unless you want to spend heaps on convertors. [01:26] The problem isn't being stuck with old/loud/etc, it's finding replacements [01:26] In one case, it's finding an oooold, compatible scsi drive. [01:26] i have old scsi drives, but tehy're SCA [01:27] so probably wouldn't help you [01:27] searching 'scsi' brings up craploads of "ultrascsi" results. It's next to impossible to search for plain old scsi [01:27] besides i'm ages away. [01:27] 50 pin is hard yeah. [01:27] you can get 68 to 50 pin convertors. [01:27] 80 pin to 50 pin is harder. [01:27] My complaint is primarily to do with overlapping terminology [01:27] oh huh [01:27] i'm sure it was harder before [01:27] http://www.ebay.com/itm/Convert-SCA-80-Pin-Hard-Drive-Interface-to-SCSI-IDC-50-Pin-Connector-/361068897384?pt=UK_Computing_Drive_Cables_Adapters&hash=item5411622468 [01:28] sca hard-drives are all over the place. [01:30] http://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-PROLIANT-DL380-G3-73GB-ULTRA320-15K-SCSI-HOT-PLUG-HARD-DRIVE-/171632832969?pt=US_Internal_Hard_Disk_Drives&hash=item27f61d31c9 [01:30] like there for example [01:30] haha i think my old powermacs would shit themselves if they saw anything more than a GB [01:32] not necessarily [01:32] I didn't mean literally, or that there was a technological limitation [01:32] oh right [01:33] amigas have 4gb boot limitation iirc [01:33] it may be 1gb though [01:33] *Just "here's a computer from a time when 500MB drives were only just hitting the market, 73GB is like whoa") [01:33] ( [01:33] anyways, 'night [01:33] ok [01:34] yeah you may want to use alternative filesystem [01:57] mercutio: you do 'sudo git init --shared=group' [01:57] then adjust perms to your liking [02:07] mercutio: Rewinding to about 24 hours ago, /etc with git is normally just a matter of installing etckeeper and ignoring it until you want to be able to see a diff to an old version [02:09] etckeeper hooks into the package manager on Debian-oid distros (and probaly on other platforms too), so any time a file in /etc is changed from a package update, the commit message says exactly why. And manually edited files are commited in a daily cron job with a generic commit message, but you can do a git commit manually if you want [02:45] now that is cool [02:45] i wonder if it can do that on arch linux [04:32] *** mnathani__ has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [04:33] *** mnathani_ has joined #arpnetworks [06:10] *** Seji has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer) [06:12] *** Seji has joined #arpnetworks [10:27] *** mkb has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) [10:33] *** mkb has joined #arpnetworks [11:43] *** anis is now known as anisfarhana [11:44] *** anisfarhana has quit IRC (Changing host) [11:44] *** anisfarhana has joined #arpnetworks [11:54] Hello. [11:57] Hate to know I have to terminate my account with arpnetworks soon. [12:00] why? leaving the computer industry? :) [12:06] Should i leave the computer industry? [12:07] The funder/sponsor for the account decided not to continue it. [12:16] oh [12:23] are you a student? [12:24] cuz frankly, $20/month just to have a high-quality server here is pocket chnge. [12:35] I am not a student. [12:42] still not sure why you'd have to go away. Just get another server. [12:43] You probably don't get me. Again..english is my issue here :/ [12:44] yes, I'm trying to understand. [12:44] you say you hate to leave. [12:44] what is making you leave? [12:44] if you want to stay, get a server [12:45] Funder stop paying the server --> I'm losing the server ---> Can't afford to continue it using my own pocket money. [12:45] so you're unemployed, or a student? [12:55] I am working sir. [12:55] Was helping the guy who paid the server before on something. [12:56] You probably will tell me "Its just $20 per month for the server", and yet still I can't afford it even I am working here. [12:57] $20 and convert to currency here is really not good, in term of currency exchange. [12:57] You got me? [13:08] OK. Where are you? [13:11] .my [13:12] ahh. cost of living quite different. [13:12] I wonder where .my is on the big mac scale though [13:13] ahh. 50% below the US [13:13] so you make less, and pay more for what you have, relative to the US [13:51] but they probably dont' eat big mac's there. [13:51] (for the most part) [13:54] anis: have you been to mccurry? [13:59] still called big mac scale [14:00] currency converted to dollars divided by cost of big mac converted to dollars [14:00] is it standardised across the world? [14:00] like it seems they're using halal meat there (inhumane killing)_ [14:01] but i don't think the costs of meat, etc is teh same around the world? [14:03] it's relative purchasing power, so that makes sense [14:03] think of it as a tiny consumer-price-index foodbasket [14:04] so india is $1.89 US, i don't think many indians would be buying a lot of big macs? [14:04] which can raise prices a bit. [14:05] sure. it's just a back-of-envelope measure. Not To Be Used For Real Work. [14:05] http://www.economist.com/content/big-mac-index [14:05] i was reading this though :) [14:06] i found singapore, where's malaysia? [14:10] wikipedia probably knows [14:11] and google maps [14:11] @wa Where is Malaysia? [14:11] Malaysia->location [14:11] wow, thanks Wolfram [14:11] was that literal as in "where on earth is malaysia"? or was it "where is malaysia in this list"? [14:11] just dereference it [14:11] oh i meant for google food [14:11] err big mac [14:12] hahahaha [14:12] @wa latitude and longitude of malaysia [14:12] Malaysia->center coordinates;2° 30\'N, 112° 30\'E [14:12] http://www.statista.com/statistics/274326/big-mac-index-global-prices-for-a-big-mac/ [14:12] oh it's on here [14:12] malaysia is by singapore [14:12] yep [14:12] yeah [14:12] i couldn't get the site to load for me [14:12] I haven't anywhere near there [14:13] but singapore costs 50% more for big mac's [14:13] relative, or absolute? [14:13] what's the punishment for not finishing your big mac? [14:13] in USD [14:13] because the big mac index is about relative power [14:14] well when it's right next by [14:14] if I live in a country where I make $1000/week, and a big mac costs $1000, then I can eat only one [14:14] it means prices should be "closer" [14:14] if I live in a country where I make $1000/week, and a big mac costs $500, I eat 2 [14:14] if I make 500/week, and big mac 500, then back to 1 [14:14] but if you live in a poor suburb you don't expect to pay 50% more if you eat out in the city? [14:14] the first and the third examples are what the big mac index measures [14:15] the relative purcasing power [14:15] well india seems to have minimum wages starting at like $2 [14:15] and big mac's aren't much less than that. [14:15] That's what she said!! [14:15] err $2/day [14:15] wages => USD, divided by big mac cost => USD [14:15] like it's very cheap to live in cuba, except for the things that they have to import, which is nearly everything. :) [14:16] do they have to import food? [14:16] almost everything yes [14:16] when i hear about poeple going to thailand etc [14:16] they're always like "the food is really cheap and really good" [14:16] but whole meals are cheaper than big mac's :/ [14:17] there is an index somewhere that includes cost of living, food, etc. [14:17] but when i looked at for my own country it seemed cheaper than things usually cost [14:21] i think for VPS's GDP is a better match. [14:22] GDP? is that an ISP? [14:22] Oh, duh [14:22] nah it's the normal index of purchasing power. [14:22] which is just straight power withotu relative things. [14:22] i think malysia is about 1/2 of the US? [14:23] i've got a friend who visited malaysia who seemed to think you could live on about US $200/week there comfortably. [14:24] wow, gdp is even worse than i thought [14:25] it's like 4.5x the GDP of Singapore compared to Malaysia per capita. [14:53] *** mnathani_ has quit IRC () [15:04] wow, quite long conversation you guys had here. Let me read it. [15:07] Singapore is part of Malaysia long time ago. [15:07] Well thats true mercutio, the cost of living is quite high here.. [15:09] anisfarhana: for some reason i remember him saying how bad the traffic was more than how much things cost for the most part. [15:09] Situation for the Computer Business here is like = 1 field and too many players. [15:09] oh and that he was popular for being white :/ [15:09] Many projects / biz monopoly by those giant company + and got link with the politician ppl you know. [15:10] sounds difficult [15:10] And yes i have been to Mcurry before, once..when i was a student. [15:11] Traffic going terrible here, but at least Kuala Lumpur is not like Jakarta or Manila. [15:11] i think he was in kuala [15:12] More time taken for me to drive to the workplace year by year. [15:12] there was something on slashdot about how traffic is going to get worse and worse in the US [15:12] some government report or something [15:13] but it's pretty obvious around the world that traffic is getting worse everywhere. [15:13] 2-3 Years ago, It was around 30-35 mins only. For this year, its about more less 1 hour [15:13] that's close to off peak vs near-peak here i think. [15:14] i think peak is worse. [15:14] i haven't braved it :) [15:14] Many of supplier / vendors that i know already leaving computer industry :) [15:14] why's that? [15:15] Price competition + Less Profit + More time taken for after sales support [15:16] ahh [15:17] e.g : You selling a laptop for about $50, you margin/profit is around $10, and at the same time, many other company can beat your price by selling it around $48-$45 [15:18] and all of them get the price from the main distro for $40, all same ^^ [15:18] You got me? [15:19] yeah [15:19] i think usually in that situation people shift to selling "services" [15:23] What kind of services for the brand new laptop? Any problem --> go for warranty. [15:24] like fixing peoples computer problems [15:24] eg. Extended Warranty [15:24] doing office tech support for small businesses or such [15:24] Or cloud file storage [15:25] mercutio: Yes something like that, but still, 1 field and many players, looking for only 1 ball :D [15:26] Sounds like a fun cricket match, quite the mental image [15:27] I am tired with all this situation though. [15:28] I am not ranting or not being grateful, just wanna tell you its tiring, [15:29] Less quality IT people + hard to find them here. [15:29] That's what she said!! [15:29] Our HR at office had trouble looking for IT people to assist me until now. [15:30] how come? [15:30] oh [15:30] that's strange :) [15:30] we have a few people from malaysia that come here to do IT work :/ [15:30] Because those geek people already leaving computer industry :D [15:31] or going overseas hah [15:31] mercutio: Actually, I am thinking about for 3-4 years now :) [15:31] Migrating. [15:31] where? [15:32] Most probably UK, but for sure not in London. [15:33] Spoke with few people there, and I also have a relative in UK, they are helpless to help me. [15:34] As i always use teamviewer to help them to solve common problems for Windows hehe [15:34] They already called me a geek [15:34] lol [15:34] * anisfarhana ducks [15:34] heh [15:34] i think everyone in here is a geek :) [15:35] Not me. [15:35] I am a noob. [15:35] you're using irc [15:36] That is because many people told me use IRC if you wanna be successfull gold digger. [15:37] The problem is, my victim still 0 and the time is ticking. Its been 10 years until now. [15:38] maybe you need a new strategy? [15:38] start a web site? [15:40] To be succesfull gold digger? [15:40] Start with a website? [15:40] yeah [15:40] yeah ask for money [15:41] We are in 2015 now and you still talking about a website? [15:41] oh maybe start a reddit thread [15:41] saying how hard things are [15:42] Speaking about a website, I can make money by doing it few years ago. [15:42] lots of people just sell wordpress sites now i think [15:42] You know part time job for some small biz here. [15:43] But in this 2015, website is dead. [15:43] Thanks to Mark Zuckerberg. [15:43] heh [15:43] cms like wp, joomla is dead, or they are going to soon. [15:44] Now, 90% is facebook! [15:44] I even have to open facebook, to find parts for the server! Could you imagine it? [15:44] wow [15:44] Yes it works! [15:44] don't they have sites? [15:44] Its free! People like it! [15:45] You can chat straight away, you can ask straight away, no need to open the page at the web, got question? You dont have to fill that lame fill form anymore in website. [15:45] interesting [15:45] Facebook have all of that in 1 single click sir. [15:46] it's not like that here [15:46] You should start do that sir :) Trust me. [15:46] It works. [15:47] Ohhh..and the most important thing is, it is FREE! :) [15:47] although power companies are getting on facebook now [15:47] You can control and take care of your products with 0 knowledge of IT, you can use your laptop, your ipad, your phone and so on :) [15:48] If you use wordpress, you still have to train people how to use the admin panel, wasting time + cost. [15:49] And sometimes you have to fix the broken script etc etc. People dont care about wp etc etc now. Facebook empowering people and my part time money goes to Mark Zuckerberg now. [15:49] Well played. [15:51] And now, people are getting smart. They really utilise the social apps, selling item online. They even use Instagram to sell it. [15:51] i'm starting to feel old :) [15:51] No rent for the shop, no tax, people dont know you :) [15:51] More profit [15:52] In Malaysia, some local artist got paid for promoting the products in her/his instagram :) [15:52] More followers, more money you will get. [15:52] Smart enough? [15:53] 1: You dont need a company for it, 2: You dont have to pay the tax to the government. [15:53] why no tax? [15:54] Because it is online sir. [15:54] Tell me 1 good reason how government ask you, to pay the tax? [15:54] :D [15:55] By comment on your facebook? your instagram? [15:55] by looking at your bank records? [15:55] * anisfarhana giggles [15:55] Its personal bank accounts, saving accounts :) [15:56] i just kind of assume government watch for large amounts of money going into bank accounts [15:56] maybe that doesn't happen [15:56] Well, i can tell the gov that money was from you, not from the biz :) [15:56] I dont have any biz, do you have any proof that i own the business? [15:57] You just nod down, and walk away. [15:57] hmm [15:57] if everyone evades taxes then the government raises the taxes [15:57] or enforces harder. [15:58] tax isn't always a negative thing [15:58] the online tax stuff is kind of a hot area around the world afiak [15:59] afaik [16:00] People avoid to pay tax to the gov. [16:00] Thats why they go for online business, leaving no trace behind. [16:01] Our former programmer, also leaving IT industry for about ummm...4-5 years now. [16:02] Met him last month, and i think he is millionaire now.. [16:03] Well, he owned 3 shops after quit from being a programmer. [16:03] He asked me to join him at that time, but I dont have faith in his proposed business... [16:03] That was one of my mistake mercutio.. [16:04] that's prudent though. [16:04] these things can be hit and miss. [16:04] you were just unlucky :) [16:05] Unlucky? No. [16:05] I am stupid. [16:05] Because i am a pessimist person. [16:06] You are not wondering what business he do after quit from our company? [16:06] what'd he do? [16:07] He quit the work. Stay at home and he started printing + design business :) [16:08] All online. No marketing people involve. His only marketing department is, Facebook :) [16:09] Of course he is very good in design, and also creative person. He can use photoshop,illustrator etc etc even by closing his eyes ^^ [16:13] Well facebook actually is really good for biz, you spend some $ on it, let it do the marketing, more people asking about your products after that. [16:15] 5 years and have 3 shops, 1 printing factory, control about 30-40% online printing + design here, he even have their own staff running the biz for him. [16:16] Too bad he is married guy when first i met him as programmer. [16:16] Ha ha ha ha [16:26] impressive [16:27] Very :) [16:28] He just make small loan to buy the machines for printing. [16:28] And now, he is zero debt. [16:29] Holiday with family 2-3 days per year. More vacation. [16:29] I think he is 37-38 now, his age. [16:30] While i am still in IRC, keep telling about people story here with more debt everyday. [16:30] Pheww..very bad. [16:32] well it's not too late to do something diff? [16:33] True. [16:33] I should use more strategy, especially in IRC. [16:33] What you think? [16:34] Haha [16:34] i don't think irc is the place to make millions [16:34] I dont want millions. [16:35] I want to have at least $500 in my bank every month before i receive next salary. [16:36] I am not the person 'money is everything'. [16:36] Money can make you happy, money also can bring disaster to your life. [16:37] yeah [16:37] So you said here, some Malaysian working with you there? and here is NZ? [16:37] it'd feel weird being way richer than everyone else [16:37] i live in nz right [16:37] i've come across a few chinese malaysians [16:39] but not straight malaysians? [16:39] Most of 'players', 80%-90% in Malaysia control the economy is malaysian chinese. [16:40] They are good in doing the business. [16:40] are you malaysian chinese? [16:40] Well..chinese :D What do you expect then? [16:40] All items Made in China now [16:40] * anisfarhana ducks [16:40] hahaha [16:41] mercutio: Are you? [16:41] no [16:42] and you know in Malaysia, we are multi-race right? [16:42] yeah [16:43] We have Malay,Chinese,Indian (majority) [16:43] lots of indians here are from fiji [16:43] it's weird how these things work out :) [16:43] 3 races are majority here. But Malay up to 60% here i think [16:44] yeah the malays may leave less often? [16:44] like most americans we see here aren't african americans. [16:44] That's what she said!! [16:44]